A while back, I remember a thread about people suddenly having problems using ATM cards that weren't also debit cards in parts of Europe. I have two of these cards. I can't find the thread now, but am wondering if anyone has encountered this in Germany or Austria? (I do have a 4 digit pin and have used the cards overseas before.)

I had absolutely no problems in Austria last summer.

I have not encountered this problem in Germany or Austria, but it's been several years since my last visit to those countries. In the last 2 years I was in France and Belgium and was unable to use my non-debit ATM card. I only tried it to see if it would work, and it didn't. Fortunately, I had my Visa debit card and it worked perfectly.

P_M may have a point. Our ATM card is also our bank's Visa card, but I forget about it because I never use it as a debit/credit card. Rumor has it that you need the Visa tie-in for trouble free withdrawals even though the withdrawals are not credit card withdrawals.

I believe it was Patrick who said some bank told him that there was a countrywide monopoly by VISA in Belgium or something and that no card would work in an ATM there that was not part of a VISA network. I think that was only in Belgium and then perhaps Italy.

I don't know as I haven't tried it in those countries. I have a regular ATM card that is NOT a debit card and have had no problem at all using it in Europe within the past year in several countries, including France. I used it extensively in France as recently as August 2004.

Thank you for your responses. I also had no luck using my cards in Belgium 2 years ago, but they worked in Holland and France, so I didn't realize that was the problem. I hate to switch to a debit card if I don't have to.

Do you have to switch? I have both. Ask your bank if it has to be one or another.

I think our choice was either a plain ATM card (which they were reluctant to give) or an ATM/debit card.

Christina is right. I was the one who found out that all banks in Belgium (and believe me we tried most of them until an officer in one told us this) have ATMs that will only take an ATM/debit card. My ATM only card without a Visa symbol would not work there at all. Then this past summer for the first time ever I ran into the same problem, but only a couple of isolated times. Once was at Deutsche Bank in Rome where a teller told me he knew what the problem was. That VISA services now handles all Deutsche Bank international ATM currency transactions, so that if a card is ATM only and has no credit card/debit symbol with it, it will not work.

Not sure how many banks that is true with -- but it is a NEW problem, as it had only been happening at that bank for a few weeks and he knew it was because of their recent switch in how the ATM withdrawals were being handled.

Meanwhile my own BofA officer has changed my ATM only card back to an ATM/debit one, assuring me there is NO danger with such a card. That no one can deplete my account even if they get hold of my card and pin somehow.

Thanks for the info, Patrick. I don't have credit card symbols on either card, so maybe I'll have to cave and change at least one of them. We would have been in big trouble when we were in Belgium if we hadn't brought along backup travelers checks.

Last time I was in Germany we had no trouble using a palin ATM card with a four digit pin #. The one issue that I did have was that the money had to be based in a checking account, I could not access the money in a savings account.