Si not oui in France?
Sep 13th, 2007, 07:47 AM
#1
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Si not oui in France?
Yesterday I watched the rather fun French film "Moliere" about the playwright. It is of course in French with English subtitles. There was one thing that struck me as odd. There were a couple of sequences of short dialogue where one character was responding yes several times. But the actors were clearly saying "si" and not "oui". No, they weren't supposed to be Italian or Spanish characters. Is there a reason for this? At other times the word "oui" was clearly used for yes. Just curious.
The play does take place in the late 17th Century if that makes a difference.
The play does take place in the late 17th Century if that makes a difference.
Sep 13th, 2007, 07:52 AM
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'Si' is what the grammar books say you ought to say - and should still say today - for 'oui' if the context would expect the answer "non".
As in "PalQ's not posted many sensible questions lately, has he?" "Mais si: there was one in July"
As in "PalQ's not posted many sensible questions lately, has he?" "Mais si: there was one in July"
Sep 13th, 2007, 07:54 AM
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Can't tell you much other than that "si" is still used at times in place of "oui." I noticed my friends who live near Lyon using it on my last visit. Their only explanation is that they mean the same thing, and they are both used. Perhaps it's regional?
Sep 13th, 2007, 07:55 AM
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Ah, or maybe if the questions asked are all in that "negative" context. Now that I think about it, they might have been -- like "He isn't going to marry her is he?"
Si.
Si.
Sep 13th, 2007, 07:56 AM
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The positive response to a negative question or declaration is 'si' rather than 'oui'.
Vous ne parlez pas francais? Si, un peu'
I must admit I don't remember ever learning this, and still have difficulty remembering. But that's what you are meant to say.
Vous ne parlez pas francais? Si, un peu'
I must admit I don't remember ever learning this, and still have difficulty remembering. But that's what you are meant to say.
Sep 13th, 2007, 07:57 AM
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I'm pondering this...I have heard it in recent movies and conversation.
I'd say that it may mirror the english equivalent of "of course versus yes"...e.g. is your foie gras the best in Paris? "Mais si,monsieur!"
I'd say that it may mirror the english equivalent of "of course versus yes"...e.g. is your foie gras the best in Paris? "Mais si,monsieur!"
Sep 13th, 2007, 08:07 AM
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"I'd say that it may mirror the english equivalent of "of course versus yes"...e.g. is your foie gras the best in Paris? "Mais si,monsieur!""
According to the French grammar that was beaten into me at school, this is simply incorrect.
Wikipedia may or may not get it right - but it coresponds precisely to what I was taught:
"[Si] is used to contradict negative statements or respond to negative questions"
According to the French grammar that was beaten into me at school, this is simply incorrect.
Wikipedia may or may not get it right - but it coresponds precisely to what I was taught:
"[Si] is used to contradict negative statements or respond to negative questions"
Sep 13th, 2007, 08:37 AM
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HI NP,
MFK Fisher wrote about learning when to use "si" instead of "oui" some years ago.
AFAIK, it is the positive response to a negative question.
>I ask "Je peut m'assoir ici?" The waiter answers .. "Mais oui, monsieur".
OTOH, I think that if you ask, "Je ne peut pas m'assoir ici?, the answer would be "Si".
"Peux-je fumer?" Oui or non
"Fumer est défendu?" Si or non
(I hope I have it right.)
MFK Fisher wrote about learning when to use "si" instead of "oui" some years ago.
AFAIK, it is the positive response to a negative question.
>I ask "Je peut m'assoir ici?" The waiter answers .. "Mais oui, monsieur".
OTOH, I think that if you ask, "Je ne peut pas m'assoir ici?, the answer would be "Si".
"Peux-je fumer?" Oui or non
"Fumer est défendu?" Si or non
(I hope I have it right.)
Sep 13th, 2007, 09:19 AM
#19
For those wondering if their French is really fluent, spontaneously saying 'si' to a negative question is an excellent test of whether or not the language has really been absorbed.
"Vous parlez très bien le français. Ne me dites pas que vous êtes américain."
"Mais si!"
"Vous parlez très bien le français. Ne me dites pas que vous êtes américain."
"Mais si!"
