planningtravel

Have a chance to visit France on an upcoming trip and I'm interested in some cities that I'd not on previous trips. TI'm interested in visiting Lyon, Dijon, Beaune, Strasbourg, Marsaille, Avignon and Geneva, Switzerland.

This is the itinerary I have drafted and I'd like feedback on whether it's doable or needs to be changed.

Day 1, arrive Lyon (late at night), travel to hotel.

Day 2, explore Lyon

Day 3, day trip to Geneva by train

Day 4, day trip to Marsaille and Avignon by train. I've been to Avignon but never been to Marsaille. I've read mainly negative comments on the later so I'd skipped it last time I was in this part of the France. I was thinking of head to Marsaille for the morning and exploring the Old Port area then heading to Avignon in the early afternoon. In order to save time, I'd grab a meal to go and eat it on the train when travelling to Avignon. I found Avignon to be charming but small. I was going to stroll around then head back to Lyon in the evening. What time do things close in Avignon? Is Marsaille and Avignon in a day realistic?

Day 5, explore Lyon.

Day 6, Lyon to Dijon, stay overnight in Dijon or make a day trip from Lyon. Which is best? I'm thinking a day trip would be better as my next destination is Strasbourg and I get better connections (and fares) from Lyon. Either way, this is a Saturday and some things might be closed. I am also interested in short visit to Beaune from Dijon.

Day 7, Dijon or Lyon (depending on whether I visit Dijon as a day trip or stay overnight) to Strasbourg. This will be a Sunday.

Day 8, Strasbourg . Unfortunately, I'll be there on a Monday. I understand in France some attractions are closed on Mondays.

Day 9, depart Strasbourg.

How does this itinerary look? I'd like suggestions on how to improve it and whether Dijon is best as a day trip or an overnight stop. What changes can I make to improve the itinerary?

Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

PalenQ

I'd base also in say Beaune or Dijon - can't do Dijon and Beaune both in same day trip and do justice - anyway try to catch non-TGV trains as they have a fairly flat fare structure so no need to buy in advance and lock yourself in. And there is the France Railpass that may interest you too - anyways for lots of great stuff on French trains - check www.seat61.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com.

Regional or non-TGV trains rarely require reservations so you can just hop on any train with a valid ticket - don't forget to validate - cancel your ticket in the cancelling machines trackside or if not your ticket will be invalid and you may be fined.

thursdaysd

Looks nuts to me, but only you can decide whether you're willing to do it - AFTER you check the train schedules at bahn.de or sncf.fr.

Christina

I guess it's okay, it does sound like you should stay in Dijon on that part of the trip.

What mainly negative things have you been reading about Marseille? I'm just curious as I enjoyed it and found it an interesting city. It is a city, though and electic. But it depends what you want to do. Exploring the port area sure won't take more than half a day, if that, whatever that means. Not a lot right around that port itself, unless you mean really going nearby a ways. I can't imagine just walking around the port for 3-4 hours. Marseille has some good museums and parks. I guess you won't be going up to Notre Dame de la Garde or taking a boat out to that island. the Beaux Arts museum is kind of far out in a nice park, but are you going to explore Le Panier, the old quarter which is right near the port? see http://travel.michelin.com/web/desti..._old_Marseille

In any case, it's your call depending what you are looking for and what you think is bad about Marseille. But no, I don't think you can do both Marseille and Avignon in one day. Well, if course you can, but why the rush, you won't see much. Things don't close in Avignon until very late if you mean cafes, etc, same as anywhere. A lot of the "tourist sites" there are outdoors IMO, but the Palais des Papes is open until 8 pm. My favorite site in Avignon is actually the Petit Palais museum, it's only open until 6, which isn't unusual for a museum. And closed Tuesday.

Not sure I have much concrete advice, I'd not visit both Avignon and Marseille in one day. I'd probably stay in Dijon (a city I like) and visit Beaune from there, but not sure you have enough time to do that. YOu are only there one day, anyway, looks like.

You are trying to see a lot, that's for sure, staying in Lyon or Dijon is your call, you could do either. But since you are spending an earlier day in Lyon, I'd probably pick Dijon rather than going back just to take a day trip to Dijon but I don't know the logistic issues you mention.

I'm more a slow traveler, so hard to advise. I wouldn't pack so many major cities into a day trip. One, sure, while based in another city, but you are moving around about every day and visiting major cities on all of them.

A lot of museums, etc. are closed on either Monday or Tuesday in France. This is true in other countries, also it's the slow days.

planningtravel

Thank you for the feedback.

I'm flexible with my itinerary at this time and would like to know how I can improve it.

I'd thought that prebooked TGV tickets are the best option for this trip. I had looked at train schedules online before I drafted this itinerary.

I'd considered a French Rail Pass, but I understand that I need to pay extra for a reservation on the TGV and there is a certain allotment of TGV seats for rail pass holders. Once those are gone I'm out of luck.

The day which concerned me the most was the Lyon - Marseille - Avignon day trip. Based on the replies, I may have to choose one or the other. I don't mind buying a Lyon to Marseille ticket and an Avignon to Lyon ticket. But wanted to keep myself a little flexible as to when I'd travel from Marseille to Avignon. Trains are hourly, so there are plenty of times to choose from. What kind of ticket should I look at for this journey if I travel on Regional trains.

Marseille gets a bad rap on many travel forums. I didn't think of spending time in museums, and realize that I could be making a mistake.

I won't attempt Dijon and Beaune in one day. I'm inclined to stay overnight in Dijon and maybe visit Beaune the following day (day 8 in the itinerary posted in the op). That way, I'd travel to Strasbourg in the evening. However, this will be on Sunday and I'm not sure if things will be closed in Beaune.

On this trip, I know where I'd like to go, which are the places I've listed in the op. I'm not 100% sure how to go about visiting these places and perfecting my itinerary.

PalenQ

I'd considered a French Rail Pass, but I understand that I need to pay extra for a reservation on the TGV and there is a certain allotment of TGV seats for rail pass holders. Once those are gone I'm out of luck.>

Yews but only IME on the Nice-Avignon-Paris line and you could make that reservation when booking your pass as a condition of buying the pass - the other trips are mainly on regional trains you just hop on.

But the reservation requirement and quotas are a hassle if you want to wait till France to book ythe TGV train.

neckervd

TER trains Lyon - Dijon stop at Beaune before arriving at Dijon. There is no need to go to first to Dijon and to backtrack then to Beaune.
Dijon - Strasbourg: 2 1/4 hrs by direct TGV.

planningtravel

Thank you for the replies.

I've reworked my itinerary and I'm looking at visiting the same places but ending in Geneva instead of Strasbourg.

Here's a link to the thread I started with the new itinerary:-
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...ary-critic.cfm