Everybody!
Very much Thank you for all your responses!
We will NOT rent a car in LA. Last time we managed to get along without a car too, so why not this time.
We will walk around Fairfax and shop until we drop. We visited Farmers market last time, for about 1 hour. That is not enough. We didn´t see anything of Melrose and all that area. So I think, with the jet-lag and all, that you can survive 4 days in LA without a car.
Last time we stayed in Beverly Hills, that´s why we are looking for another place this time.
"A little bit of the town every visit"
We´ve seen Hollywood (not so much), Hollywood Bowl, Disneyland, Universal, Santa Monica (with pier and all), Rodeo Drive (we lived near by) and so on.
It was stressing to do a lot in just a week. For exampel Disneyland and the next day Universal....that was too much!!
So, this time we will stroll around with no hurry.
Thanks again.

Don't forget Hearst Castle!

Mona,

Don'y beleive these people that keep singing the praises of San Francisco. There is so much more to California than SF. I would personally focus more time in LA and San Diego for the big city experience and then enjoy the natural beauty of California ie: Montery/Carmel, Big Sur, Yosemite, and Lake Tahoe. Many people on this board have extremely biased opinions of how nice a city San Francisco is, but I fail to see what all the hype is about. Until they clean up that town, I would not recommend going there.

Mona, it seems you've seen a lot of LA, at least the "touristy" parts. If you really don't want to rent a car, and just want to stroll around, may I suggest the South Bay?

The three main beaches (Redondo, Hermosa, and Manhattan) all have great restaurants to offer. The shopping isn't nearly as extensive as Beverly Hills, Melrose etc (not by a long shot!) but there are boutiques, etc. There's also a small mall in Manhattan Beach, and two larger malls, Galleria at South Bay (North Redondo) and Del Amo (Torrance) which are about a 10-15 minute cab ride away from any of the three beaches.

If you're coming during the summer, it will be the perfect time to visit this area. It isn't as touristy, and you'll see lots of locals hanging out (and some of the most beautiful people you've ever seen!). Best of all, it's pretty close to the airport. Manhattan Beach is about 10 minutes local driving from the airport. Hermosa another 10 minutes south, and Redondo a few more minutes south. It should not cost you any more than $30 cabfare to get to anywhere in the three beach towns.

Manhattan Beach is considered the most affluent of the three beach towns. Redondo Beach is large, and some parts are not as "posh" (North Redondo isn't really considered beachy"

If you stay close to the beach (recommended) in any of the three, you really won't need a car. You can walk and take cabs. I rollerblade from the edge of hermosa to the edge of manhattan all the time...takes only 20-25 minutes. Redondo Beach will be your best bet for something reasonable. There is lodging on the beach in Hermosa as well, but nothing will be really cheap in the summer.

If you think you might want to stay in this area (I grew up here) feel free to shoot me an email.

Have a great trip.

Mina!
Thank´s! It sounds great!
I must talk it thru with my travelling-companion. I´ll mail you if we deside to go there, ok.

Mina,
What a great recommendation for Mona! I would not have thought of that area myself, but you are right on with your comments.
sharon

One more thing to consider: the Coast Starlight train from Los Angeles northward. If you took it to Santa Barbara, for instance, you'd have the 4-hour or so experience of riding (a wonderful, first-class train) right along the Pacific shore. It's much closer to the shore than the highway and almost has the feel of being on a cruise ship, because you are looking down at the water - with gulls flying below...You could do a search here; there have been past threads. The train runs all the way up to Seattle, with stops along the way...But the Santa Barbara stop would put you in the neighborhood of Hearst Castle, and you could rent your car for travel from there....

Mona, I'll second the recommendation for Manhattan Beach. It's a world away from Melrose, but a true southern California experience. You can take a cab from the airport, or the hotel you choose might even have a shuttle. There are a number of hotels in Manhattan and Hermosa Beach that are not *on* the beach but walking distance a few blocks. Many fun restaurants and shopping, plus, as Mina suggested, you can rollerblade or rent bikes and ride up and down the beach areas. No need for a car. Definitely bring the bathing suit and sunscreen!

Arjay's idea is a great one too. If you want to avoid doing the driving, the Coast Starlight train might be a good option. I'd imagine you can get off and spend the night in various towns on the way up, then just catch the train the next day, if you like. Check out Amtrak's website. Santa Barbara would be a good place to spend a day or two.

No problem Mona, just let me know. My email address is a valid one.

Sharon, a lot of "LA people" don't come down this way, which is why is seems to me a locals hangout. But it really is a great area...I would never leave!

Mona, I forgot to mention one thing (another post reminded me).

I don't know when you're getting here, but June and July are "June Gloom" months. The fog rolls in, and it's overcast most of the day until about 3pm. This stinks if you're near the beach. By August, it should be OK (although last year, June Gloom seemed to last all summer). By Sept/Oct, you should be in the clear (pun intended).

San Francisco may be the worst cities in America, but too many of its residents are lost in such a haze of self-righteous entitlement and aggrieved internecine warfare that they don't even seem to know it. And the things that are wrong with San Francisco were so many years, so many decades, in the making.

The local transportation system is a scandal. In Chicago one zooms around by car, "el" and cab. In San Francisco, one never zooms, anywhere, by any means. The city's bus and subway network, called Muni, is the thalidomide baby of transportation systems. As far as I can determine from the reporting on it, it's
been run by incompetents for more than 20 years. The fares are about the cheapest of any major city -- only a dollar. But any politician who suggested raising fares to help the system would get laughed out of town. If you talk about curbing peoples' antisocial behavior in San Francisco, you get tagged as a Giuliani. But it's actually a fundamental quality-of-life issue for the city's weakest and mostdefenseless people. Bus drivers are too busy snarling to attempt to enforce decent behavior on the buses. Those who try get
threatened and attacked. And when thugs are threatening other passengers, it drives all but the most desperate away.

Cabs aren't the answer because there hardly are any. In most of the city you can't depend on getting one before 9 p.m. on non-weekend nights. I'm always struck by the crowds of tourists lined up outside pricey hotels and restaurants, wanly waiting for a cab. They're probably so caught up in the romance of the city that they don't think about how pathetic it is that they have to spend an hour waiting for a ride back to their overpriced hotel.

The homeless are considered a mark of pride here that the city does not harass the homeless. The trouble with this is that the city does nothing to help them, either. The result is an ongoing human
tragedy of epic proportions. On Haight Street, on a given Saturday,you can see dozens of teenagers and those in their 20s, fried out of their skulls, systematically killing themselves and each other. A large portion of the other homeless you see on the street are
obviously victims of substance abuse of one form or another. San Franciscans view this as a laudable example of their tolerance. But for the addicted, this sort of tolerance is not so much freedom as a trap. Most San Franciscans like political positions that remove from
them the responsibility to actually do something about a particular issue. The city's homeless policies coincide nicely with this tendency.

In terms of the cultural scene, I could never quite figure out why San Francisco is considered a cultural center. The theater scene here, particularly the mainstream commercial fare, is undistinguished. (The one superior theater company is the Berkeley Repertory, across the bay.) The music scene, save for a few underground turntablists, is unnotable. The symphony and opera are considered only decent, the museums less so. The architecture is the visual equivalent of fingernails scraping across the blackboard of the horizon, a panorama of boxy columns and clumsy attempts at attention-getting. This, too, is an effect that took decades to accomplish.

Geez, xyz, give it a rest. Do you really have the time to post such lengthy diatrabes on every single thread that has anything to do with California today? Or are you just cutting and pasting over and over? Mona has already heard all of this.

Incidentally, I had a fun evening in SF last night. I walked with my friend from her apartment in the Nob Hill area to the Great American Music Hall near Van Ness and heard some great music from one of my favorite bands. Then walked back up, up, up the hill. My legs are feeling it today!

To paraphrase Bono, San Francisco, like all cities has it's good and it has it's bad. I prefer to see the glass half-full. Adjust your attitude, xyz!

Everybody!

Yes, Everybody!
That was a short note!!
My fingers slipped.
Ok, We´ll be in LA in april I think.
And yes I heard all negative things about San Fran allready. But I´ll go there anyway.
The train-thing sounds nice. That way we will avoid the traffic in LA. I think it is easier to drive from Santa Barbara, or is it?
Maybe we´ll stay both in LA and at the places you, Mina, suggested. Thanks again. I think we will have a lovely trip....thank´s to you all that has helped us.

One more suggestion, Mona: If you really want to see some great beauty (much more so than Manhattan, Hermosa or Redondo), spend some time in the Laguna Beach area which is also a WONDERFUL walking town as well (shops, galleries, restaurants, etc.)! As a matter of fact, you could fly into the John Wayne Airport in Orange County, stay in Laguna and then start your trip up the coast from there (marvelous scenery)!! Don't forget to post a trip report upon your return!

U need a psychiatrist equipped to know what to do with IDIOT travelers, MONA!!!@!!! Stay home. San Franciso doesn't want complete ugly, FAT, fags like you. U will be chargeed$1,000.000.000 for any luggage you carry. Why, because you're too STUPID to know how to POST!!! jesus, get a clue.

Farmer's Daughter is not a nice hotel, but it is near a shopping center and close to Hollywood. I would suggest using Priceline to get a nicer hotel and request areas such as Santa Monica, Century City, and Beverly Hills.

As far as San Francisco, it is a great city to see. I would suggest Union Square or Fisherman's Wharf. Do not stay in the Mission. Again, I suggest using Priceline. I got a Radisson Hotel in Fisherman's Wharf across from the bay and Pier 39 for $45 a night.

Good luck!

Mona

Don't pay any attention to drlaura. This person only types nasty messages to "shock" people. This is someone with no life and no personality. We call them "Trolls".

Ok, I would like to see drlaura post something in finnish or swedish! Please do that so that I can make some ugly,fat and stupid comments about you!
And remember, it MUST be correct.

It's amazing reading this thread. I must say that the people on the Europe forum are a much nicer bunch thatn this one!!

Go visit SF if you've never been there before. Take your time and walk around town. There is much to see. You don't need a car there. If you have time, a drive up the Pacific Coast Highway is a must. WE did that a few years back and still talking about it. It's wonderful and not to be missed!! Unless you drive like a crazy person, you should do nicely on the coastal highway.

With 3 weeks you have plenty of time to visit so many places, Choose carefully and plan well. We stayed at the Travelodge at Fisherman's Wharf. Nice hotel within walking distance to Ghirardelli Square and buses stops outside the hotel. THey have a small parking aread within the hotel and it's free (rare in SF). Check out Muir Woods and Sausalito.