Since January 1 this year, Continental Presidents Club members are no longer permitted to use all Continental affiliated lounges throughtout the world. I have been trying to deal with it directly since Easter when I was not permitted to enter the affiliated lounge in Tokyo Terminal 2.

The affiliated lounge there is the JAL lounge where Continental Business class passengers are invited. The situation is similar in many other markets throughout the world of Continental.

I hope Presidents Club members will raise this issue with Houston.

Address your comments to:

Mr. Larry Kellner, Chairman, CEO
Continental Airlines
1600 Smith Street
HQSEO
Houston Tx 77002

You may want to copy the president of Continental
Mr. Jeffery Smisek
at the same address.

President Club membership and access is never the same as BusinessFirst access. In many markets, they use different clubs.

In Tokyo, PC members can always use the NW club. They may use other lounges for BF passengers.

The two are seperate.

BTW, I understand that the NW Worldclubs are over at Terminal 1, while CO uses T2. But NRT is consolidating the three alliance members to same areas, so soon NW and CO should be in the same terminal.

rkkwan, on December 31 last year, PClub members had access to all lounges where Business class passengers had access as, like now, they were affiliated with CO.

This affects CO Platinum mebers also, as there is no Skyteam lounge in Terminal 2, despite CO and DL flying from there.

As you pointed out, it is physically impossible to use the NW lounge when departing terminal 2.

DL Crown rooms did the same thing, BTW.

ContPlat - Try posting this on the CO forum at flyertalk.com. Someone there may give you the reasons why. Also, there's a high-level CO official ( "CO Insider" ) who responds to some inquiries there.

Thanks.

FlyerTalk doesn't seem to have a Presidents Club forum - just OnePass and SkyTeam. While SkyTeam Elite Plus members should be concerned as they are not able to use a loounge when departing or transitting Narita terminal 2, it is mostly a PClub issue.

Any additional suggestions?

Just post it in the CO Onepass forum there! Everything about CO is discussed, and IMHO, that's the single most effective way to get your voice heard adn question answered, unless you personally know the CO high officials.

Are you certain about the prior access, ContPlat? I ask because in the past it was always the case that I was not able to access affiliated clubs (e.g., CDG) based on my PC membership - but could do so when flying BizFirst or with SkyTeam platinum elite status regardless of class of service.

Seamus,

Prior to 1/1/06, if you were flying CO economy, as a presidents club member you were supposed to be able to access the same lounge as the Business class passengers.

My "foreign" CO location is Narita 2. When I fly to or through CDG, it's on AF and I must use Elite Plus status, but even then, the Air France personnel were not exactly current!

BTW the argument CO is using is that they can change the Presidents club relationship whatever way they want without agreement or even notice to the members.

My position is that, while CO has wide latitude, they do not have the right to exclude Presidents club members from any club run by Continental or affiliated with it (subject to the "flying CO" restriction).

What they have done here is to unilaterally exclude presidents club members from affiliated clubs that continue to show the Continental monogram outside the club.

I forgot to mention that Delta Crown Room has done the same thing. However, I am not a Delta Crown Room member.

I hope that DL CR members will write to Delta and complain.

My position is that, while CO has wide latitude, they do not have the right to exclude Presidents club members from any club run by Continental or affiliated with it (subject to the "flying CO" restriction).

Sorry, but you don't run CO or PC, and they do have the right.

As we've explained over and over again, access of PC members and BF members to clubs are different matter. Things can, and will, always changed.

If you buy your PC membership mainly based on using the JAL club, then I suggest you just cancel your membership and ask for a refund. Join the JAL club instead.

So, rkkwan, you would be comfortable with CO changing the name of all their clubs in June and denying access to existing PClub members from that point?

Hey, if I have a PC membership for the main purpose of using a non-PC facility, then I know I'm taking a risk.

I just don't understand your problem with this.

Anyways, first you posted this in the wrong Fodors forum to start with. This is the US forum, and your post should be in either the Airlines or Asia forum.

Then after I tell you to ask the question on Flyertalk.com's Continental forum, you posted 4 different threads across three forums, including one reply that's irrelevant. Now, your threads have been shut down there, but you're getting the same reply as we've got you.

This shows that either you totally misunderstand the issue, or you just cannot get your points across in the right way for others to help you, or you do know the issues but just won't accept it.

Whatever the reason, sorry, but I'm afraid you're not going to get what you want.

BTW, please read the 2nd to last item in the list:

http://www.continental.com/web/en-US...nge/rules.aspx

rkkwan, sorry I don't meet your standards of expression. Also, Americans are the ones who join PClub; it is a US issue. I thought I was in an Airline forum.

For the record, the "2nd last" item is

"Continental reserves the right to restrict, alter or modify the fees, benefits, services and clubroom locations at any time with or without written notice to its members."

While the clause permits what I suggested above - changing the name and excluding all current PClub members, I don't think they have that right.

Under that clause, they have the right to do anything.

You think that is appropriate. I think it is sharp practice to change a lounge which was PClub affiliated, not closed and change it to Co BF only.

Since the inception of PClub, until 1/1/06, PClub members were invited to CO Business class lounges abroad. That track history is far more important than the 2nd last rule.

Thanks for pointing me to FlyerTalk - sorry, as above, that I didn't do it right.

The following, with different details, applies to Delta Crown Room members also, but I am not a member of DL CRC and wish to confine this to Continental Presidents Club and to bring pressure on Continental to live up to its agreement with its PClub members.

I thought it would be helpful to mention how Continental described presidents club locations earlier this year. The following is taken from a Continental data page - it may not be perfect.

Presidents Club Locations

Affiliated Clubroom agreements:
Aeromexico
Alaska airlines
Amtrack Club Acela
British European
Delta Crown Rooms
KLM Clubrooms
Northwest Domestic WorldClubs
Northwest International WorldClubs
Tap Air Portugal
Virgin Atlantic upper Class Lounges
at EWR only
at BOS/IAD/LGW/LHR/LAX/JFK/MIA/SFO
...
Businessfirst customer lounge access:
ARN-Novia Lounge
BFS-Belfast Airport Loounge
BHS-Servisair
BRS-Servisair
BRU-Restair
CDG-Air France Lounge
DUB-Ann livia Lounge - Inbound only
DUB-Pier C Airport Lounge - Outbound only
DXB-Aer Rianta Lounge
EDI-BMI lounge
FCO-Giotto lounge
FRA-DL Crown Room
GIG-Executive lounge
GRU-Swissport Lounge
HAM-Hamburg Airport Lounge
HKG-Dragonair Lounge
MAD-VIP Lounge
MAN-The escape lounge
MXP-Pergolesi lounge
NRT-JAL sakura lounge 1/2/3
OSL-British Airways lounge
PEK-Air China lounge
SNN-Airport lounge
TLV-DAN lounge
TPE-EVA Airways
TXL-Air France lounge
ZRH-Jet aviation Lounge

Continental lists all of these under
"PCLUB LOCATIONS CAT:CAL SUBCM PGEOC"

A Continental Presidents Club member was invited to every one of these, if flying on Continental, on 12/31/2005. 1/1/06 - forget about it; Continental Claims it has the right to alter the services, etc. without notice, so they did.

My "local" club is NRT JAL sakura 1/2/3. I am a lifetime member.

When I tried to gain access, flying CO from Tokyo, I was told that JAL had demanded the change.

I wrote to Larry Kellner, receiving a letter back from Richard Duly saying that "Japan Airlines (JAL) is no longer accepting (sic) to admit Continental Presidents Club members into their executive lounge"

Look at the list of presidents clubs that may no longer be used by presidents club members and tell me if you think that it is a NRT/JAL problem. The only conclusion possible is that the contracts were changed by Continental at Continental's request.

My letter to Presidents Club was answered by Pamela Carter saying:

"Continental Airlines reserves the right at its sole discretion to restrict, alter or modify the fees, benefits, services and clubroom locations at any time with or without written notice to its members."

Of course, that statement is not true. I cannot be charged more for my lifetime membership. Since the PClub locations are still there, Continental is claiming the right to reduce access; that's not right either.

Finally, I went to the executive offices in Houston on Smith Street. Of course, no real executive had time for me, but, the person I spoke to was incredulous when I described the situation. She could not believe that Continental would exclude Presidents Club members from any affiliated club. It took me over a half an hour to explain it. Her answer, after checking with real management, was - sorry!

Anybody contemplating buying presidents club needs to think twice.

I think anybody considering buying any "lifetime membership" to any club should think twice. Well, more like three times or four times.

For example, who says you'll fly Continental for long? Who says CO will be around in 5 or 6 years? Who says you'll be living in Tokyo, or anywhere that CO even flies? Or if you even care about travel or lounges?

Afterall, it's YOUR problem. You made a mistake of buying that membership. I feel sorry for you, and most importantly that you fail to understand this and continue to waste your own time fighting it.

rkkwan,

I appreciate the help you gave me earlier. Thanks to your advice, I am raising the visibility of this sea change in the PClub relationship with members.

Unfortunately, you seem to have decided that I'm wrong for having bought a lemon. You may prove to be right, however,...

If you are a PClub member, please write to Mr. Kellner and tell him you agree with his decision to screw his most faithful, trusting customers. You don't want or need access to the international affiliated lounges and you would be just as happy if they cordoned off an area of the airport and permitted Presidents Club members to go get a sip of water from a fountain nearby.

If you're not a PClub member, pls ignore my posts on this subject.

I think there is a bit of parallel play hre - rk, you are absolutely correct that it is a caveat emptor world and, especially when a consumer chooses to purchase something that comes with a disclaimer about future changes without warning, the merchant is within their rights to invoke such a clause.
And ContPlat, I also agree with you that cutting off access to clubs does seem to run counter to the attempt by CO to market themelves as a global carrier, even if they are technically within their rights in doing so.
We PC members do pay a fee for our membership, just like Business/First flyers pay apremium for their ticket. It would seem only equitable that any louge that allows access to CO BusinessFirst flyers should also be open to PC members. Just MHO.