Road trip through Europe

Old Dec 19th, 2011, 09:45 AM
  #41  
ira
 
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Hi mj,

>I am planning a three-four week trip to hit as many countries and castles as I can.<

That is the most common of newbie mistakes.

Unless you are terminally ill, slow down and enjoy your visit.

Europe will be there for another trip.

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Old Dec 19th, 2011, 02:01 PM
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"I'd hire left hand drive for UK and right hand drive on the continent."

You sure about that???
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Old Dec 19th, 2011, 03:43 PM
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Mjconns,

Please do not give up on us. Most of us sincerely are more than happy to help. I think it was the enormity of your whole trip that threw everyone into a frenzy of saying the totality was not workable.

We understand you are going to do it anyway. More power to you.

If I could suggest you start a series of other threads in which you break the trip down into sections, I think it would help us to get our heads around your needs so we can give specific advice. For example, if you ask the best route from Chateau de Chillon to San Marino, someone who lives near there or has driven the route could give detailed directions. They could also suggest places to stay, eat, etc.

Breaking it down into bite-sized pieces could help both you and the Forum.
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Old Dec 19th, 2011, 06:09 PM
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ira said;

Hi mj,

>I am planning a three-four week trip to hit as many countries and castles as I can.<

(1) That is the most common of newbie mistakes.

(2) Unless you are terminally ill, slow down and enjoy your visit.

(3) Europe will be there for another trip.


(1) is derogatory and insulting
(2) is condescending and arrogant
(3) displays remarkable prescience about another's plans for life.

Hey, but at least you said "Hi" first.
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Old Dec 19th, 2011, 08:07 PM
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I think that the difficulty / stress of motoring increases in proportion to the density of population. Ditto for parking, ditto for motorway tolls.

Worth bearing in mind.
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Old Dec 20th, 2011, 03:38 PM
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There’s not a lot of point going to Venice to see castles – there are no castles there, as Venice was well protected by the lagoon, serving as a moat.

But at Mestre, near Venice, there is the Forte Marghera, built when cannon fire was to be anticipated.

http://ytaba36.wordpress.com/2011/12...rghera-mestre/ may be of interest.

Google map Forte Marghera and you’ll find it.
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Old Dec 20th, 2011, 04:09 PM
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I'm still trying to figure out why he's doing the castles that he is.

Of the many, many hundreds of castles in europe he has ignored some outstanding examples (why ignore the Tower of London - which is intact and had incredible historic associations) for others -which are may be in ruins - or just faux (like Neuschwanstein). I don;t disagree that the latter is an interesting sight - but it's not a real castle by any means - having been built long after the age of fortresses.
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Old Dec 20th, 2011, 06:16 PM
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Because he wants to. His trip, not yours. This really is a difficult concept for some people.

The "Age of Fortresses"? Exactly when was that?

Fortresses and castles are not interchangeable, as your post suggests. Castles are fortified residences constructed by the nobility. Their primary purpose is to be a defensive stronghold during attack.

Neuschwanstein is, most assuredly, a castle.
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Old Dec 20th, 2011, 07:16 PM
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Typo correction;

Castles are fortified residences constructed by the nobility. Their primary purpose is NOT to be a defensive stronghold during attack. That is the purpose of a fortress.
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Old Dec 20th, 2011, 10:07 PM
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Castles are fortified residences constructed by the nobility. Their primary purpose is NOT to be a defensive stronghold during attack

Splitting hairs, I think. This chateau was built as a protective unit by a lord who apparently was hated by everyone. It was anachronistic when it was built and presumably could be defended by just 12 men-at-arms (which I doubt).

http://www.flickr.com/photos/mksfca/...57623877915948

Castle, fortress, call it a chateau and call it quits. And a chateau can be une véritable forteresse as is often pointed out.
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Old Dec 21st, 2011, 06:41 AM
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But a chateau is often what I would call a palace, with almost no defensive purpose. So chateau is not a useful word in English, where we have more distinctions.

(I once read that to translate an English document into French required many more French words than the original. Because the English language has a larger vocabulary, the French translation needed a lot of adjectives and adverbs to convey the fine distinctions. Of course, a number of those words in English come from Norman French....)
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Old Dec 21st, 2011, 07:56 AM
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Mimar,

I suspect that if prior to my posting someone asked you which castles to see in France that you would have included Versailles, Fontainebleau, and quite a few castles in the Loire valley that were built with no defensive purposes at all. Castle is a catch-all term.

The French have the word palais.
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Old Dec 21st, 2011, 09:15 AM
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The Age of Fortresses was before the age of modern armies. Neuschwanstein was not built as a fortress - it was built as an amusement by a "king" of a country that barely existed and was in no danger whatever of being attacked by anyone - never mind armies of knghts on horseback and massive seige engines that had disappeared several hundred years before.

And granted it is his trip - but it seems to have been developed with some very unusual parameters. I have been to many (but not all) of these castles - and his choices don;t seem to indicate much knowledge at all about the subject.

Never mind the plan to drive to (but not into) a lot of cities to get to places outside the cities. Neither Windsor nor Dover is IN London - and he's ignoring the one castle/fortress (a world famous one) that is.

But if he prefers Disney to William the Conquorer - that's his choice.

And chateaux may be castles or may be fortresses or may be palaces. These are very differnt things. Unless you can't tell the Tower of London (practically impregnable at the time) from Buckingham Palace (could;t hold off a troop of boy scouts).
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Old Dec 21st, 2011, 09:28 AM
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nytrav

Like your comment about Buckingham Palace, remember when the Queen woke up with an intruder sitting on the end of her bed? That was in the 80s, I think, and not an isolated incident!

More recently, a protestor reached the main balcony.
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