Why No U.K. Trains on Christmas, Boxing Day?
Dec 22nd, 2007, 03:42 PM
#21
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 78,320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And Britain's several million non-Christian immigrants don't have to get around those days
and it seems that by juding railway and bus workforce they'd have more than enough non-believers to run them.
Rather insensitive IMO to an important segment of society who may consider Xmas Day just another day.
Again the pubs i guess at least some are open - that's an ESSENTIAL service?
and it seems that by juding railway and bus workforce they'd have more than enough non-believers to run them.
Rather insensitive IMO to an important segment of society who may consider Xmas Day just another day.
Again the pubs i guess at least some are open - that's an ESSENTIAL service?
Dec 22nd, 2007, 05:19 PM
#22
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 57,890
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well - our workers too get extra pay (how much depends - often double time) to work on the few major holidays.
But our population is so diverse that there are plenty of people for whom it isn't a holiday - and/or are happy to get the extra money.
But our population is so diverse that there are plenty of people for whom it isn't a holiday - and/or are happy to get the extra money.
Dec 22nd, 2007, 10:32 PM
#23
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 17,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Rather insensitive IMO to an important segment of society who may consider Xmas Day just another day."
It's our culture. If they don't like it, the world's awash with countries that treat Xmas as just another day.
Whether, of course, such countries extend the concept of sensitivity to letting them in, letting them work and and letting them practice their religion without being persecuted is quite another matter.
Incidentally, most immigrants these days are practising Catholics. And I've yet to hear a tweet abouit the absence of train services from a single Muslim or Hindu - not least because Muslims form a substantial membership in the unions that want a two-day break
It's our culture. If they don't like it, the world's awash with countries that treat Xmas as just another day.
Whether, of course, such countries extend the concept of sensitivity to letting them in, letting them work and and letting them practice their religion without being persecuted is quite another matter.
Incidentally, most immigrants these days are practising Catholics. And I've yet to hear a tweet abouit the absence of train services from a single Muslim or Hindu - not least because Muslims form a substantial membership in the unions that want a two-day break
Dec 22nd, 2007, 11:24 PM
#24
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 17,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Incidentally, I was recently refused a beer in Sri Lanka, because it was the day of the full moon, when in deference to local Buddhist sensitities its sale is banned.
To the best of my knowledge, not a single member of the country's substantial and long-standing Christian or Hundu communities regard this ban as "insensitive" Indeed the Christians I met took some pride in their monthly part-celebration of a Buddhist holy day. And routinely exchange Christmas (not "holiday" or "seasons" or any other pissant claptrap) greetings with their Hindu, Buddhist and - yup - Muslim neighbours.
The fatuous belief that celebrating one culture is "insensitive" to another is a bizarre American invention which has probably done more damage to the world than Coca Cola and McDonalds combined.
To the best of my knowledge, not a single member of the country's substantial and long-standing Christian or Hundu communities regard this ban as "insensitive" Indeed the Christians I met took some pride in their monthly part-celebration of a Buddhist holy day. And routinely exchange Christmas (not "holiday" or "seasons" or any other pissant claptrap) greetings with their Hindu, Buddhist and - yup - Muslim neighbours.
The fatuous belief that celebrating one culture is "insensitive" to another is a bizarre American invention which has probably done more damage to the world than Coca Cola and McDonalds combined.
Dec 23rd, 2007, 02:38 AM
#25
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 133
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
<<Since we have fewer public holidays than practically any other affluent country (including the overleisured Americxans) and work longer hours than anyone else in Europe, we deserve it.>>
From 2004 OECD data, average working hours/year:
Poland 1984
Cz Rep 1882
Greece 1811
USA 1777
Hungary 1777
Slovak. 1770
Spain 1745
Portugal 1675
Gr Brt. 1652
Ireland 1541
Italy 1523
Austria 1481
Belgium 1449
Denmark 1423
Germany 1362
France 1346
Norway 1328
Sweden 1316
Nether. 1309
maytraveller
From 2004 OECD data, average working hours/year:
Poland 1984
Cz Rep 1882
Greece 1811
USA 1777
Hungary 1777
Slovak. 1770
Spain 1745
Portugal 1675
Gr Brt. 1652
Ireland 1541
Italy 1523
Austria 1481
Belgium 1449
Denmark 1423
Germany 1362
France 1346
Norway 1328
Sweden 1316
Nether. 1309
maytraveller
Dec 23rd, 2007, 03:46 AM
#26
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 12,582
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
we do have a lot of immigrants.
You will be hard pressed to get into my local catholic church this christmas. They are literally running shifts of services. The one in polish "sold out" months ago.
After going to church the jam-rolls will go native and get pissed and watch Doctor Who like the rest of us.
You will be hard pressed to get into my local catholic church this christmas. They are literally running shifts of services. The one in polish "sold out" months ago.
After going to church the jam-rolls will go native and get pissed and watch Doctor Who like the rest of us.
Dec 23rd, 2007, 05:16 AM
#27
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,585
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The fatuous belief that celebrating one culture is "insensitive" to another is a bizarre American invention which has probably done more damage to the world than Coca Cola and McDonalds combined.
I must agree with you.
It's a hardy tabloid perennial that "they" want to put an end to Christmas.
I have never heard any suggestion from a Muslim or other faith group that they find it offensive. Why should they, after all?
We don't find the celebration of Eid or Diwali insensitive.
I must agree with you.
It's a hardy tabloid perennial that "they" want to put an end to Christmas.
I have never heard any suggestion from a Muslim or other faith group that they find it offensive. Why should they, after all?
We don't find the celebration of Eid or Diwali insensitive.
Dec 23rd, 2007, 05:57 AM
#28
I do understand the closure of railways etc.
One of the reasons, as others have suggested, is that large amounts of maintenance are done over this period. My understanding is that although many people would wish to use the trains to get to their holiday destinations, the weeks surrounding Christmas and New year are traditionally by far the quietest periods, and thus repair work at this time inconveniences the fewest people.
As somebody who routinely works Christmas and Easter (I work in a medical lab and Bank holidays etc are by rota - only Christmas day is Volunteer only) I find it strange that many people should object to the concept of people being able to spend time with their families over the festive season.
One of the reasons, as others have suggested, is that large amounts of maintenance are done over this period. My understanding is that although many people would wish to use the trains to get to their holiday destinations, the weeks surrounding Christmas and New year are traditionally by far the quietest periods, and thus repair work at this time inconveniences the fewest people.
As somebody who routinely works Christmas and Easter (I work in a medical lab and Bank holidays etc are by rota - only Christmas day is Volunteer only) I find it strange that many people should object to the concept of people being able to spend time with their families over the festive season.
Dec 23rd, 2007, 06:31 AM
#31
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 19,881
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just to point out that there are trains in the UK on Boxing Day - just not everywhere
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/servic...mmary2007.html
http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/servic...mmary2007.html
Dec 23rd, 2007, 06:36 AM
#32
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 78,320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
At my local supermarket, which is open 364 days a year on major holidays like thanksgiving all the most veteran workers with seniority are there working - gladly it seems snatching up the 2.5 times normal pay
i guess there is a price on their wanting to be at home with their families
that said i understand the U.K. closing down on Christmas Day just i guess don't understand why trains in the rest of europe run a regular holiday schedule.
To me transportation, especially for many car-less folk like in London burbs, is an essential service
Pubs are not and not one Brit laments above that pub workers are not at home with their families.
Hypocrisy it seems
i guess there is a price on their wanting to be at home with their families
that said i understand the U.K. closing down on Christmas Day just i guess don't understand why trains in the rest of europe run a regular holiday schedule.
To me transportation, especially for many car-less folk like in London burbs, is an essential service
Pubs are not and not one Brit laments above that pub workers are not at home with their families.
Hypocrisy it seems
Dec 23rd, 2007, 06:44 AM
#33
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 2,254
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Have any of the non-U.K. posters actually been in England (or Wales, but not Scotland) over Christmas? And I mean the real England of suburbs and provincial towns and cities, not the centre of London or anywhere which caters for tourists.
The place is dead. People stay at home, except for the few who go to church or who like to go to pubs. Most travel is short distance, by car, in a family, from one home to another. Virtually all shops are closed, and only essential staff are at work. There is little traffic, because there are no buses, delivery vehicles, etc, and so no congestion.
Most public tansport in Britain is used by people travelling to work or for business. We do that before Christmas, and afterwards, but not on the day itself.
I can remember when New Year's Eve and New Year's Day were just ordinary working days. They are not now. It might be that there will be sufficient demand for public transport over Christmas in the future to justify the considerable extra cost, but I doubt it will happen soon. Most public transport is already heavily subsidised, and the costs of running empty trains and buses while paying premium rates for staff is simply not worth while.
The place is dead. People stay at home, except for the few who go to church or who like to go to pubs. Most travel is short distance, by car, in a family, from one home to another. Virtually all shops are closed, and only essential staff are at work. There is little traffic, because there are no buses, delivery vehicles, etc, and so no congestion.
Most public tansport in Britain is used by people travelling to work or for business. We do that before Christmas, and afterwards, but not on the day itself.
I can remember when New Year's Eve and New Year's Day were just ordinary working days. They are not now. It might be that there will be sufficient demand for public transport over Christmas in the future to justify the considerable extra cost, but I doubt it will happen soon. Most public transport is already heavily subsidised, and the costs of running empty trains and buses while paying premium rates for staff is simply not worth while.
Dec 23rd, 2007, 07:51 AM
#35
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 8,247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Everything that has been said why the trains don't have to run would be true in most countries I know:
December 25:
No business meetings in Stockholm, Amsterdam City Hall closed, all shops closed in Germany -- everyone between Palermo and Hammerfest with a typical 9-5 desk job is not working. Still there is public transportation everywhere, maybe on a less frequent holiday schedule.
Maybe the "rest" of Europe uses the holidays more to visit friends and families than the British. Wouldn't know why, though.
But simply staying 2 days at home, glued to the TV, and just eating and drinking does not sound too exciting...
December 25:
No business meetings in Stockholm, Amsterdam City Hall closed, all shops closed in Germany -- everyone between Palermo and Hammerfest with a typical 9-5 desk job is not working. Still there is public transportation everywhere, maybe on a less frequent holiday schedule.
Maybe the "rest" of Europe uses the holidays more to visit friends and families than the British. Wouldn't know why, though.
But simply staying 2 days at home, glued to the TV, and just eating and drinking does not sound too exciting...
Dec 23rd, 2007, 07:58 AM
#37
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,085
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"I think that they should cut off electricity and gas as well on the 25th and 26th -- why should those people have to work?"
Well these things are essential.
How would I get all my electrical christmas pressies to work then !!
And Mrs Muck would never be able to cook the turkey without gas.
I would therefore be hungry and bored. Also the old biddy across the road would freeze. Not a pretty sight. and certainly not a nice way to treat our elders..
Sorry guys but lecky and gas must be maintained
Well these things are essential.
How would I get all my electrical christmas pressies to work then !!
And Mrs Muck would never be able to cook the turkey without gas.
I would therefore be hungry and bored. Also the old biddy across the road would freeze. Not a pretty sight. and certainly not a nice way to treat our elders..
Sorry guys but lecky and gas must be maintained
Dec 23rd, 2007, 08:16 AM
#39
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,233
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"What is the difference between car culture in England and that in every other European nation?"
Do you mean Britain? The UK? "England" isn't a "nation"."
England is definitely a nation. It just isn't a state.
Do you mean Britain? The UK? "England" isn't a "nation"."
England is definitely a nation. It just isn't a state.
Dec 23rd, 2007, 08:55 AM
#40
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 78,320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And i would expect the motorways would also be empty those two days
and the ancilliary things like cop cars, rest area gas and food and snack restaurants would be closed so those employees could do a proper Christmas
It seems in fact that no one in UK ventures outside their houses on those two days
i'd love to see the number of births nine months later
or is it only the wealthier folks can travel via car?
old ladies have to sit at home making next year's Christmas pud i guess... and eating last year's
and the ancilliary things like cop cars, rest area gas and food and snack restaurants would be closed so those employees could do a proper Christmas
It seems in fact that no one in UK ventures outside their houses on those two days
i'd love to see the number of births nine months later
or is it only the wealthier folks can travel via car?
old ladies have to sit at home making next year's Christmas pud i guess... and eating last year's
