I'm going to be in Paris--arriving May 2 8AM, Departing May 10 Noon. I will be renting a car due to the fact that train tickets are insanely expensive. A car is under $200 total for the entire period, so if you are going to recommend a train, it would need to be comparably priced for two people. (I don't think I'd ever do a Europe train trip as I'm not willing to meet the crazy 3 month advance purchase requirements for reasonable fares--I just don't plan trips that far in advance--in fact I usually plan as I go.)

A one way trip is also not a possibility--we must begin and end at CDG )

If you were going to do some driving, where would you go? I'm thinking Brugge and Brussels. (I'd like to include Amsterdam, but I think that may be too far.) If you have any suggested itineraries, I'd love to hear them. I've been to all of these cities before, but my GF has not. I think Paris will need a 3 day minimum and I'll drive before or after that.

fuel and very high tolls in France on autoroutes make cars a lot more expensive than the basic rental price but yes walk-up train fares are crazy.

Amsterdam is what about a 5-6 drive at tops- blast up there first and then come back via Antwerp, Gent and Bruges - Brussels underwhelms many so maybe just make a brief stop there en route back to CDG - Amiens in France has a stunning cathedral for a short break.

I can understand not wanting to plan every detail so far in advance. I'm not clear on what you are doing though. If you mainly want to be touring around the countryside, a car makes sense. Bruges isn't too huge so that seems fine. It think smaller places are better with a car, it's just a hassle driving in cities and finding/paying for parking. I hope you are prepared for road tolls, about 50 euro just between Paris and Bruges.

SO you are leaving in just a few weeks and have no plans at all, and no hotel reservations?

I'd see some places in France before going to Belgium, although it depends on your interests. That is directly north of Paris and I don't consider it super scenic (NE France). Amiens isn't a bad idea, you go through Lille but I haven't been there and it's mainly an industrial city, I believe. Instead of just going north, I'd suggest going east first and seeing Reims and champagne country, then going up to Ghent, then Bruges and then return on the fairly direct route from Bruges to Paris. You only have a week, after all. Not sure about Brussels as a big city, if you do want to go there, it would be before Ghent/Bruges in that circular route going counterclockwise.

Pretty hard to compare train and car rental prices without having any idea where you would be taking a train from.

Your $200 car rental price is going to expand exponentially as you shell out money for tolls and fuel and parking. And if you're just winging it on the accommodations, too, good luck keeping the costs down, not to mention giving up precious vacation time looking for an affordable pillow.

you go through Lille but I haven't been there and it's mainly an industrial city, I believe>

Au contraire - the center of Lille is as nice as most French cities and there is I think a branch of the Louvre here?- I enjoyed waltzing around a few hours in Lille - that said I would not go out of my way to stop in a big traffic-plagued city with car.

By NOT doing some planning you are setting yourself up for a lot of extra cost.
A driving trip is fun and interessting IF it is the countryside you want to see. To get from A to B in Europe, the train is very economical and quick. Where are you going to park this car without cost?
You really ought to check out the train fares.

Just so long as you do;t rent a car to drive around Paris - which would be a complete nonsense. You only rent it when you leave the first city - and for all other cities be aware that many have pedestrian centers that do NOT allow cars and if you do enter you can end up with very high fines (more than the car rental).

Also expect to pay 30 euros per night and up for parking the car since european hotels typically don;t have parking - and if they do it isn;t free unless they are in the countryside.

You're probably looking at Thalys ticket prices. There are also intercities that are a lot cheaper and don't require booking in advance. Within Belgium and the Netherlands the train is inexpensive, same price wether you buy it on the day or in advance. And do add up cost of tolls (in France), petrol, parking. Parking is not free in cities.

If you're doing a countryside road trip, the car is better than train. Perhaps take in Ieper and the Flanders Field museum before going to Brugge. Go to the seaside for a day if the weather is good.

May 5th is a holiday in Belgium and the Netherlands. In touristy places like Brugge everything will probably be open, but Antwerp, Gent, Brussel shops will be closed.

Thalys offers deals at 29€ per trip well in advance. 39€ is not unusual. The day before it is 99€ per trip. per person.

I second PQ on all counts : Lille is a very beautiful city.

On top of 200$ for the car you defintely have the tolls, the fuel, probably some $ for insurance unless you give a huge guarantee deposit and the speedcameras... pay real attention to your speed in France, also in Flanders and even more in Netherlands. Then comes parking - they are not for free either.

I hope you don't drive right off the plane after a transatlantic flight - have friends whose children did it and ended up in hospital the same day of arrival.

Tulips - may 5 holiday in Belgium ? Pentacost ? wow between may 1, 8 + 5 when am I going to work ?

It's ascension day - Hemelvaart. Many people take a long weekend from Thursday - Sunday. Pentacost (pinksteren) is May 16. And indeed May 1st, but that's a Sunday anyway. Better take the whole month of, Whathello!

Thanks ! I always confuse hemelvaart and pinksteren.
(I find hemelvaart much more evocative than ascension by the way).

Ps : I get the mondy off when 1st may falls on a sunday
(shhh it makes my neighbours jealous).

<< I hope you are prepared for road tolls, about 50 euro just between Paris and Bruges>>
This is NOT true. Péage from Paris to the Belgian border is 16,30 euro one-way. You don't pay tolls in Belgium.

<<you go through Lille but I haven't been there and it's mainly an industrial city, I believe>>
Lille is one of the prettiest cities in northern France. A must visit IMO.

<<There are also intercities that are a lot cheaper and don't require booking in advance>>
I don't think there are intercity trains from, say, Brussels to Paris. If so, they take forever. Just don't!
But ... there's a new low-cost train (IZY) that runs between Brussels and Paris. It's not as fast as Thalys, but it's also not as expensive. Check it out: https://www.b-europe.com/Travel/Trains/IZY

I think on monday the Izy must have been faster than the Thalys I took which was quite delayed...

and Myriam is right : no other train than Thalys for Paris-Bruxelles. The other choice is Paris Lille and Lille Bruxelles - sometimes cheaper.

Between Brussel and Paris it's hard to avoid the Thalys (and will take you a long time). But for Brugge you can do Lille-Brugge on Intercity for 17.80.

and Myriam is right : no other train than Thalys for Paris-Bruxelles. The other choice is Paris Lille and Lille Bruxelles - sometimes cheaper.>

Not really - I have with a railpass sidestepped Thalys' absurd supplement for railpasses by taking the RER to CDG Airport and then French TGVs to Brussels - so yes you can go Brussels to Paris without dealing with Thalys if you want.

The Bruges-Paris IC train link is IC train Bruges to Lille Flandres and then a French TGV to Paris-Nord.

For lots on trains in those countries check www.seat61.com (great info on discounted train tickets); www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com. Early booking gets discounted fares on all French TGVs and Thalys trains (except the new low-price Thalys off-shoot perhaps as it has constantly low fares).

Wow.. thanks. Yes I don't have hotels yet, but I'm working on that this week. There are still plenty available. I was surprised at that too--maybe the recent terrorism is scaring people off?

My plan is to park at a hotel outside the city centers and take a local commuter train in to major cities. I wouldn't use a car for touring in the city. I used a car when I did a similar trip a several years ago and I had no problem at all. The costs just weren't that high--not even remotely close to the cost of a train. (And remember all of the train fares are doubled for two--car is not.)

I'm not a super cheapskate. But if a car is cheaper than a train, I'd rather have a car--I'm not forced to follow a train schedule. I'm not a novice at this. I've spent half of the year outside the US every year for the past decade--it's just that its mostly in Asia.

To the guy that said about Amsterdam, "blast up there first and then come back via Antwerp, Gent and Bruges". That was my thought as well. No one else thinks this is too much to squeeze in 8 touring days?

FYI the train from CDG to Amsterdam for May 2 is USD$300 per person as of today

Sorry, per two people.

To the guy that said about Amsterdam, "blast up there first and then come back via Antwerp, Gent and Bruges". That was my thought as well. No one else thinks this is too much to squeeze in 8 touring days?>

Well maybe but not me as it seems you like to drive and that is sweet - driving in Europe - and 3 days in Amsterdam and 2 in Antwerp- 1 in Gent and 2 in Bruges is about right for those cities - travel time in between is almost nil - just a few hours.

FYI I have booked Thalys tickets in advance for 39 euros Paris to Amsterdam or about $50 but yes you do plug yourself into a certain train on a certain day - no one pays $150 p.p.who is not on expense account. I booked those tickets last August with just a two-week leeway by the way.

FYI the train from CDG to Amsterdam for May 2 is USD$300 per person as of today

But a one-way flight on Transavia from Paris to Amsterdam is 40 euros. Flying is often cheaper than train.

In Amsterdam you can park on the outskirts of town and take the tram from there. It's not free, but I don't think it will be very expensive. Check out the parking at Amsterdam Arena.

In Antwerpen you can still find free parking in town at the Scheldekaaien (along the river) and on the Vlaamse Kaai (in south Antwerp).

The drive from Paris to Amsterdam is 5 to 6 hours in theory. If you can, plan it to avoid rush hour around the cities. Brussels, Antwerp, Rotterdam (or Utrecht), Amsterdam are all very congested.

Check out www.rome2rio.com for all possible options.