Hello! DH and I are planning a trip to Europe in July 2018...so we have some time, but are trying to decide where we want to go. I am a high school teacher and am taking over my school's annual Europe trip in 2019. I'll be chaperoning the 2018 trip for training. DH and I want to do a more adult trip so we will be traveling Europe the first 2 weeks of July, and then we will meet up with the students in Paris, at which time DH will fly home and I will continue on with the tour group for 2 more weeks. So...basically DH and I have to finish our trip in Paris to meet up with the students. This is what I'm thinking for DH and my trip:

Day 1: fly out of San Francisco
Day 2: London
Day 3: London
Day 4: London
Day 5: London
Day 6: London to Amsterdam (train)
Day 7: Amsterdam
Day 8: Amsterdam
Day 9: fly Amsterdam to Rome
Day 10: Rome
Day 11: Rome
Day 12: Rome (overnight train to Paris)
Day 13: Paris (tour group arrives)
Day 13: Paris
Day 14: Paris (DH flies out)

Is this a reasonable itinerary? DH really wants to see Rome. I know it's a short time in Rome but the tour group actually ends in Rome so I'll get more time (I'm the one with the travel bug).

I was also wondering about your experiences in hostels? DH and I like the idea of a social atmosphere, but we don't really want to sleep somewhere that is loud 24/7 and smells like smoke.

That's not a bad itinerary. I don't do hostels myself, because while I don't mind sharing a bathroom I prefer not to share a bedroom. However, I travel solo. Many hostels these days have private doubles. I suspect that in Europe they are all non-smoking, too.

Thank you for the input.

This looks OK to me - a bit tight on Rome, but you can't help that unless you take a day away from Old Blighty.

Just one thing - don't you want to be in Paris a day earlier? Aren't you cutting it fine for the meeting with the group? Stumbling off a night train where sleep isn't exactly guaranteed?

There are cheap flights all over Europe, really cheap, if you look early and don't mind which sometimes alternative airport you use (like Ciampino and Beauvais).

You'd better be a good sleeper, hostels aren't exactly guaranteeing good sleep, either - comings and goings, slamming doors, and snoring being the main culprits. I hope you'll find affordable semi-private rooms, that helps of course.

Happy planning!

I originally tried to get us in a day early to Paris, but Rome is already so tight. I guess I could take a day off London. I have been to London and love it so I made sure to allow enough time there to enjoy time with hubby this time.

The group will be flying all night so on the current itinerary we would all arrive at about the same time. The students would be just as beat as we will. An extra night in Paris just the two of us would be nice...I've been to Paris so I don't need time to really orient myself.

Would you take a day off London or day off Rome or leave as is?

About hostels, the noise and the smell,
it really depends on which hostels you book.
I often use booking.com for myself, choose the destination and the date, then the site will give you a list of accommodation. Make sure to include hostels in the list (probably check the option "Lowest price first, including dormitories"). Then you may pick the hostels with a rating of more than 8.0 with a good review. Loud hostels rarely receive good review.

I find that the rating and the reviews on that website are reliable. In their reviews, there's also the "Cleanness" criterion to look at, if it's important to you. Also, when you book, you can choose non-smoking rooms. The smoking rooms are the smelly ones.

>>>Day 12: Rome (overnight train to Paris)<<<

There isn't a night train from Rome to Paris so you wouldn't have 2 days in Rome as you would have to leave earlier on day 2 to reach Milan where the overnight train departs. You said your DH really wants to see Rome, yet you are seriously shortchanging it.

I would drop Amsterdam and fly to Rome from London. You could also drop a day in London and add it to Rome. You could depart London late on day 5 to Amsterdam instead of the next day and add a day to Rome.

I would fly from Rome to Paris. Easy Jet from Rome FCO to Paris Orly. In fact, I would fly into Rome and start my trip there

As for hostels, Italy has hostels, but has many more convents and monasteries (200 in Rome). You need to state a budget per night if you want suggestions.

From your other thread, it appears you've been to Europe once (Paris/London) with a tour group. As such, you didn't have to figure out all the logistics of getting from/to hotels/transport/sites. These things will take more time than if you had a tour director guiding you. Sleep will be important so don't skimp too much on hotels.

If you haven't booked flights yet, I would fly into Rome first. That gets the bulk of travel out of the way on the way over. (Paris/London/Amsterdam are much easier to reach from each other). While Rome will likely be hot then, the later in summer, the hotter it will be.

Day 1 - Depart US
Day 2 - Arrive Rome - 1/2 day Rome
Day 3 - Rome
Day 4 - Rome
Day 5 - Rome
Day 6 - Fly to Amsterdam 1/2 day Amsterdam
Day 7 - Amsterdam
Day 8 - Amsterdam
Day 9 - Train to London - 1/2 day London
Day 10 - London
Day 11 - London
Day 12 - London
Day 13 - Early train to Paris to meet group

While it can be worth checking reviews at booking.com - and tripadvisor if you read carefully - you are better off using one of the hostel sites if you are serious about hostels. You should get a lot more reviews, and it should be easy to pick out the party places.

Hostelworld seems to be the favorite, but there are also Hostelz and Hostels and Hostelbookers. Plus the Hihostels site for the original Youth Hostels International places.

If you want a private double, hostels aren't that cheap, you might do better in a pension, guesthouse or B&B (a real B&B, not AirBnB, European B&Bs are nothing like American ones).

Can you really still smoke in a European hostel? You can't even smoke in a Parisian cafe or an Irish pub these days.

@kybourbon- I never even though about flipping the itinerary but it seems to make a lot more sense the way you have it. I've been to London and Paris with a tour group so I've never had to plan the itinerary myself. While it may seem I'm short-changing Rome I'll actually be returning a few weeks later with a tour group. However, it's EF student tours, do we are only in each city for about a day and a half. So even with 3 1/2 days Rome, I'll get to go back and finish it in the same trip. I like your suggestion of starting Rome because the tour group ends there.

@thursdaysd - thanks for all the advice about hostels. DH and I have been saving up for a long time and now we are just trying get a budget idea. We've saved up about $10,000 for this trip and expect to spent another couple thousand if needed. At this point we are just trying to figure out what type of accomodations we can afford and how much more we need to save if needed.

$10,000? Does that include airfare? Even if it doesn't it is way more than you need and you certainly don't need to sleep in hostels!

If I subtract $2,500 for airfare to/from Europe for the two of you, discount day 1 since you spend the night on the plane, and day 13 since you are meeting the tour group (I'm assuming that cost is separate), it works out at $791/day for the two of you! Or $395 for one. I travel solo and don't spend anything CLOSE to that, and it is cheaper to travel as a couple. You can afford en-suite doubles and restaurant meals, only hostel if you want to.

If you want to get an idea of budgets for your trip, go to:

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/england/london/money-costs
http://www.lonelyplanet.com/france/paris/money-costs
http://www.lonelyplanet.com/italy/rome/money-costs

Use xe.com to convert to USD. Use skyscanner.com to price flights within Europe, and seat61.om for info on train travel.

Oops, just checked my math and realize I threw in the extra $2,000. Using "just" $10,000 it's $625/day or $312/person/day. But my point still stands: that's a very generous budget. Many people travel happily on less.

Yeah we'be been saving for a long time for this. We are thinking hostels more for the social aspect. I'm just worried they will be something I'm not expecting. DH like a healthy dose of partying but we aren't crazy either. Maybe we will mix them.

Sorry for the typos. I can't seem to find an edit button.

"I can't seem to find an edit button."

There isn't one. There is a preview option, but once you post, that's it.

You could probably do two trips on what you have saved.

With all due respect to thursdaysd, I think I'm more up-to-date with hostels than you are. Reviews on booking.com are often more reliable than reviews on the hostel's own website. Why? Because the hostel has many ways to manipulate its website. Meanwhile booking.com is a honest business website and only people who has booked that hostel via booking.com can leave a rating or review, AFTER their stay. I use hostels most of the times I travel, which is a lot, and all of the hostels correspond well with their booking.com reviews.

Once you decided which hostel/B&B to choose, you can actually go to the hostel's own website to book. It may save you a few bucks, but honestly I book 4 or 5 hostels in booking.com within 10 mins to save the trouble (I have an account there so don't need to repeat my information every time).

As for smoking room, there are still hostels and hotel which have both smoking and non smoking rooms. But if it is the case nothing to worry about, when you book room they often ask you whether you want a smoking room or not.

When I choose a hostel with a rating of 8.5, it's often better than a cheap hotel. Kitchen, garden, piano, reading room, computer room,... There are a lot of chance to socialize in those hostels, the talk'll come as naturally as a wind. Unfortunately I'm not a social person and don't often appreciate the occasion ^^

"Reviews on booking.com are often more reliable than reviews on the hostel's own website."

Where did I say anything about the "hostel's own website"? I referenced websites that are effectively booking.com for hostels. Maybe you should go look at them.

I book hotels on booking.com. If I wanted to book a hostel (which these days I mostly don't) I would go to hostelword.com.

All the websites that you listed, hostelworld, hostelbookers,... I have used them before. Nowadays I prefer booking.com because it gives you more choices, and whatever available on hostelworld are often available on booking.com too. Sorry for having mistaken your phrase, I thought you meant their own website when you said "hostel sites".

I like kys suggestions.

I too would take a day from London or skip Amsterdam to spend extra time in Rome .

I also think you have a lot of money.. nothing wrong with that, but I definitely would alternate some time in hotels with hostel time.
My daughter and her friends ( 19 and 20 yr olds) just did 8 weeks backpacking around Europe last year, and they were very happy to alternate their hostel stays with hotels.. Finding hostels with air conditioning in decent area in Rome was difficult ( ie impossible) so they opted for a hotel there.. and when its 100 degrees that makes good sense..

In Amsterdam its not just cigarette smoke in hostels you have to worry about ( lol ) they stayed at the Flying Pig and even my daughter complained about the smoke, party all night thing.. and they like socializing too.. but it can be exhausting, therefore a few interspersed hotel nights can be saviours.

When looking into flying into Paris.. do try and fly into Orly or Charles De Gaulle, much more convenient to commuting into city, Beauvais is farther out ( 90 kms!) and there is no direct train in.. so if looking at cheap airfare keep that in mind, you might save 10 euros on Ryanair, but since they are one that flys into Beauvais,, skip them and look at Vueling or Easyjet.

We've stayed in hostels in the UK and never had a problem with noise or smoke. Try www.yha.org.uk for recommendations.

In Rome, we used AirBnB and found a studio apartment near the Colosseum. https://www.airbnb.com/rooms/1112762 Our review is on page 5 of their listing, as of today.

Lee Ann

Thank you ElindelPickle!