Chip and pin credit card 2015 question

Old Feb 18th, 2015, 01:18 PM
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Chip and pin credit card 2015 question

Am asking this question as do not see a recent topic on the chip and pin cards. The credit card company I planned to use in Europe (Capital One) does not yet have the chip and pin credit cards available.
Has anyone had difficulty using the usual "swipe" credit cards in Italy or Ireland in the last few months?
Thanks
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 01:49 PM
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Just talked to Capitol One yesterday on the very subject. Your next issue, card, from them will be chip and SIGNATURE. All their cards will have chips by the end of the year, however they will be chip and SIGNATURE as opposed to chip and PIN. Why can't we get in line with the rest of the world!!
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 01:50 PM
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http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...s-in-italy.cfm

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...d-178365-2.cfm

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...technology.cfm

etc etc etc
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 02:28 PM
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All their cards will have chips by the end of the year, however they will be chip and SIGNATURE as opposed to chip and PIN.

I can't believe that the banks will give up the opportunity to collect fees by not allowing a PIN attached to the credit card for those who want to withdraw money from there bank account via an ATM--not recommended, but it can be done currently. Or does it mean that that pin will not work in unattended ticket kiosks and tool booths?
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 02:59 PM
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correction: from their bank account.
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 04:23 PM
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That's the same thing B of A is doing -- making all their cards chip and signature. They just sent me one as mine was due for renewal (it's a AAA Visa which B of A administers), and touted that it had this chip. I didn't even know they were going to do it.

Well, from what I've read, they can sometimes work in some automated machines where regular American ones would not, but not always.

Michael, you can always get a PIN with a credit card (at least all of mine you could), it doesn't have anything to do with the chip. I have PINs now with all of mine and they don't have chips in them. You can use them in ATMs, you don't need a chip in them to do that. And with a credit card, you are not withdrawing money from your bank account -- it's a credit card, you are making a "purchase" of money, which is basically taking out a high interest loan. You withdraw money with an ATM card, not a credit card.
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 04:49 PM
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My credit card is also an ATM card that takes money from my bank account -it's a chip and pin one.
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Old Feb 18th, 2015, 05:39 PM
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A lot of the banks are. My new Chase Visa is chip and pin and I understand my new Citibank MC will be the same.

Perhaps you need a different bank.
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 08:00 AM
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True Chip and Pin cards require expensive new readers. CC issuers and merchants in the US have dragged their feet over the change-over citing cost versus benefit.
It has only been since the Target / Home Depot / et al fiascos that the Banks have gotten serious about switching over.
As was done in Europe, the change is taking place incrementally -- first to Chip and Signature and THEN to Chip and Pin.
Any Chip enabled card SHOULD work as Chip and Pin, but that function is NOT being utilized yet, as they wait to roll out the required upgraded readers.
A Non-Chip and Pin Card -- be it Chip and Signature OR the older, Magnetic Strip type should still be useable in MOST European ATMs and shops.
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 10:01 AM
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Always the same misunderstandings of this issue for US travellers. Here is a fairly good explanation:
http://www.cardhub.com/edu/chip-and-...and-signature/

Bottom line as I see it, US chip and signature cards are of no more use to the traveller than a magnetic strip and signature card.

Not having a true chip and PIN card MAY result in problems for the traveller from the US. Having a true chip and PIN card is the only way to avoid any possibility of problems.

Both credit cards and debit/ATM cards should be chip and PIN, it isn't just relevant to credit cards.

The US is behind the times and the American traveller has to suffer for that.

Your old card will be accepted most of the time in Italy and Ireland Sasha but MAY cause you some problems sometimes. No one can offer you any assurance beyond that.

"Has anyone had difficulty using the usual "swipe" credit cards in Italy or Ireland in the last few months?" The answer is yes, SOME have.
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 10:26 AM
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Chase MasterCard Platinum has a chip, as does the gold Visa.
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 11:29 AM
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Be careful what you read on this subject. Many people do not know what they are talking about, or how their U.S. Chip Card will actually behave abroad. Many bank customer service people don't know what they are talking about, either.

Here is this from Chase Bank:

Paying with a Chase chip credit card abroad:

Chip card readers are already standard in over 130 countries, making your new chip-enabled credit card easier to use around the world. When paying at a chip reader abroad, follow the same steps as you would in the U.S. (see above).

Please note:
You may be asked for a PIN rather than a signature when using chip card readers abroad. If this happens, you may be able to cancel the PIN prompt and complete the transaction. We also recommend that you carry an alternate payment method — like local currency — while traveling, as some unattended kiosks outside the U.S. may require a PIN.


Notice the words "may be able to cancel the PIN prompt." If you cancel the PIN prompt, you can probably bet the transaction will also be cancelled, but Chase won't tell you that.

It appears that Chase Chip cards are Chip-and-Signature only. You need a Chip-and-PIN card to work in un-manned kiosks in many places throughout Europe. Most U.S. banks will only offer Chip-and-Signature technology as of now. These cards most likely will not work in toll booths, gas stations, or public transportation machines in Europe.

I hear some U.S. Credit Unions, like PenFed, are offering actual Chip-and-PIN credit cards, that will also work as a Chip-and-Signature if that is the only option available.
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 02:20 PM
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<Bottom line as I see it, US chip and signature cards are of no more use to the traveller than a magnetic strip and signature card. >

We have had a chip/signature USBank Visa for several years now, and I disagree with the opinion stated above. In France, our experience has been that this card is accepted in situations when a mag strip card is not. We have used it in many shops, ticket machines for both Metro and rail, in some toll machines on some autoroutes, in parking garage payment machines, and in one fuel pump (a Leclerc in Gaillac). It did not work in other fuel pumps or some autoroute machines. I do have a PIN for it and was only asked for it twice, both times in parking garage machines. The Metro ticket machines did not require a PIN.

Our most recent experiences were in October 2013, so things may have changed somewhat since. We will go back this year and expect to use this card again.

On balance, I think it's definitely better to have a card with a chip than not to have one, even if there are still times it isn't accepted.
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 03:48 PM
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Maine, no offense but the bottom line remains the same. US cards suck anywhere outside of the US.

I don't know what you find acceptable but I want a card that works everywhere. If my bank offered me a card that works 'sometimes' but not other times and suggested I take some 'alternate payment method' as NYCFood quotes, I'd tell them to keep their card and take my business elsewhere.

Don't make excuses for US credit card issuers, tell them to provide what you need or you're going elsewhere for your cards. SOME true chip and pin do exist, get one. Read the link I gave, it lists some that do.

Did you know, the Obama administration recently issued an executive order requiring that federal agencies migrate to more secure chip-and-PIN based credit cards for all federal employees that are issued payment cards. They seem to realize it matters.

Read this for some examples of where your card can let you down. The writer gives some very good examples of the problems.
http://www.tripadvisor.ca/ShowTopic-...n_England.html

I don't understand this acceptance of an inferior product that can cause you trouble. It's like you are saying, 'I'm OK with an inferior product even though I know that better products are available.' Does that make any sense to you Maine?
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Old Feb 19th, 2015, 04:17 PM
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"It did not work in other fuel pumps or some autoroute machines. I do have a PIN for it…"

So here's the crux:

Who wants to order a new Chip-and-Signature card if there's a possibility it won't work when you need it in Europe? If you're driving, you never want to find yourself in a credit card toll booth lane with a card that does not work. Why take the chance?

Many U.S. banks will not issue a PIN for their Chip-and-Signature cards, because the cards don't double as Chip-and-PIN. You have to do research and often dig deeply with your bank to find out whether your new U.S. chip card comes with the PIN feature and automatically converts to Chip-and-PIN when you need it to.
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Old Feb 21st, 2015, 10:36 AM
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I can understand people not being aware of the differences in the type of cards available if they do not travel that much. But what I can't understand is anyone trying to defend using an old magnetic strip card or chip and signature card outside of the USA.

The answer to any question on this issue should be simple and universal. Get a true chip and pin card and it will work everywhere, every time. Not just SOMETIMES.

Have any of those saying 'you can get by', ever tried to buy gasoline on a Sunday in a rural part of France for example. Gas stations are often unattended on Sundays, they don't work on Sundays, they're civilized. You need a chip and pin card to pump gas! So there you are, out of gas and then what? Wait till tomorrow when someone shows up who may or may not choose to accept your mag strip or chip and signature card?

There is only ONE answer. Get a true chip and pin card.
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Old Feb 21st, 2015, 12:31 PM
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But what I can't understand is anyone trying to defend using an old magnetic strip card or chip and signature card outside of the USA

That's because others make a mountain out a molehill, on how they are embarrassed by the fact that they are holding up a grocery line or have to go to the ticket counter to purchase tickets (except in the Netherlands RR stations where the kiosks work with the debit card and the agents are not allowed to accept non-chip cards). I have not had any real problems with the non-chip card traveling throughout Europe. Only once was I stuck and needed cash--a new museum that had just opened in a small village had a new CC machine that had no magnetic stripe capabilities. That was a few years ago, and I have not run into that problem since.
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Old Feb 21st, 2015, 02:15 PM
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Sojourntraveller - If I were fortunate enough to spend more than a few weeks every couple of years in Europe, I would certainly have made an effort to acquire a true chip and PIN card. That not being the case, though, a few years ago now my existing USBank Visa card offered to provide us with chip/signature cards and I took them up on it. As I said in my previous post, it has not been a perfect solution, but I'm not inclined to let the perfect be the enemy of the good. I am glad to have the chip. As for your example about unattended gas stations, we were very happy to have our card work in a Leclerc pump during the last trip. I also understand that many chip/PIN cards from other EU countries do not reliably work for autoroute tolls or fuel pumps in France. There is certainly a lot of work to be done to perfectly integrate worldwide the systems that accept CC's, but after this year Americans with chipped cards will be somewhat better off than we have been. And, we can hope that we will soon have true chip/PIN cards more widely available.

Michael - We use our mag strip Capital One card whenever possible, but starting in 2011 it was refused in more and more places. Our chipped card has never been refused and does come in handy sometimes for using ticket machines, etc.
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Old Feb 21st, 2015, 04:19 PM
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>>Have any of those saying 'you can get by', ever tried to buy gasoline on a Sunday in a rural part of France for example.>>

Watch your petrol gauge and fill up on Saturday.
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Old Feb 21st, 2015, 04:26 PM
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Have any of those saying 'you can get by', ever tried to buy gasoline on a Sunday in a rural part of France for example.

I guess you'll have to rant about it for some time since it appears that many of the chip cards issued are not true chip&pin.
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