I just want to clarify... I in no way meant to imply that teachers have it easy. I agree with you about that particular comparison being like apples and oranges. What I meant by "quality of life" is that I was referring solely to wage, salary, benefits, vacations, sick days, etc. Not arguing about whether dealing with irate parents is worse than dealing with rude customers, or being groped is worse than having to walk through metal detectors when entering work each day. <BR> <BR>Personally, I think that teaching is a noble profession and that those who choose it regardless of low wages and the other parcels of trouble that go along with it are admirable. But I do have to admit that from my corporate workplace standpoint, having a summer off - whether to study, relax, or work - sounds wonderful...

My husband and I tip the same, no matter where we eat or what the amount of the bill is. In a diner it's 15% to 18% , it's 15% to 18% at The Ritz. Why should the server at Waffle House get any less and why should the server at The Ritz get any more? Granted, the time we spend at The Ritz is much longer than the time at Waffle House but the bill is much higher too, so the tip is much higher. <BR>My biggest complaint with tipping is not concerning food. My complaint is the tipping that is now expected every time I get a hair cut or my nails painted, a massage, a facial, etc. Those folks are not paid a small wage and in most cases are earning a large percentage of the fee for the service. Why then, if my haircut and style is $55 should I be expected to tip $8 bucks. If you figure the person is earning 50% of the cost of the service and the service takes about an hour, that puts them at appx $27 an hour. <BR>I just think tipping has really gotten out of hand when everything you do now requires a tip. I would love to hear comments on this and what other people do and don't do. I never want to be unfair, and I may not have my facts right, so please, inform me! Thanks.

On the teaching tangent: <BR> <BR>Wait staff and teachers both entered their trade/profession voluntarily. Appeals to sympathy for either are misplaced. Teachers should be paid more, but not because anyone should feel sorry for them. <BR> <BR>By and large, waiting tables in the United States is not a serious pursuit. Sure, there are exceptions in a small segment of the market, but mostly it's something that people fall into because it requires no education or formal training and, yes, the pay is disproportionately high under the circumstances. <BR> <BR>We (Americans) don't compensate based on how hard you work or how much good you do for society in case anyone hasn't figured that out yet. Mostly, the pros and cons, including average salary and benefits, quality of life, etc., are discoverable with a minimum of research before you decide what you want to do when you grow up. <BR> <BR>And then you change careers two or three times. God bless America. <BR> <BR>P.S.: And if you've ever worked in a restaurant, then you really know how your food can be treated, from before the truck dumps it on the curb to the time the waiter dumps it on your table. Face it, there is a suspension of disbelief required upon dining out, and the quality of service can make it or break it.

Tannya, <BR>Regardless of whom you choose NOT to tip, NEVER, EVER piss off your barber or your dentist!

I detest tipping. The restaurant's owner should pay their help. Why should I not only pay for my meal but for the waitperson's groceries?

Do I have to tip my dentist too? He makes a lot more than I do! How about tipping the teacher? A pissed off teacher can hurt your Grade Point Average.

Gerry, <BR>If you piss off your teacher, you can always become a waiter!

Les: <BR>Thanks for the advice. Think I'd rather be a dentist. He goes to Europe all the time. And my doctor! He just got back from a 4 month round the world tour. Partly financed by me. And they don't even have to worry about tips. <BR>But I'm afraid its too late for me to change careers. <BR>Time to get back on the topic? <BR> <BR>Gerry

Sjoerd: Remember that most waitstaff salaries in the US include neither health insurance nor retirement benefits (and as I'm sure you know, we have no national health insurance, and our Social Security [retirement income] payments are minimal if they're not supplememnted by a pension.) And of course, differences in income between countries reflect cost of living as well. Waiters' incomes vary largely, from just scraping by to the high five figures, depending on what kind of place they work in. <BR> <BR>Rita: Remember, though, that if tipping were abolished and restaurant owners paid for their staffs' groceries, the difference would be reflected in the prices on the menu.

for Cam <BR>

This is a fascinating discussion about tipping but you all missed the point of my original question. I wasn't asking about tipping waitstaff in a restaurant--I wanted to know what is an appropriate amount to reward a good tourguide who may have gone above and beyond during the course of an escorted U.K. tour; i.e. would 10 pounds be an insult? Is 25 pounds a fair amount? Is 50? Any advice on this specific question?

And my point, Cam, is that the anticipation of a tip - - I'll go one step further - - the failure of the management to state plainly "no tipping please" - - is an insult from management to its employees, and to its customers. <BR> <BR>It's as much as saying, "I cannot evaluate this employee, I cannot do the proper compensation research, and I will not provide a decent wage - - please, customers - - do it for me". <BR> <BR>(Neither) I (and likewise, any small contingency of customers) cannot change the whole world in any short period of time. NOT tipping some workers in the hospitality industry is the wrong answer in the present and immediate future. But maybe speaking out against the proliferation of tipping is proper. <BR> <BR>I think that if you believe in the dignity of workers, you can speak out against this antiquated mode of transferring the normal responsibility of owners and managers on to the backs of customers. <BR> <BR>I simply cannot imagine working in an environment where managers think so little of their employees and their customers. <BR>