gleaner

Well you have rendered me speechless .
I am so pleased you found Jane and Alex .
I had a niggling disappointing doubt that they may off gone back home to Scotland .(even thou i could not find them)
My other theory was also, had Jane died young as well,just like her sister Agnes and Joan (my grandmother) ,but i am glad to see she lived a long life 83years and 75 years for her husband Alex .So life in Canada must off been good to them .
So if Jane was not buried until 1963 her sons must of buried her with their dad .So the boys must of settled in Canada ,as i can not imagine them returning to Scotland after all that time ,surely !!
Maybe Alex's and Jane's sons ,Allan Wilson Barnes ,Alex Crombie JR Barnes and John /Jack Barnes ,eventually settle down and had families.
They would all be coming up for one hundred years old now ,in fact John would be over a hundred .
So out there somewhere they may be children or grandchildren still living in the Toronto area.This is all just to amazing to take it all in ,and i know i have said it before i truly do not know how to begin to thank you for all your help.I am so looking forward to meeting you.
I am now looking at July or august next year ,so i will get the flights booked soon ,i would rather it was September ,however my brother is a Teacher so he can not do term time .we will see,all i know is i can hardly wait until then .
By the way the only reason i asked about the Tree was because ,when we were researching family up in Scotland .We found in many of Scotland's grave yards there are loads of Yew tree's and we were told that it is a long standing tradition to have Yew tree's in Scottish burial grounds .So i just wondered if the Scottish folk had taken the tradition with them ,it was just my idle curiosity!
anyway i had better go as i have been on the computer since i came home from work ,Looks as if it will be fish and chips from the chippy for tea in this house tonight
regards liz

Morningglory47

www.twospadina.com is a website for that building. There are 22 apartments and they had a sign up for a one bedroom vacancy but the website doesn't reflect that so there isn't a photo on the site but maybe there will be soon.

I have to go out but did some more directory-looking this afternoon - Alan W. - there are two some years and some years none. One Alan W. in 1970 is VP of a company and the other is some sort of service technician. They seemed to move almost every year but it's impossible to tell if they had children. On the ship's manifest Alan is spelled with one "l"....so is that correct?

Alan is a year older than my mother who still lives on her own - you could check www.canada411.ca which is a phone directory for the entire country.

If there's a stone on the grave it may give information - it looked like rain today so I didn't go to the cemetery as that plot is further into the cemetery than I want to be if it starts to rain.

Alex Jr. must have left Toronto (or died but the cemetery only had the one Alex) as he doesn't appear up to 1977. The Alex on Logan Avenue was probably renting a room or sharing rent as the owners were two men with a (maybe) Polish surname. BUT the city directories at some point began to rely on the people in the homes filling in and returning information to the directory company and I'm sure some people just never bothered as almost everyone had a phone by then and they were in the phone book - the library has a lot of old phone books, too.

Surely one of them had at least one child!

I'll try and post more tomorrow or later tonight as I have to be off now.

gleaner

thought i would have a quick look before i head off to work and i have just printed off a list of phone number for A. Barnes ,fifteen in total in Toronto ,so not too bad ,so i will give the numbers a ring later when i get home . wish me luck .
Surely one of the three sons had ,as you said at least one child between them
I have Allan on his birth certificate by the way .With with two L's .Of course he was the youngest of the sons,Alex and John would be coming up to 100 or over in John's case.
anyway i must go as i am running late again ,i have a train to catch bye for now . Liz

Morningglory47

So these Alan W.s might be wrong ... nothing I found yesterday decides anything.

But I'll add a bit of what I found yesterday: (gee, they moved a lot!)

1965

Alan W., salesman, Rotor Tool Co. of Canada, h. 3 Longfellow Rd, Etobicoke
3 Jacks

The phone book listing for Rotor was Rotor Portable Pneumatic Hi-Cycle Tools, affiliate of Cooper Bessemer of Canada

1967

Alan W., Vice President, Rotor Tool Co., h. Apt. 301, 70 Dixfield Drive, Etobicoke (my cousin and her husband live in a house on Dixfield - I pass the apartment building on my way to research at the Mormons)
Al - salesman - Firestone Tire, 5 Bernard
No Jacks

1970

Alan W., Serv. Engineer, Transcopy Tor., h. #107,. 38 Thorncliffe Park Drive
Alan W., VP, Rotor Tool, h. Apt. 512, 2 Triburnham Place, Etobicoke (known as the Elmcrest Apartments)

1971

Same as 1970 -

1977

Neither of them listed but, as I mentioned, they might not have bothered to send in the reply to the directory company.

There were many Johns every year but probably John was Jack and it's just guessing who is who.

You're really going to phone all of them...wow. Good luck! Let me know.

Carolyn

Morningglory47

I googled Cooper and here are a few choices....if the phone calls don't work you might write to them requesting information on former VP:

http://bing.search.sympatico.ca/?q=C...&setLang=en-CA

Contacts
Have questions? Contact Customer Service at:
E-mail: [email protected]
Phone: 1-800-843-2763
or 1-973-882-1170
Mexico: 001-800-843-2763 Fax: 1-973-882-1717

gleaner

Well what on earth made me think that was a good idea!!
I phoned the first number and a lovely lady answered and there were no Allan's or Alex's for that matter ,she was very nice and wished me luck .I am sure she thought i was a little mad when she asked were i was ringing from .And she giggled a little saying she did not think it was a Canadian accent .Or Scottish!! i must of mentioned that my Aunt and her family were Scottish
However that call only took a couple of minutes ,so it was worth a shot .
The next call was a different matter altogether ,a charming, and very chatting elderly?Gentlemen answered and he chatted and chatted and chatted some more .(at this point my husband was blowing a gasket and looking at his watch )I think i will have to take out a second mortgage to pay the phone bill.
After a long chat with Andrew ,we established that he was the only" A Barnes" living at that address
HE had been to England ,in fact the South of England very close to where I live ,while he was serving in the Canadian Navy and based in ,I think he said Nova Scotia??
He came over here for some training with the British Navy ,or maybe to train the British Navy . And had always planned to come back one day ,with his wife and two boys .he was now a widower and i assume living alone and was simply thrilled to have some mad English woman to chat too (At this point my husband is slowly turning blue!!) and repeating the Bill !!That phone call has done nothing for hubby's blood pressure .
Any way to cut a long story short i decided after chatting to Andrew for twenty minutes (i just could not get off the phone)it was not such a wise idea to jump in and call all fifteen numbers with A Barnes.And if i do, only do a couple at a time so they do not all appear on the same bill .
So i have thought about it maybe i will write to them all and enclosing an stamped addressed envelope and an e-mail address and wait and see what come back .,if anything .
Of course i will send a postcard to Andrew as well ,just because he was lovely
However i am going to sleep on this idea and not rush in quite so fast .

Thankyou for the e-mail address for Coopers it has to be worth a try ,after all this i will probably find they were confirmed bachelors,or just never had time to have children as they were moving so often .
well i have to go as i have a pile of paperwork to completed by tomorrow .
And i am sure my mind will not be on it ,to busy giggling about Andrew ,until my phone bill comes in

Morningglory47

You made Andrew's day!

Morningglory47

As much FUN as calls to strangers can be, for ONE stamp you might be better off writing to Veterans Affairs and asking if the brothers served in WWII as we think they did...if they were married by then the names of wives would be listed as next-of-kin.

Getting a copy of Jane's death certificate would likely show next-of-kin and other useful information such as her address. Here's a link to the online form ... you won't even need a stamp: http://bing.search.sympatico.ca/?q=g...&setLang=en-CA

gleaner

Well everyone at work thought the Andrew story was funny ,i said i will come round with a collection box when the phone bill comes in .

I have just ordered Jane's Death Certificate and my husband also rang Prospect cemetery(i have a feeling he not to keen on me phoning Canada after Andrew) to find out what date Jane died The "1st January"only just in 1963 .What a date for a Scottish lady to die on ,at least she saw the new year in.
we needed date for the online form .
I put myself down as niece as there,was not an option for great niece.so lets hope that will give us some more clues .

i will contact the veterans affairs tomorrow but if it is anything like the U.K. you have to be next of kin or a very close relative to access any information on service records ,our national archive charge a small fortune to use as well .I have just ordered my Dad's army records ,that was my birthday presents from my sons.However with the Barnes story the family have not asked about my Dad for ages .
thanks again
Liz

Morningglory47

Veterans Affairs was pretty good when I ordered my mother's birth father's service record and now all the WWI attestation papers are online for free. With WWII, the person has to be dead for 20 years and then you should be able to get their records should there be any....if they served and if they've been dead that long.

I phoned Prospect today to ask if they had a John/Jack or an Alan but the woman who answered was busy and I never did get back to them.

The library has a website that, with a library card, you can bring up all sorts of information including death notices in the paper - I couldn't find one for Jane though which was disappointing. I'm going to check again. Those can be really helpful.

Morningglory47

Liz, Google Maps has Toronto online now - I just looked at 2 Spadina - it's the building with the 7Eleven on the ground floor. You should be able to find all the buildings family lived in.

http://maps.google.ca/?ie=UTF8&layer=c&cbll=49.31297,-123.140959&panoid=t-nC2GCvprCZ9Z102cPhrg&cbp=11,10.85,,0,0.8&ll=49.310 351,-123.125153&spn=0.111917,0.441513&z=11&utm_campaign =en&utm_medium=ha&utm_source=en-ha-na-ca-bk-svn&utm_term={keyword}

C

Morningglory47

I looked up several of addresses for your family - most would seem to be the same places they lived in but I think 539 Silverthorn might be gone.

gleaner

hi ,
i have just had a quick look at the new street scenes ,they are great ,we have only got the normal goggle maps for my home town,just had a look ,some parts of the U.K. have been done.
I have just had a quick look and the Palace arm 944 King St West isn't so bad ,nicer than i expected.

Well yesterday was one of those days when i hardly had time to stop,so i never had time to write to the veteran affairs so i will sort that out tonight and have a play with the goggle map checking out all the addresses you have given me.
bye for now Liz

gleaner

Hi Carolyn
I rang Prospect and they have no records for Allan,Alex Jr,or a John /Jack.So i filled out the veteran affairs paperwork with a covering letter explaining ,so now i will wait and see what comes back.
I had a play with the goggle maps ,aren't they great.Toronto is a lot greener than i expected.
I still have credits on my Ancestry account so i will keep looking,just to use them up and wait to see what i hear ,i will let you know if i find out anything of interest.
By the way have you had any luck with your other search ?good luck with that one ,hope you find him ,i am sure you will. regards Liz

Morningglory47

Hi Liz - my computer broke down - a friend just left - he fixed it so I'm back online - it's DREADFUL without it. I tried e-mail but can't get to it...which is beyond annoying.

Toronto is very green with lots of parks and miles of ravines.

I phoned Prospect, too, and they told me they had 8 John Barnes so I needed a date of death before they'd tell me more. What we really need from the cemetery is who took care of funeral arrangements but that would require a search of more than who is buried there. I hope Veterans Affairs works.

Thanks for asking about the search for my friend's FIL. I'm waiting for a marriage certificate for Mr. L's parents - they married in Pennsylvania in 1922. Mr. L has been in pain and a CAT scan showed a large mass which is cancerous; it doesn't look good for him - fingers crossed that I can find out what became of his father.

C

gleaner

Hi Carolyn,
I have searched for John and seem to be getting no where ,nothing seems to come up on ancestry or genes reunited .He was born in 1904 so would of been to old for active service i assume .So i am really hoping that Jane's death certificate or the veterans affairs come up with something,i have come such a long way with your help ,when you think i had not even been aware that i had another aunt in Canada other than Agnes .
I took the dog for a walk last night ,along our local beach and i stood and read one of the memorials,it has been there since 1994 and was unveiled by the Canada prime Minster of the time , and i have to be honest i have glance at it and never really thought about it before it is in memory of the Canadian troops that left Stokes Bay to go to the D.Day landings back in 1944 and i stood there last night and realized that my cousins The Barnes may well of left for Normandy from my local beach along with thousands of other young soldiers including my own father,who was in the Pioneers at the time and also left from Stokes Bay .

.
Isn't it awful when you lose your computer , Our Internet went down for two days not so long ago and i was lost .How on earth did we do anything before computers
I do hope you find your friends dad ,It is so frustrating waiting for certificates to arrive ,especially under the circumstances,i hope they get the pain under control for him soon ,It is so hard to watch a friend in pain .
so fingers crossed you get your marriage certificate soon with enough clues to trace his dad .
regards Liz

Morningglory47

I admire anyone who managed to trace their family before we had computers with online sources - but people did it for years and I've corresponded with one woman in England who still doesn't have one - she sent me a handwritten tree - I'm related to her distantly.

Morningglory47

Have you heard from Veterans Affairs or any other news on the family tree front?

I'm still waiting for the marriage cert for Mr. L's parents but, sadly, was told last night that he has just days to live so anything I do find will likely be too late.

Morningglory47

I just noticed that Ancestry has Ontario marriages by clergy 1896 to 1948 so searched for Alan, Alex and John Barnes - not one of them showed up...so that's disappointing.

One good thing I found on Ancestry today is that someone has added a family tree with one set of my Great Grandparents, my maternal Grandmother and her siblings....I've never heard of this person so hope she sees my comment on the site; she lives in Leicestershire.

On a sad note, Mr. L. died on Wednesday night. Still no marriage certificate from Pennsylvania.

gleaner

I am so sorry to hear your news about Mr L ,and such a shame the marriage certificate never came in time.At least you tried and Mr L knew you were researching for him .
Great news about finding someone on Ancestry and in Leicester too,now that sounds promising.
I have just discovered a couple of days ago that at my local library they have Ancestry available free of charge including the international membership ,i had not realized that when i paid for my credits to look for Allan,Alex and John Barnes .
Well i have not heard from The veterans Affairs as yet.However the British postal service is of and on at the moment .As our postal workers are staging strike action ,so i was very surprised this morning when i received Jane death certificate,
So here is the info i have, she died at "The Toronto Western Hospital" aged 89 years ,her home address was "377 Glenholmes Avenue York Toronto"She was a Canadian citizen, and had live in Canada for 34years (so she must off arrived around 1929/1930 time)
her son "Alan Wilson Barnes"was the informant and he lived at "3 Longfellow road Weston "and the funeral director was Cook funeral house 721 Bloor Street West.
So Alan(note the spelling,he has lost the second L)did settle down with a home of his own so maybe he and his brothers and maybe his sister did have families after all.
My other news is that my cousin found another box full of more old photo's and on the back of one of them is written " Dickie's(my mum's cousin was called Dickie) cousins in Canada and it is a picture of three young men and a young girl ,so maybe Jessie Ferrier Barnes (Jane and Alex's daughter )did also go to Canada with the family. i still have not been able to find Jane,John or Jessie for that matter travelling to Canada.
Annie also found a photo of Jean Barnes in Canada(written on the back) ,i am assuming that is Jane as Jane's often became Jean here in the U.K.
Annie is having copies made for me as her computer has broken down so i will have to wait a while.
So i am off to the library on Monday morning to search for the Barnes again.i will let you know how it goes..
bye for now Liz