Kyoto ryokan with private bath
Jan 14th, 2007, 05:13 AM
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Kyoto ryokan with private bath
My husband and I would like to spend our anniversary in Kyoto in early April and would like a ryokan with a private bath. The only ones I see with a private bath are Hiragiya and Tamahan. There are categories of A+++, AA+ and A for these inns with very different pricing. Which is the better of the 2? What is the differentiation between these categorization of A+++ AA+ etc? Are there any discounts in booking ryokan if I do it thru a travel agent or a website? How many nights should we stay at a ryokan? Is more than 3 too long? How much should I be paying each night for 2 people including keiseki dinner?
Thank you!
Thank you!
Jan 14th, 2007, 10:38 AM
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I spent considerable time researching Kyoto ryokans. I used the Japanese guest house web site and booked Tamahan for an evening in early April based on photos, trip advisor comments and comments on the Japanese guest house site. Whether one is better than another, I don't know. I suspect it comes down to personal taste and whether you "connect" with the photos and comments that have been made. We are planning on staying our last night in Kyoto there and the 3 previous nights at a western hotel. We are also trying, and I emphasize TRYING to book a night at Kansuiro Ryokan in Hakone for a night. They have not returned any of my emails. My next plan is to fax them. I was enchanted by a couple Kyoto ryokans that were in rural areas, but I didn't want to waste sightseeing time. Good luck, and I'm sure whichever you choose you will have a marvelous experience.
Jan 14th, 2007, 09:44 PM
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A typical deluxe ryokan or deluxe onsen hotel/ryokan is one or two days. The experience all happens inside the building...there is not time for sightseeing, nor should you even entertain the idea, as you will pay a high price for the stay so you should experience it in full.
Check in in the afternoon, you are served tea and given an orientation type talk. You will be asked about what time you'd like dinner served, what time you want a bath, what time you want breakfast (and perhaps what you want for breakfast), if you want a massage booking. You will be shown your room and the public areas. If your room has a bath, it will be a single tub which the staff will prepare for you...you can often choose what sort of bath you would like.
The public bath area in onsen hotels and some ryokan have a much bigger space with a variety of soaking tubs which contain different types of water, jets, varying temperatures... I wouldn't choose a ryokan on the basis of private bath availability as it will seldom be as nice a the public ones...if the bath interests you, definitely book an onsen hotel/ryokan as they have more bath facilities than a ryokan.
You will be very busy drinking tea for about an hour, bathing for about an hour, relaxing after the bath for about an hour, eating dinner for about 2 - 3 hours, having another bath perhaps, sleeping, waking, bathing, eating and checking out.
Japanese Guesthouses listings are just a very few of the possibilities that are available. Deluxe ryokan and onsen hotels are big business here, and there are magazines devoted to them published several times during the year for each area which are a great guide to pricing and facilities...perhaps if you have a Kinokuniya nearby they might carry some of them...I saw some in New York last year.
Japanese Guesthouses categories seem to be based only on price. There is not a rating system in Japan like that, although there are some places that are talked about as being in the top 5 in Japan for gardens, food, baths...etc.
I've used an agent once for booking a ryokan, and it involved paying in advance and getting a voucher. At that time, I trusted the agent and let her recommend a place for us, but it wasn't as great as she had said, and it was very expensive. In Japan, I've yet to find any booking service or agent that offers a better price than direct booking at hotels or ryokan or onsen ryokan. If you don't speak Japanese, e-mail or fax booking will be easier.
For a nice place with a kaiseki diinner, don't expect to pay less than ¥25,000/person/night, and that will not be deluxe. For very nice places with very personal service and amazing food and good baths I would expect the price to start at ¥40,000/person/night but probably be more. These prices are for the lowest room category. It's not been my experience that very nice places discount...they do offer special rate plans from time to time that offer different things included in the rate, which you will be able to see on the hotel's website.
I haven't stayed at Hiragiya or Tamahan, but they do both cater well to foreign guests and get good reviews. If the bath part is important to you, I'd encourage you to stay outside of the city in an onsen resort area.
Check in in the afternoon, you are served tea and given an orientation type talk. You will be asked about what time you'd like dinner served, what time you want a bath, what time you want breakfast (and perhaps what you want for breakfast), if you want a massage booking. You will be shown your room and the public areas. If your room has a bath, it will be a single tub which the staff will prepare for you...you can often choose what sort of bath you would like.
The public bath area in onsen hotels and some ryokan have a much bigger space with a variety of soaking tubs which contain different types of water, jets, varying temperatures... I wouldn't choose a ryokan on the basis of private bath availability as it will seldom be as nice a the public ones...if the bath interests you, definitely book an onsen hotel/ryokan as they have more bath facilities than a ryokan.
You will be very busy drinking tea for about an hour, bathing for about an hour, relaxing after the bath for about an hour, eating dinner for about 2 - 3 hours, having another bath perhaps, sleeping, waking, bathing, eating and checking out.
Japanese Guesthouses listings are just a very few of the possibilities that are available. Deluxe ryokan and onsen hotels are big business here, and there are magazines devoted to them published several times during the year for each area which are a great guide to pricing and facilities...perhaps if you have a Kinokuniya nearby they might carry some of them...I saw some in New York last year.
Japanese Guesthouses categories seem to be based only on price. There is not a rating system in Japan like that, although there are some places that are talked about as being in the top 5 in Japan for gardens, food, baths...etc.
I've used an agent once for booking a ryokan, and it involved paying in advance and getting a voucher. At that time, I trusted the agent and let her recommend a place for us, but it wasn't as great as she had said, and it was very expensive. In Japan, I've yet to find any booking service or agent that offers a better price than direct booking at hotels or ryokan or onsen ryokan. If you don't speak Japanese, e-mail or fax booking will be easier.
For a nice place with a kaiseki diinner, don't expect to pay less than ¥25,000/person/night, and that will not be deluxe. For very nice places with very personal service and amazing food and good baths I would expect the price to start at ¥40,000/person/night but probably be more. These prices are for the lowest room category. It's not been my experience that very nice places discount...they do offer special rate plans from time to time that offer different things included in the rate, which you will be able to see on the hotel's website.
I haven't stayed at Hiragiya or Tamahan, but they do both cater well to foreign guests and get good reviews. If the bath part is important to you, I'd encourage you to stay outside of the city in an onsen resort area.
Jan 14th, 2007, 10:15 PM
#4
One night is enough, three is too many. You will want to go out for dinner during your stay. It is my understanding that the better places don't offer lodging only rates.
You don't have to spend 40,000 pp for a great ryokan experience.
Spend some more time reading at the japaneseguesthouses website.
The japaneseguesthouses.com website says:
"<i>Ryokan Price List (Per Guest)
We have divided our ryokans into different price catagories. The catagories are to give you an idea of the price and is not a formal ranking system.
* Category D: 7,000-10,000 yen per guest
* Category C: 10,000-15,000 yen per guest
* Category B: 15,000-20,000 yen per guest
* Category A: 20,000-30,000 yen per guest
* Category A+: 30,000-50,000 yen per guest
* Category A++: 50,000-70,000 yen per guest
* Category A+++: 70,000 yen and up per guest
</i>"
You don't have to spend 40,000 pp for a great ryokan experience.
Spend some more time reading at the japaneseguesthouses website.
The japaneseguesthouses.com website says:
"<i>Ryokan Price List (Per Guest)
We have divided our ryokans into different price catagories. The catagories are to give you an idea of the price and is not a formal ranking system.
* Category D: 7,000-10,000 yen per guest
* Category C: 10,000-15,000 yen per guest
* Category B: 15,000-20,000 yen per guest
* Category A: 20,000-30,000 yen per guest
* Category A+: 30,000-50,000 yen per guest
* Category A++: 50,000-70,000 yen per guest
* Category A+++: 70,000 yen and up per guest
</i>"
Jan 14th, 2007, 10:55 PM
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Thank you all. With your suggestions, my plan is now to fly into Osaka and go directly to Kyota. Stay 4 nights at the Hyatt, 1 night at a ryokan (if I manage to find one). Spend 3 days sightseeing in Kyoto, 1 day in Nara and 1 day in Osaka. So how is this for plan? We know Tokyo but not this part of Japan at all.
Jan 15th, 2007, 07:11 AM
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What are you going to do/see in Osaka? Unless I had something specific that I wanted to do there, I'd spend that extra day in Kyoto or the other outlying areas instead of Osaka, esp. if I already had been to a large city like Tokyo.
Jan 15th, 2007, 07:53 AM
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k, that is unfortunate that you have not received any replies from Kansuiro. A couple of other posters on this forum have had the same experience. For some reason, when I contacted them, they were very prompt. I do remember being <i> effusively </i> polite in my emails. Lots of "I would be grateful if you could please..." and "Yours sincerely..." I don't know if that has anything to do with it! They are very nice in person though and we liked our stay there. Good luck!
