Best viewing for Cheetahs - which Country?
#21
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 708
Are you in the travel business?
No, I have never received a penny from any travel related business. I do know many people in the business in both EA and SA, quite a few of whom are now friends, and have done volunteer service at many lodges and camps in both regions.
In SA? I am not South African and do not live there.
Do you find it hard to believe someone who isn't in the business would disagree with you? I guess atravelynn must be a closet travel agent too since she also posted about Phinda.
If you want to post accurate information, then the most accurate information would be to include the names of the lodges you saw on the DVD, not "several fancy places" in SA.
Now to answer your question about the level of guiding in SA versus EA, my experience in East Africa is limited to the Serengeti, NCA, LM and Tarangire. Based on that, if I had to give an edge to one area it would be SA, but not by that much.
Now lets look at the question the original poster posed. Their dream is just to see a cheetah. I suggested Phinda because I know for a fact, based my personal experience having spent quite a bit of time there, that if they spent a few days at Phinda they would see cheetah. Not just a glimpse, but some quality time with them. It is almost a certainty. You, on the other hand have suggested a place where they may see more cheetah than anywhere else on the planet or may see none. I think my answer of Phinda is better for the OP, your answer would be better for someone who has seen cheetah and now wants to try to experience the ultimate in cheetah viewing.
No, I have never received a penny from any travel related business. I do know many people in the business in both EA and SA, quite a few of whom are now friends, and have done volunteer service at many lodges and camps in both regions.
In SA? I am not South African and do not live there.
Do you find it hard to believe someone who isn't in the business would disagree with you? I guess atravelynn must be a closet travel agent too since she also posted about Phinda.
If you want to post accurate information, then the most accurate information would be to include the names of the lodges you saw on the DVD, not "several fancy places" in SA.
Now to answer your question about the level of guiding in SA versus EA, my experience in East Africa is limited to the Serengeti, NCA, LM and Tarangire. Based on that, if I had to give an edge to one area it would be SA, but not by that much.
Now lets look at the question the original poster posed. Their dream is just to see a cheetah. I suggested Phinda because I know for a fact, based my personal experience having spent quite a bit of time there, that if they spent a few days at Phinda they would see cheetah. Not just a glimpse, but some quality time with them. It is almost a certainty. You, on the other hand have suggested a place where they may see more cheetah than anywhere else on the planet or may see none. I think my answer of Phinda is better for the OP, your answer would be better for someone who has seen cheetah and now wants to try to experience the ultimate in cheetah viewing.
#23
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,528
Hi Bill,
Thanks!!! Good to know the stats and sounds like the best possible cheetah destination. Maybe the CKGR may have sone good cheetah viewing also?
Being a fan of your photography, it does appear to me that you end up with quality sightings and that should be a telling factor about the serengeti in itself.
Good to hear about the cheetah watch program and hopefully, they keep up the good work.
cheers
Hari
PS:A lot of lodges in SA spend a lot of down time indoors during the siesta hour. You aren't going to see many cheetah kills that way, indoors!
We haven't been as lucky as Ken with cheetah kills at kwando. Seen only once in 5 trips. But, have seen two full on hunt and misses and that was almost as good!
Thanks!!! Good to know the stats and sounds like the best possible cheetah destination. Maybe the CKGR may have sone good cheetah viewing also?
Being a fan of your photography, it does appear to me that you end up with quality sightings and that should be a telling factor about the serengeti in itself.
Good to hear about the cheetah watch program and hopefully, they keep up the good work.
cheers
Hari
PS:A lot of lodges in SA spend a lot of down time indoors during the siesta hour. You aren't going to see many cheetah kills that way, indoors!
We haven't been as lucky as Ken with cheetah kills at kwando. Seen only once in 5 trips. But, have seen two full on hunt and misses and that was almost as good!
#24
Guest
Posts: n/a
In theory Namibia should be the best place for viewing Cheetah as it has the most, we have never seen a Cheetah there except in the"zoos".
A friend did see 15 in one group in Etosha, this is not a belated April Fool.
As for everywhere else it is a matter of luck, you can of course enhance your chances by going to places like Phinda. This was primarily set up to assist in breeding Cheetah by Tara Getty, no Hyena were introduced. This is not a zoo!
I also totally agree that there would be no interference in hunting there, nor from what I have seen at any other lodge in SA.
The only place I have ever seen behaviour of this nature is in the Mara, our guide refused to join in.
A friend did see 15 in one group in Etosha, this is not a belated April Fool.
As for everywhere else it is a matter of luck, you can of course enhance your chances by going to places like Phinda. This was primarily set up to assist in breeding Cheetah by Tara Getty, no Hyena were introduced. This is not a zoo!
I also totally agree that there would be no interference in hunting there, nor from what I have seen at any other lodge in SA.
The only place I have ever seen behaviour of this nature is in the Mara, our guide refused to join in.
#26
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 14,440
15 cheetah at once? That raises the question, what do you call that?
A chigger of cheetah? A congestion of cheetah? A conglomeration of cheetah? Or perhaps An Amarula apparition?
I just hope those 15 were all on good terms and produced lots more.
A chigger of cheetah? A congestion of cheetah? A conglomeration of cheetah? Or perhaps An Amarula apparition?
I just hope those 15 were all on good terms and produced lots more.
#28
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Posts: n/a
SAMARA sputh africa has got a very good cheetah population as well.
regarding namibia
it's right that
- estimated 5000 cheetahs of the world's estimated 8000 cheetahs in the wilds live in namibia.
- 90% of namibian surface is in farmer's/guestfarm's hands and that
- wildlife is a private asset in namibia.
taking all that into further consideration that cheetah hunting is still allowed - and unlicensed! - you can imagine how difficult it is to see cheetahs in the wild in namibia let alone that cheetah hunting is unethical as these gracious animals are on the edge of extinction!
regarding namibia
it's right that
- estimated 5000 cheetahs of the world's estimated 8000 cheetahs in the wilds live in namibia.
- 90% of namibian surface is in farmer's/guestfarm's hands and that
- wildlife is a private asset in namibia.
taking all that into further consideration that cheetah hunting is still allowed - and unlicensed! - you can imagine how difficult it is to see cheetahs in the wild in namibia let alone that cheetah hunting is unethical as these gracious animals are on the edge of extinction!
#29
Guest
Posts: n/a
#30
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 152
Thanks for all your reply's and suggestions, you have given me plenty to think about and research, some of which I have never heard of before.
As you have probably guessed the Cheetah is my favourite and I was very upset to read about the reports of some guides interfering with the hunt recently.
Roll on my next safari, in the meantime I will live my dreams in your trip reports.
As you have probably guessed the Cheetah is my favourite and I was very upset to read about the reports of some guides interfering with the hunt recently.
Roll on my next safari, in the meantime I will live my dreams in your trip reports.
#31
Guest
Posts: n/a
Pippa 13
Your response shows your lack of knowledge of the situation and also your failure to understand what is being said.
"Wildlife is a private asset in Namibia", what is that supposed to mean?
Most people know that the largest population of Cheetah is in Namibia they also know that the majority are on farms rather than within game reserves private or otherwise.
The vast majority of Cheetah killed in Namibia are shot by farmers following predation of livestock. Perhaps you should familiarise yourself with the work of CCF in Namibia and the use of Anatolian sheepdogs. Here is a link
http://www.cheetah.org/
Other than that most of the work being done to preserve Cheetahs is undertaken in South Africa, the very country that people criticise on this thread.
Your response shows your lack of knowledge of the situation and also your failure to understand what is being said.
"Wildlife is a private asset in Namibia", what is that supposed to mean?
Most people know that the largest population of Cheetah is in Namibia they also know that the majority are on farms rather than within game reserves private or otherwise.
The vast majority of Cheetah killed in Namibia are shot by farmers following predation of livestock. Perhaps you should familiarise yourself with the work of CCF in Namibia and the use of Anatolian sheepdogs. Here is a link
http://www.cheetah.org/
Other than that most of the work being done to preserve Cheetahs is undertaken in South Africa, the very country that people criticise on this thread.
#32
Guest
Posts: n/a
@sniktawk
Pippa 13
Your response shows your lack of knowledge of the situation and also your failure to understand what is being said.
"Wildlife is a private asset in Namibia", what is that supposed to mean?
...self explanatory
Most people know that the largest population of Cheetah is in Namibia they also know that the majority are on farms rather than within game reserves private or otherwise.
The vast majority of Cheetah killed in Namibia are shot by farmers following predation of livestock. Perhaps you should familiarise yourself with the work of CCF in Namibia and the use of Anatolian sheepdogs. Here is a link
http://www.cheetah.org/
...thx a lot for the link which is not really needed as i am a longtime supporter of l. marker besides africat and ccb.
Other than that most of the work being done to preserve Cheetahs is undertaken in South Africa, the very country that people criticise on this thread.
...regarding the SA effort to preserve cheetahs is not without questioning whether this is ethically done or not. breeding in captivity for captivity is highly unethical.
even de wildt does breeding for zoos. kapama the same!
so pls stop telling me things which are already known and which i did not question.
...maybe you can try to change your pre-occupation.
i haven't offended you. so pls stop offending me.
think this is a civiliced forum where everybody is entitled to an opinion. there is no need for you to understand me and vv.
do me favour and just ignore my postings.
#33
Guest
Posts: n/a
Pippa 13
Sorry I am late in responding to your latest tirade.
"Self-explanatory", well it is not to me, perhaps you could elucidate.
What is wrong with breeding for zoos would you prefer them to take animals from the wild?
Just where do you think the animals that are reintroduced into the wild come from.
Sorry I am late in responding to your latest tirade.
"Self-explanatory", well it is not to me, perhaps you could elucidate.
What is wrong with breeding for zoos would you prefer them to take animals from the wild?
Just where do you think the animals that are reintroduced into the wild come from.
#34
Guest
Posts: n/a
one last time......
What is wrong with breeding for zoos would you prefer them to take animals from the wild?
would eliminate zoos alltogether!
would also not put yanomami or aborigines behind bars just because they are at the edge of extinction!
it's a wrong attitude to think only because we are humans we are entitled to do anything we want and consider from our point of view "worthwhile" just to please us!
and pls don't argue with "education". we support ngos which care about snow leopards, moonbears etc. etc. without having seen one!
i would rather live one day in freedom than 1000 days behind bars - should also be valid for animals!
What is wrong with breeding for zoos would you prefer them to take animals from the wild?
would eliminate zoos alltogether!
would also not put yanomami or aborigines behind bars just because they are at the edge of extinction!
it's a wrong attitude to think only because we are humans we are entitled to do anything we want and consider from our point of view "worthwhile" just to please us!
and pls don't argue with "education". we support ngos which care about snow leopards, moonbears etc. etc. without having seen one!
i would rather live one day in freedom than 1000 days behind bars - should also be valid for animals!
#35
Guest
Posts: n/a
oops - missed one point:
re-introduction:
pls read some of the reports and you will find out that's always a matter of "tiral and error" messing around on the animals costs!
the more humans interfere the worse it gets!
protect them when still in their natural habitat.
taking animals from the wilds is out of a question of course. but i think that question anyway was just to fill space.
most safari goers (of who i know of) who have watched the big cats for example in the wilds simply cannot stand the fact that there are so many living a miserable life behind bars!
re-introduction:
pls read some of the reports and you will find out that's always a matter of "tiral and error" messing around on the animals costs!
the more humans interfere the worse it gets!
protect them when still in their natural habitat.
taking animals from the wilds is out of a question of course. but i think that question anyway was just to fill space.
most safari goers (of who i know of) who have watched the big cats for example in the wilds simply cannot stand the fact that there are so many living a miserable life behind bars!
#37
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 53
Bill,
Thank you for bringing a different perspective to the guide discussion. I'm sure there are poor guides everywhere and one of the shortfalls of this type of forum is that it is usually impossible to know if someone has a hidden agenda or vested interest. I guess I was fortunate on my safari since I didn't see that kind of guiding. It really is amazing given everything I've read before and after my first safari about what's proper and not proper on a game drive that so many ignore the common sense rules. I didn't see a DVD of someone picking up a monitor lizard - but assuming it's the same one did hear about it - and was surprised it happpened.
As for your pictures, keep up the great work, I love them.
Bob
Thank you for bringing a different perspective to the guide discussion. I'm sure there are poor guides everywhere and one of the shortfalls of this type of forum is that it is usually impossible to know if someone has a hidden agenda or vested interest. I guess I was fortunate on my safari since I didn't see that kind of guiding. It really is amazing given everything I've read before and after my first safari about what's proper and not proper on a game drive that so many ignore the common sense rules. I didn't see a DVD of someone picking up a monitor lizard - but assuming it's the same one did hear about it - and was surprised it happpened.
As for your pictures, keep up the great work, I love them.
Bob
#38
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 626
We really enjoyed the cheetahs in the Masai Mara. Had the privilege of seeing Honey with her cubs. The three sons continue to thrive:
http://maratriangle.wildlifedirect.o...iary-reappear/
Kevin from California
http://maratriangle.wildlifedirect.o...iary-reappear/
Kevin from California
