I do like the idea of driving between LA and San Fran on the pacific highway. Is it so hard to drive on this road for first time drivers abroad? Although we are young we are very sensible and surely have to do it for the first time one day?

How long is it advised to spend in all of these places? Where should we spend more time in LA/San Fran/San Diego? What are the must see places?

How long in vegas? Not too much into gambling but do like to party and would like to include a day trip to Grand Canyon from there.

And how long and main attractions on the east coast? Have been to New York once before but there are still things I feel I did not do and loved it there. Boston? Washington?

Also is it unrealistic to try and fit in niagra falls?

People are constantly cautioning Americans about how hard it is to drive in the UK, but many of us have done it numerous times and not had accidents. In either case you have to go slower than you would at home, have one of you do the navigating, use the pull offs to look at the view (don't do it while driving), etc. Just be very careful. I know some 22 year olds from this country I wouldn't want driving a road like that (or any where difficult). No one on this board can know if you are a good driver and basically a cautious person or not.

I think you need a minimum of 4-5 days NYC, 4 days Boston (a couple more and you could take some day trips to the New England Coast - via public transportation), maybe 3-4 in DC. You could of course spend an extra couple of days in each of them and I would if you can possibly afford it. Vegas you can easily see in 2 days plus one for the Grand Canyon tour. I think at least ten days for California if you are going to all three cities plus the drive down the coast. You say you have four weeks. So add in travel days (to and from the UK, from the east to west coast, between places) and that's pretty much your four weeks.

I do think it is unrealistic to go to Niagra Falls. It's a whole day drive from NY or Boston, boring on a bus. It would eat up three or four of you days and you don't have that many in all those other places which are far more interesting than the falls.

Sounds like a great trip.

As for renting and driving LA to SF, I would worry more about the freeways in LA getting to the coast hwy for people not used to 8 lanes of frantic drivers going too fast, too close, cutting in and out and on the opposite side of the road than you are used to drive. One day would not be enough for me to do justice to the coast road as you can't really go fast, would need to stop and take in the beautiful scenery and have to time it to when the "marine layer" (think thick fog) was not affecting travel.

A day or two should be enough for Vegas one or two more if you are doing GC too.

As with your past trip to NY the east coast places could take more days than your whole trip if you wanted to see everything.

Yes it is unrealistic to fit in Niagra Falls. It is pretty, but not worth the time.

If you're comfortable with the idea of driving the coast, and the cost of renting a car, I would take a day to get from San Francisco as far as Cambria, then a second day to get from Cambria to Los Angeles.

I agree with the number of days isabel proposed for each segment of the trip.

This might not be helpful, but my first thought when reading the proposed list was to cut New Orleans. As much as I love the city, it is the most out of the way. I feel like it would free you up a little, especially if you really are limited to 4 weeks.

>How long is it advised to spend in all of these places? Where should we spend more time in LA/San Fran/San Diego? What are the must see places? <

Only YOU can make that determination. What is it you want to see in New York? in Chicago? in California? California is almost 900 miles from the Mexico border to the Oregon border. Just in California, you can see mountains, valleys, deserts, sunny beaches with palm trees and rugged beaches with rocky cliffs; wine country; amusement parks........You might want to figure out what is most important for you to see and prioritize. If walking across the Golden Gate Bridge is really important, you might want to sacrifice Disneyland. Your present list of places to see is ambitious and exhausting. I did the same thing on my first trip to Europe. I saw a lot, did a lot, not sorry....but I was exhausted and perhaps would have enjoyed it a little more if I hadn't planned for almost every waking moment!!

If you do decide to drive the Pacific Coast Hwy from San Francisco to Los Angeles, just be sure to use the pullouts when you want to take in the gorgeous views, or when traffic is piling up behind you. Don't let traffic behind you make you speed up, just use the pullouts to let the other drivers pass by. We drive this route every couple years and there is always someone who insists on passing or tailgating no matter how well you are driving. It is a beautiful drive though, just be cautious and you will really enjoy it.

"How much time should we spend in all of these places?"

Huh? You don't have ANY time to spend in these places. You have 28 days, with the first and las days as flight days, so 26. You've listed 13 places, so one day in each locale gives you 13 days left. And you have to TRAVEL from place to place to place, which will take 13 days or more. That leaves you with ZERO days to linger/visit any one place.

I think you are coming this summer? If you plan to take a day tour to the Grand Canyon from Las Vegas you might want to take a look at a groupon alert I received this morning for a tour deal that will save you $91 each. I don't have any knowledge of this tour group and I've never done a day tour to the Grand Canyon so I can't recommend it based on personal experience. But it seems like a good deal and it's good until 11 July so I thought I'd pass it along. You have to sign up for groupon but it's easy to do.

www.groupon.com and then choose Las Vegas.

You started out sensibly. Making a large plan and then being flexible about cutting it back.

The question to answer your question is; what do you really want to see and do?

The Pacific Coast Highway is one of the most beautiful drives in California.

How do you feel about driving? It may cost a little more b/c of your age but are you a responsible driver? (notice I didn't say "good" driver, many people think they are good drivers but they aren't)

If you want to drive, pick up the car in Vegas and make a loop around the Western states. Picking up the car and driving out of Vegas to the GC will give you some experience in driving on the other side of the road. It's a desert. It's flat and pretty straight. Even getting to the GC you're not going to run into too many curves. It's the desert.

You're problem with the car will be in San Francisco. Plan to stay outside of the city at a place with free parking and BART in to the city. It'll save you some money and headache. OTOH, I learned to drive in San Francisco and it was an adventure, you may not want

Deciding between LA and San Diego is up to you. What do you want to see. Don't listen to other people in deciding what you should see. You have the internet, guidebooks etc, use them.

If you want to see the "highlights" in California there are lots of them. For instance in San Diego you have a world class zoo and there is the Wild Animal Park. Now, you have a choice Zoo or WAP?
Most people, including me, are going to say "pick the zoo" it’s convenient to Balboa Park which is interesting in itself. Maybe you go to the website and find out that WAP is having a "snore and roar" night where you can camp out at the park and have a mini safari experience.

Everyone tries to be an expert but YOU are the expert on YOU! Do your own research and please, come back and ask us the particulars.


My wish for you is that you become a happy traveler for a lifetime. If you start now, learning how to plan and make your own way, you'll be an expert.

>>

all great ideas but be sure to schedule a vacation after this vacation you will be tired

I agree with lsky about starting with a big plan,staying flexible,and then narrowing it down to what suits you.with that said i will throw out an idea. remember this is just to help start your planning. you could fly into L.A.(first thing I would do is call and make sure you can rent a car at your age)rent a car and drive to the places you mentioned san diego,las vegas,grand canyon.returning the rental to L.A.will
be the least expensive way.then take amtrak trains for the remainder of the trip.first to S.F.,then to chicago(48 hours by train)next to D.C.,on to N.Y. then boston.fly home from there.Remember this is just one possible framework.as you narrow things down people can get more specific on this site.

You asked, "How long is it advised to spend in all of these places? Where should we spend more time in LA/San Fran/San Diego? What are the must see places?"

sf7307 suggested 12 days total for for the above and with that I concur. And you said you liked her suggestion. Sooo, How about 3 days SF, 2 days down the coast, 3 days LA, 1/2 day to SD, 2 1/2 days SD? That's 11, giving you a 1 day margin to play with.

Here are some guides for things to do in those places.

San Francisco. (They don't like "Frisco").

http://tlc.howstuffworks.com/family/...city-guide.htm

Los Angeles. You can call us "El Pueblo de Nuestra Senora la Reina de Los Angeles de Porciuncula", or "Greater Los Angeles", or just LA. We don't care. This is Southern California and we're laid back.

http://tlc.howstuffworks.com/family/...city-guide.htm

San Diego.

http://tlc.howstuffworks.com/family/...city-guide.htm

With regard to "must sees", I have never been able to get my arms around that concept. If I tell you that the La Brea Tar Pits and the associated Page Museum is a "must see", and you choose not to go there, what happens? Whatever it is, it's frightening and unknown, so I will never use those words in a recommendation.

On the subject of the car rental "Young Renter Fee", Hertz apparently has been periodically waiving that fee as a "Special Offer". This is the current version, which expires on Jan.31. However, I know from googling to get to this page that this same offer has been made in the past.

http://www.hertz.com/rentacar/q-8010640/save-up-to-$25-a-day-if-you-re-20-24-years-old-special-offer

After Jan.31, go back to the Hertz home page and click on "Special Offers" to see if they have updated that fee waiver.

And BTW, other rental agencies, such as Avis, that I checked are very cagey about quoting the fee. They tell you to go to your local agency to find out. I consider that as a possibility that the fee is negotiable.

The fee, IMO, would not stand up in court, because it is clearly age discrimination by class. Maybe no young people have challenged it. If it were levied on us octogenarians, all H--- would break loose.

As others have said, a car is a necessity for seeing the West. I like LSky's post on Jan 6 about how to handle the rental car: pick it up in Las Vegas and drop it in San Francisco--you can circle back if you're going farther north.

Driving in LA is easy and a blast (as long as you stay off the freeways as much as possible but that's just because of the traffic jams) and the Pacific Coast Highway is one of the most beautiful drives in the world: I'd seriously think about driving north to Seattle, Washington and then coming back to San Francisco on I5.

Also, if you do decide to go West you must see the Grand Canyon regardless of whatever else you do. There's nothing else like it anywhere. Stay on the North Rim and allow a day or two, because once you see it (or more accurately, once you see the very small slice of it that you can see in a day), you're going to want to spend more time there.

Bon Voyage.