Sad update on: "finding New Eng. site for outdoor wedding"
Dec 30th, 2010, 03:56 AM
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Sad update on: "finding New Eng. site for outdoor wedding"
Some of you may remember the situation: my son and his fiancee were looking for a wedding venue that would allow dogs and alcoholic beverages (unrelated, separate issues, no drunk doggies). When we last tuned in, they'd found a spectacular beach house south of Plymouth MA with a kind owner who permitted them to rent for only a long weekend (not a full week). He'd helped them with details re: using portapotties, arranging parking, local motels, etc.
Yesterday was my son's birthday, and he and his fiancee received an email from the owner announcing that he and his wife were divorcing and their two houses were in foreclosure. He said he "was willing" to refund our $2500 deposit by check or money order "if" my son wanted the money back.
We told my son to get the money order STAT or even drive down to get the cash in his hand. Not sure he yet gets the peril here that assets may be frozen or accounts closed.
Of course, they are both quite upset -- fiancee wanted to go to the courthouse on New Years and be done with it. I'm sure the fact that all four future in-laws had met for Christmas and that there were a few moments of serious tension has nothing to do with that...... ;-) However, they are still mulling over their options.
Their options will be severely limited, however, if that money disappears (especially since DH's job is disappearing and there's nothing on the horizon for him at this point.... what a year!).
My Christmas present to them had been an artwork I made depicting the view from the house and they seemed more worried that I would be upset about that than getting the deposit back. They haven't watched enough Judge Judy, obviously, and don't realize that deposits can vanish with the wind in some circumstances.
So anyway, back to the drawing board re: date, style, venue, etc.
Sighhhhhhhhhhhhhh...... I'm so so so sorry for them - they've actually been working very hard to try to accommodate a lot of other people's wishes. Good kids. Didn't deserve this.
Yesterday was my son's birthday, and he and his fiancee received an email from the owner announcing that he and his wife were divorcing and their two houses were in foreclosure. He said he "was willing" to refund our $2500 deposit by check or money order "if" my son wanted the money back.
We told my son to get the money order STAT or even drive down to get the cash in his hand. Not sure he yet gets the peril here that assets may be frozen or accounts closed.
Of course, they are both quite upset -- fiancee wanted to go to the courthouse on New Years and be done with it. I'm sure the fact that all four future in-laws had met for Christmas and that there were a few moments of serious tension has nothing to do with that...... ;-) However, they are still mulling over their options.
Their options will be severely limited, however, if that money disappears (especially since DH's job is disappearing and there's nothing on the horizon for him at this point.... what a year!).
My Christmas present to them had been an artwork I made depicting the view from the house and they seemed more worried that I would be upset about that than getting the deposit back. They haven't watched enough Judge Judy, obviously, and don't realize that deposits can vanish with the wind in some circumstances.
So anyway, back to the drawing board re: date, style, venue, etc.
Sighhhhhhhhhhhhhh...... I'm so so so sorry for them - they've actually been working very hard to try to accommodate a lot of other people's wishes. Good kids. Didn't deserve this.
Dec 30th, 2010, 04:34 AM
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What bad luck for all involved. And regarding the 4 parents involved - it is a rare couple where their parents end up being friends. Easy for bride and groom to think because they love each other their parents should as well. As long as all can tolerate each others' presence at important events, consider it a success.
Your final paragraph is interesting - especially around the holidays when we all get sucked into trying to accommodate the wishes of others. Hopefully they get their money back and can move on and have a wonderful life together - with the attitude that the actual wedding is only a tiny percentage of time in that life.
Your final paragraph is interesting - especially around the holidays when we all get sucked into trying to accommodate the wishes of others. Hopefully they get their money back and can move on and have a wonderful life together - with the attitude that the actual wedding is only a tiny percentage of time in that life.
Dec 30th, 2010, 05:08 AM
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That is really too bad, and I really hope the money gets back to him. You are right on about that.
I don't happen to agree about inlaws not getting along--and pre-wedding tensions CAN be a big problem, but don't need to be a long term relationship problem. There are MANY reasons for it to be desirable for an amicable relationship, not the least being for grandchildren. I guess we are unusual--we have good times with children's inlaws. Everyone needs to make the effort, of course.
Sorry for all the roadblocks. I hope they can find a way to do what they want.
I don't happen to agree about inlaws not getting along--and pre-wedding tensions CAN be a big problem, but don't need to be a long term relationship problem. There are MANY reasons for it to be desirable for an amicable relationship, not the least being for grandchildren. I guess we are unusual--we have good times with children's inlaws. Everyone needs to make the effort, of course.
Sorry for all the roadblocks. I hope they can find a way to do what they want.
Dec 30th, 2010, 05:48 AM
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Re: all 4 parents. I didn't want to get into that because it's tangential (for the moment); and no matter how I put it, there will always be people who assume that the problem is the OP (me), with a Bad Attitude, there are "two sides to every story," and "it takes two." Yada.
I will say that there are so many differences between the two parent couples that it's pretty much a cross-cultural, cross-generational (we're the age of her grandparents), cross-regional, cross-sociological mismatch. Then add a problem with alcohol I already had been alerted to but hadn't realized how serious it was with Mrs. I.
When we arrived and were introduced to them, they remained sitting on the couch and looked at us only long enough to say "hi," and then went back to talking about back-home gossip. It never got better than that. I tried asking opening questions like "how did you like living in X city?" and "how is your mother doing?" (had a stroke last year) -- and would get a minimal answer with no eye-contact. There was no effort to have a conversation, no questions directed at us, although DH got Mr. Inlaw engaged in a discussion of unblended scotch briefly (otherwise, Mr. I stayed quiet and separate).
Otherwise, Mrs. Inlaw made it her menu, her kitchen, her party, and ignored our presence as much as possible, with her daughter rendered mostly her audience or sous-chef until the booze made her and daughter go all mellow and giggly back on the couch. We were to give them a ride back to the B&B DS paid for, and it took more than an hour to get Mrs. to agree the party was over and go quietly.
My son was put in the position of apologizing for the cold-shoulder, shut-out treatment, which was partly a relief (it wasn't my imagination nor was it anything we did or said) and partly concerning - since it's probably an issue of some tension between him and the sweet but overwhelmed fiancee.
And yes, before you even go there, I'm already worried about my dear future DIL's possible slip into her own alcohol problem, as I suspect my son is. But BOY is this ever an area where I need to keep my mouth shut! Like me, he's a teetotaler (biochemically determined), and I think that may keep the lid on somewhat. Crossing silent-parent-fingers on that one.
Rest assured, I'm very concerned that neither bride nor groom get stressed about The Parents and am doing all I can to give them lots of space and try not to let in-laws get to me.
I'm also concerned about getting the deposit back in hand because the trend of discussion (between Mrs. I and the couple) suggested strongly that she expected we would be paying the big bills without further involvement and that she expected to be the primary wedding planner and consultant. I detected a lot of diversionary maneuvers on her daughter's part, and felt for the daughter. The good news here is that Mr. and Mrs. Inlaw live across the continent, which probably keeps a lid on things.
But with unemployment looming, a rapidly failing mother, and my own health challenges, it was stressful to say the least. I'll be -- in all honesty -- relieved if all of us are NOT under the same roof for the wedding. Motels have much value sometimes.
So I'm trying to put the best face on the loss of the beach house and believe it's going to turn out to be much for the best. But so sad for them and their dreams of a gorgeous setting.
And no, I won't be surprised if the couple punts and gets married on short or no notice. I can be sad for myself, as mother of an only child, but it would be MUCH sadder for them if they can't have the people around them they'd so much looked forward to having -- The Parents, notwithstanding.
I will say that there are so many differences between the two parent couples that it's pretty much a cross-cultural, cross-generational (we're the age of her grandparents), cross-regional, cross-sociological mismatch. Then add a problem with alcohol I already had been alerted to but hadn't realized how serious it was with Mrs. I.
When we arrived and were introduced to them, they remained sitting on the couch and looked at us only long enough to say "hi," and then went back to talking about back-home gossip. It never got better than that. I tried asking opening questions like "how did you like living in X city?" and "how is your mother doing?" (had a stroke last year) -- and would get a minimal answer with no eye-contact. There was no effort to have a conversation, no questions directed at us, although DH got Mr. Inlaw engaged in a discussion of unblended scotch briefly (otherwise, Mr. I stayed quiet and separate).
Otherwise, Mrs. Inlaw made it her menu, her kitchen, her party, and ignored our presence as much as possible, with her daughter rendered mostly her audience or sous-chef until the booze made her and daughter go all mellow and giggly back on the couch. We were to give them a ride back to the B&B DS paid for, and it took more than an hour to get Mrs. to agree the party was over and go quietly.
My son was put in the position of apologizing for the cold-shoulder, shut-out treatment, which was partly a relief (it wasn't my imagination nor was it anything we did or said) and partly concerning - since it's probably an issue of some tension between him and the sweet but overwhelmed fiancee.
And yes, before you even go there, I'm already worried about my dear future DIL's possible slip into her own alcohol problem, as I suspect my son is. But BOY is this ever an area where I need to keep my mouth shut! Like me, he's a teetotaler (biochemically determined), and I think that may keep the lid on somewhat. Crossing silent-parent-fingers on that one.
Rest assured, I'm very concerned that neither bride nor groom get stressed about The Parents and am doing all I can to give them lots of space and try not to let in-laws get to me.
I'm also concerned about getting the deposit back in hand because the trend of discussion (between Mrs. I and the couple) suggested strongly that she expected we would be paying the big bills without further involvement and that she expected to be the primary wedding planner and consultant. I detected a lot of diversionary maneuvers on her daughter's part, and felt for the daughter. The good news here is that Mr. and Mrs. Inlaw live across the continent, which probably keeps a lid on things.
But with unemployment looming, a rapidly failing mother, and my own health challenges, it was stressful to say the least. I'll be -- in all honesty -- relieved if all of us are NOT under the same roof for the wedding. Motels have much value sometimes.
So I'm trying to put the best face on the loss of the beach house and believe it's going to turn out to be much for the best. But so sad for them and their dreams of a gorgeous setting.
And no, I won't be surprised if the couple punts and gets married on short or no notice. I can be sad for myself, as mother of an only child, but it would be MUCH sadder for them if they can't have the people around them they'd so much looked forward to having -- The Parents, notwithstanding.
Dec 30th, 2010, 06:29 AM
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Probably best for the young couple to get married soon and plan a party for later at a casual, beautiful, location .
Hopefully, all your worries will be worked out and you will have a wonderful relationship with the new bride, important for good relationship with the next generation.
It's about the marriage not the wedding.
Hopefully, all your worries will be worked out and you will have a wonderful relationship with the new bride, important for good relationship with the next generation.
It's about the marriage not the wedding.
Dec 30th, 2010, 07:51 AM
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I like the party idea a lot. Takes a LOT of stress off of everyone since Plan A has fallen through.
And make no mistake about my comments. Of course there are people/families who will not get along--and I thought that was to be one of our paths. But don't think I was directing it at you (OP). Our position has been that it is the children who are getting married, not the inlaws, and we can do "anything" for a little while.
AND it sounds as if you DO have your plate full.
I hope it works out well for the young people, as I know you do.
And make no mistake about my comments. Of course there are people/families who will not get along--and I thought that was to be one of our paths. But don't think I was directing it at you (OP). Our position has been that it is the children who are getting married, not the inlaws, and we can do "anything" for a little while.
AND it sounds as if you DO have your plate full.
I hope it works out well for the young people, as I know you do.
Dec 30th, 2010, 08:22 AM
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Their plan was, in fact, a party held on the grounds of the beach house -- which was to function in place of motels for the inlaws and with the advantage of a kitchen for the lasagna-bake crew. They never planned on a public ceremony - that would have happened a few days before.
I hope they can revive that plan in some form to their own satisfaction but if not, que syrup sera.
I hope they can revive that plan in some form to their own satisfaction but if not, que syrup sera.
Dec 30th, 2010, 08:40 AM
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As the mother of a newly-engaged young man, I am very sorry for your son and future DIL that they have to deal with this. I know my two would not react well 
I, too, love the idea of a small wedding now and a party when it's feasible.
As for the in-laws, we're lucky, we like ours (not best friends, but we certainly get along, very well). As for your's, well, fortunately, you won't have to see them very often since they don't live nearby. One thing I didn't get in your post, they expect YOU to pay for the wedding? Why is that (we'll be sharing the cost of our's).
Regarding the alcohol issue, just know that an alcoholic parent does not have to result in alcoholic children. My SIL is a recovered alcoholic (I'm not kidding when I use that word -- she actually has a glass of wine now and then) and neither of her children exhibits any such tendencies. Same for my cousin, whose father (my uncle) was an alcoholic.
I, too, love the idea of a small wedding now and a party when it's feasible.
As for the in-laws, we're lucky, we like ours (not best friends, but we certainly get along, very well). As for your's, well, fortunately, you won't have to see them very often since they don't live nearby. One thing I didn't get in your post, they expect YOU to pay for the wedding? Why is that (we'll be sharing the cost of our's).
Regarding the alcohol issue, just know that an alcoholic parent does not have to result in alcoholic children. My SIL is a recovered alcoholic (I'm not kidding when I use that word -- she actually has a glass of wine now and then) and neither of her children exhibits any such tendencies. Same for my cousin, whose father (my uncle) was an alcoholic.
Dec 30th, 2010, 09:51 AM
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aww that's a shame! Back to square one. And so they grow as a couple and learn to roll with the punches. Hope plan B comes into play soon. And as they ring in the new year together as a couple they can laugh and love and know that it's all good.
Dec 30th, 2010, 10:48 AM
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If I were you I would look at this as all for the best. It sounds like the situation planned would have been incredibly stressful for you and the young couple. It sounds as if all living together in one hose would have been a recipe for disaster.
My B and SIL decided to elope - sadly for us, but probably best all around. Her poor father was a totally downtrodden, silent blob of humanity and her mother was absolute hell on wheels. (She insisted that my B was the cause of her daughter's divorce - even though they didn;t meet until 2 years afterward - and her addict husband had chosen to divorce her. Until the day she died - 12 years later - she never addressed a civil word to my B or anyone in the family - and insisted her daughter was living in sin. the only remarks she made were AT my B or the rest of the family - and dealt with sin, leading her daughter astray and similar topics.
So they eloped and had a large family gathering later - which my SIL's parents refused to attend - to the relief of everyone else in both families.
My B and SIL decided to elope - sadly for us, but probably best all around. Her poor father was a totally downtrodden, silent blob of humanity and her mother was absolute hell on wheels. (She insisted that my B was the cause of her daughter's divorce - even though they didn;t meet until 2 years afterward - and her addict husband had chosen to divorce her. Until the day she died - 12 years later - she never addressed a civil word to my B or anyone in the family - and insisted her daughter was living in sin. the only remarks she made were AT my B or the rest of the family - and dealt with sin, leading her daughter astray and similar topics.
So they eloped and had a large family gathering later - which my SIL's parents refused to attend - to the relief of everyone else in both families.
Dec 30th, 2010, 01:03 PM
#13
Cyanna, you have my empathies. After our Daughter's problems with the future in-laws meddeling, my only requirement was that their mother and I be able to attend the wedding.(two daughters)It worked to alleviate their stress and both weddings went off without a hitch. Good luck to all of you.
Dec 30th, 2010, 03:17 PM
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These "kids" should be focusing on their lives and economic situation, not other parties' interests. I'm with nytraveler, this is probably a good outcome given their situation (assuming they get their deposit back). Fiancee sounds like she has a good head on her shoulders.
Good luck to them both as they start their lives together and hopefully they won't let the baggage of the previous generation affect them. No offense meant to the OP - sounds like these "kids" need to deal with their own lives as they see fit.
Good luck to them both as they start their lives together and hopefully they won't let the baggage of the previous generation affect them. No offense meant to the OP - sounds like these "kids" need to deal with their own lives as they see fit.
Dec 31st, 2010, 04:19 AM
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No offense meant to the OP - sounds like these "kids" need to deal with their own lives as they see fit.
Someone always feels compelled to say this kind of thing, but if you read everything I wrote, Brian, I think you'll see I've been bending over backwards: to keep my mouth shut and go along with whatever they plan; to facilitate that plan by contributing money we can not easily spare but want them to have to do with as they wish; give them time and space alone with her parents because I know what it's like to have the "cross-cultural" tension of having both sets of inlaws together; encourage them to do whatever they want to do and thank them for including us. The only way I could be staying MORE out of their way would be to keep our money out of it and refuse to attend.
Or is it just my occasional use of the term "kids" to refer to them that bothers you? I'm very proud of my "only kid" who has been financially independent since graduating from college and, after a few years working, is now back getting a very challenging PhD -- again, with no help from us. Although very young - 8 yrs. younger than he is - she works hard and sometimes seems more mature than he is (no addiction to videogames, for example). While having trouble finding a full-time job, she has been working very, very hard at several contract tutoring jobs. We get a visit about once a year and occasionally it's been longer than that.
My grandparents referred to my parents as "the kids," my mother refers to our generation (50s and 60s) as "the kids," but believe me, there's no infantilization there... consider it a family quirk.
I know you said you meant no offense - but I don't think you're reading the situation right. Just because I really feel bad for this tough break doesn't mean I think they blew it or need anyone to swoop in and solve the situation.
To you and to others: I absolutely agree that, after all, this might actually be very MUCH for the best. But they had a dream -- and if you saw pictures of the place, you'd understand how much she wanted to see herself in her dress under the flower-covered trellis in front of the ocean, with families surrounding them in completely conflict-free celebration. Would have been nice.
Someone always feels compelled to say this kind of thing, but if you read everything I wrote, Brian, I think you'll see I've been bending over backwards: to keep my mouth shut and go along with whatever they plan; to facilitate that plan by contributing money we can not easily spare but want them to have to do with as they wish; give them time and space alone with her parents because I know what it's like to have the "cross-cultural" tension of having both sets of inlaws together; encourage them to do whatever they want to do and thank them for including us. The only way I could be staying MORE out of their way would be to keep our money out of it and refuse to attend.
Or is it just my occasional use of the term "kids" to refer to them that bothers you? I'm very proud of my "only kid" who has been financially independent since graduating from college and, after a few years working, is now back getting a very challenging PhD -- again, with no help from us. Although very young - 8 yrs. younger than he is - she works hard and sometimes seems more mature than he is (no addiction to videogames, for example). While having trouble finding a full-time job, she has been working very, very hard at several contract tutoring jobs. We get a visit about once a year and occasionally it's been longer than that.
My grandparents referred to my parents as "the kids," my mother refers to our generation (50s and 60s) as "the kids," but believe me, there's no infantilization there... consider it a family quirk.
I know you said you meant no offense - but I don't think you're reading the situation right. Just because I really feel bad for this tough break doesn't mean I think they blew it or need anyone to swoop in and solve the situation.
To you and to others: I absolutely agree that, after all, this might actually be very MUCH for the best. But they had a dream -- and if you saw pictures of the place, you'd understand how much she wanted to see herself in her dress under the flower-covered trellis in front of the ocean, with families surrounding them in completely conflict-free celebration. Would have been nice.
Dec 31st, 2010, 11:05 AM
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Wow, I just read the dinner party story. I think having the beach house cancelled, although it sounded lovely is a blessing. A weekend under the same roof with the newlyweds and the in laws seems to have lost all appeal after that.
Dec 31st, 2010, 11:50 AM
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joesorce, uncalled for swipe at "mommies." Again, the meddling here has been limited to writing a check, I promise you. I'll even get a letter from my son........ You should have been a fly on the wall while Mrs. Inlaw went on at length telling her daughter what paper, what colors, what centerpieces, etc. ..... while I took the dogs for a walk. I know that's the recommended behavior for mother-of-the-groom anyway, but so far the only subsidy for the wedding has come from us.... don't consider that "buying" any right to meddle but I felt we were completely invisible as far as Mr. and Mrs. I were concerned.
Kealalani, you're absolutely right. I'm waiting to see what they come up with, but it'll be an honest relief if it's a JoP handshake at this point.
Kealalani, you're absolutely right. I'm waiting to see what they come up with, but it'll be an honest relief if it's a JoP handshake at this point.
Dec 31st, 2010, 01:51 PM
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I agree that Joe overstepped. When planning our DD's wedding, I began to probably overreach, and she said quietly, it's my wedding. "Nuff said. I ran EVERYTHING by her and it was beautiful.
I think it is pretty tacky that the bride's family is not offering anything, and don't understand at all, except that they don't have any manners.
Weddings are SO stressful, and you have taken the high road. Your son should also think about asking his fiancee what her parents might like to contribute--but I don't see this happening at this point. I think the die was cast when the house was found and the possibility there. IF the bride "could see herself" etc., she should have been talking to her parents.
We footed a lot more than the reception bill for DD's wedding--it just happened that way, but at least there was "some:" desire on their part to support the festivities.
Move on. You are fine, lest you need "our" badge of approval.
BUT your DS needs to be aware that his wife is able to walked all over, to your detriment. I have some tangential experience with this, and it is not a good thing--and if he doesn't get some backbone and communication with her about it, it will be trouble. Have two very sad experiences with it--fortunately at a distance. BUT it has NOTHING to do with anything you can do. I hope he and she see it, and deal with it.
AND I totally agree that her possible alcohol dependency has NOTHING To do with her mother--it could be a turn off.
I think it is pretty tacky that the bride's family is not offering anything, and don't understand at all, except that they don't have any manners.
Weddings are SO stressful, and you have taken the high road. Your son should also think about asking his fiancee what her parents might like to contribute--but I don't see this happening at this point. I think the die was cast when the house was found and the possibility there. IF the bride "could see herself" etc., she should have been talking to her parents.
We footed a lot more than the reception bill for DD's wedding--it just happened that way, but at least there was "some:" desire on their part to support the festivities.
Move on. You are fine, lest you need "our" badge of approval.
BUT your DS needs to be aware that his wife is able to walked all over, to your detriment. I have some tangential experience with this, and it is not a good thing--and if he doesn't get some backbone and communication with her about it, it will be trouble. Have two very sad experiences with it--fortunately at a distance. BUT it has NOTHING to do with anything you can do. I hope he and she see it, and deal with it.
AND I totally agree that her possible alcohol dependency has NOTHING To do with her mother--it could be a turn off.
