Does anyone else dislike the "dressing down" of America?

When I go to a nice restaurant, I don't go overboard, but I do wear nice pants and (in the winter) my husband wears a coat, usually without a tie. When we're seated next to a table of folks wearing jeans, it's a little disconcerting.

The last time we were in Commander's Palace in NO, I was shocked to see that coats and ties were no longer necessary for men.

What's up with that? This is a subject that I've thought of off and on for several years, but when I saw the post about "what to wear to a Broadway show" it brought it back home.

Does anyone else miss the old days when people dressed up a little more?

This might be a question of age

Don't get me wrong...I don't want to wear a dress, but I do wear nice and/or dressy pants and am fairly irked when I show up someplace and find myself surrounded with folks in jeans.

Yes, yes, I know some of those jeans cost a couple of hundred dollars, but I don't care. They're JEANS!

Yes - I have a problem with dressing down too.

Not that everyone should be in suits and ties all the time - but somehow business casual at work has evolved from collar shirt (or polo shirt) and slacks for men to ratty tee shirt, jean and sneakers. And the women are worse - looking like they've escaped from the Britney back up dancers. Ad agencies were always more casual - but tube tops and cut off jeans are NOT appropriate.

As for going out to dinner - if you've just cleaned out the garage (or are dressed as if you did) stick to fast food places or a diner. I don't want to be paying $100 for a nice dinner and have to eat it looking at some guy's hairy bare legs or armpits. I'm not suggesting a suit and tie - but if you won;t wear - or don't own - a shirt with a collar, a pair of full length pants (as in khakis or cords or something) and a pair of real shoes - please stay out of nice restaurants.

I was on jury duty a couple of years ago and 2 young women were sent home - and told their missed day didn;t count - due to their attire. One had on a tube top and super mini skirt (and frankly looked as if she should be standing on a corner on 12th Ave) and the other had on a low cut halter and shorts so short her (sizeable) bottom was partially visible. They were both astonished when told their attire was not accepetible.

What is the matter with these people?

I used to buy into the thinking that people felt better about themselves and even performed better if they dressed nicely. Tell ya what; I'm happy to say I wore jeans to the office today. And my performance here sucks no worse than if I'd worn a suit and tie.

So, when I'm in situations where I see others dressed in ways I don't think appropriate, I ask myself, is it me or them who has the problem.... Unless they're breaking the law, I usually land on me.

I agree with the two of you. And, I believe it is worse on the west coast than the east coast. I find it especially glaring at concert and theatre venues.

Funny story. We have one long time restaurant in town that STILL requires jacket for men in the main dining room, although you don't need one to eat in the other two main rooms or the bar. Not long ago we joined friends (with our jackets) for dinner in the main dining room. I couldn't help but notice all the 70 year olds in 20 year old polyester or bright colored silk sport coats, or in a couple cases pastel polyester leisure suits that had to be 30 years old. In the bar were a lot of younger men, some wearing beautiful and expensive designer shirts and nice slacks and $400 shoes.

I've finally gotten over the old idea that simply wearing a jacket makes a man "better dressed".

But in all honesty, Susan, I'm with you. I don't care what jeans cost, I still think they're jeans and don't belong for fine dining.

And I do miss the days of dressing up for nice occasions, including the theatre.

Aaahhh, Susan, you're right on the money. Sneakers, jeans and ball caps. Indeed, I do wear the latter two on occasion (though not the former.)

Many years ago, I worked in a coat and tie. I didn't mind it. Indeed, I thought I looked good. And I'm virtually certain I was a better worker.

I find distressing, too, that this sloppy mindset has gone over to the military. I was in the USAF. And wore a blue uniform most days. (Ask my wife--she'll tell you she was a sucker for a boy in blue!) And too, in those days, the air policeman on the gates were sharp: Pressed blouse and trousers, white helmet and uniform accents. Stood tall, we did. Somewhere along the line, it seemed to all go away. I believe it was the identification with the "Warfighter," the pointy end of the stick, as it were. Those guys need an appropriate, fatigue-type uniform. But chairborne support folks--no, not really. And I cringe every time I see an Army 3 or 4-star on TV, or testifying somewhere in fatigues.

'Tain't right....

No, I don't mind at all, but I live in Seattle, so that explains it, huh? I do dress up when I go to the opera or ballet or a really nice restaurant, and a bit when I travel in Europe (and NYC), but it doesn't bother me that other people don't. I've been at the opera in Florence and ballet and concerts in Paris, etc. etc. where people (adults, not just students) have been in jeans, and really, it doesn't bother me. I'm happy to be wearing something "dressy" for a change, but really, why should how anyone else is dressed bother me?

It's this dressing down habit that gets people to asking (on the Europe forum) endless questions on what they should wear (or more accurately, what they can get away with) when visiting churches in Italy.

"why should how anyone else is dressed bother me?"

Well, call me funny, but if I'm spending several hundred dollars for a really great meal in what is supposed to be a really great restaurant, and the draperies next to our table are old, faded, and have holes in them -- or if the chairs or carpet are worn then I'm not happy. In fact if the furnishings look cheap and appear they belong in a cheap fast food place, I'm equally less impressed. I am bothered by my surroundings. So why shouldn't I be equally "bothered" by the atmosphere if the people next to me are in shorts and tank tops or work clothes that look stained, or have flip flops on smelly feet? They too are part of the ambiance and atmosphere of the restaurant.

Well, I still wear my gloves, girdle, nylons and hat whenever I eat out!

I am guilty as being in the front ranks of casual dress. I hate most dress clothes and if the clothes are neat and clean, what difference does it make. I am not at a restaurant to please the other diners but to amuse the others at the table abd please the palate.

I worked for the last fifteen years at the bastion of suit and ties. It is uncomfortable and constricting. I wear black jeans and for an expensive restaurant with a tailored shirt. And if a restaurant requires a jacket and tie, i just might go elsewhere.

As far the theatre is concerned, the players and actors do not care what you wear.

I first really noticed "dressing down" in Florida.
We liked this Bistro that was really a very good restaurant..not cheap, and everyone wore shorts..well, not everyone, you would have known which ones were Scarlett & family ~
But Portland Oregon ( as much as I love it there) took the Prize for Dressed Down.
Going to see a visiting Russian Ballet company, there were women in ballgowns..(going a little too far but at least they made the effort) and people in flannels and gortex etc..

I am now in a foreign country and enjoy dressing like a grown up in the city every day and I have now realized that I can spot Americans often..by their headwear ??
When did America become such a Hat Happy Country?
I know baseball hats are popular, I know bald/balding men love them...but I am seeing some funny looking hats and a lot of cargo pants with a zillion zippers and pockets..this isn't the Sahara or a jungle, it is a city..lol.

People think it is "old fashioned" to get dressed for occasions.
I have become Old Fashioned

"I am not at a restaurant to please the other diners."

Hmm. Interesting concept. So then it would be all right if you left your cell phone on or talked loudly? Or if you and your companions talked in loud voices? Or got up and walked around the table?

I find it hard to believe that most people don't do a number of things purposely for the benefit and comfort of those around them in a nice restaurant. It's simply called good manners or good breeding. It seems that dressing appropriate to the restaurant in consideration of the guidelines of the place or the comfort of the other guests would be no different than your decorum at the table.

Patrick, (re: decorum)
I remember years ago in NY, having dinner with a bunch of people. One woman, beautifully dressed, sat and talked a bit loudly but otherwise seemed well-mannered.
All of a sudden, she reached over to her husbands plate and picked something off with her hands and popped it in her mouth..like an asparagus or something.
There was this little pause...then everyone continued but I couldn't wait to tell my mom LOL
( Her English grandmother used to poke her in the back with a fork at the table if she slouched)...

If you want the best table in the house, dress up, otherwise you'll get the water closet seat.

I do like dressing like a girl on occasion and stepping out with my duded up guy.

On the one hand, I'm thrilled that "business casual" or "dressy casual" will take you anywhere nicely. And, it's great when we happen by a really nice place but my husband is wearing a dress shirt and sweater and not a jacket and tie. I appreciate not feeling like I should have worn a dress and heels.

I agree, though, that jeans are jeans. "Dressy" jeans? "Smart" jeans? "Nicer" jeans? What are these people talking about?

I just wish people would dress as nicely as the place they're visiting.

To me, it's awful when people wear jeans, worse shorts, to a restaurant where the waiters are dressed in tuxes.

The owner of a very nice restaurant told us years ago that he stuck to the "jacket and tie" requirement until he was just turning too many "covers" away and couldn't afford that.

One time, we returned to our hotel room to change for dinner. Just as our food was being served, a party in shorts was seated at the next table. I didn't mind that so much, as the hairy legs and dirty feet the guy next to me would not put under the table.

I know some "traditional" (aka stuffy) restaurants have been remodeling to make them more have a more trendy and modern feel. One of them being the Mansion on Turtle Creek in Dallas. It has been a famous restaurant for decades, one of these dinasaur restos. Last year, they finally remodeled and got rid of tablecloth, as well as the "jacket required" dress code in order to attract the younger crowd.

I personally don't mind that in restos. In fact, I'd rather dine at a modern/trendy place than a stuffy white-gloved resto where man has to wear a jacket - if both places have similar quality of food.

Of course there should be an unspoken dress code if the resto charges $15 for apps and $30+ for entrees - diners should not be wearing ripped T-shirts or ripped jeans or flip-flops.

For shows & the symphony, I still dress up (ie no jeans). But given the fact that I now live in Boston and have to walk quite a bit (unlike Dallas where we drive everywhere), I just can't wear those 3" heels anymore.

I just remembered our dining experience last weekend in Boston. DH & I met up with my SIL for dinner at a fairly nice, mod-priced French Bistro. I have eaten there before and I'd say folks who go there tend to dress pretty smart.

Well, it was the night before the Boston Marathon and the resto is right near the hotels & finishing line, so there were MANY tourists/marathon runners eating there.

What I'm gonna say next will make me sound like I'm stereotyping, and I am. Most of these folks show up in T-shirts, shorts and running shoes. Totally NOT appropriate for a French Bistro!

The only time I'll let DH wear shorts to a restaurant is if we're going for cheap Asian food, or a bar for burgers/beer.

I can honestly say that I never, ever notice what other people are wearing unless it is obscene and attracting attention. I really could not care less.
The only exception would be seat mates on planes. No toes showing (even toes in strappy Manolo sandals) no armpits (sleeveless, even if wearing a 500 sundress).

Yes, I notice it.

While I believe in freedom of speech and freedom of dress, I also feel free to have and dress to my own taste.

So, I like to dress nice for nice places and special events. I like to see other people dressed nice at those places and events.

And I do see a lot less of it than I once did.

My clothing peeves are -

High waisted boxers/thongs combined with low waisted jeans/slacks. I'm not conservative or shocked by the sight of a backside. I dislike the sloppiness of it and endless repositioning that goes with it. I know its in style and anyone over 20 is intended to not like it.

Short crop/halter tops combined with very low rise jeans/slacks on people who have rolls of extra, well, body in between. Its like advertising ones sedentary lifestyle and/or excess eating. Not a crime, and I'm not perfect. I don't like to look at it. I wonder if the people who do it think its really attractive or follow style more than sense.

Finally, am I the only one who's noticed that teen/twenty ish girls are wearing less and less while teen/twenty ish boys are so swaddled in extra cloth that it's impossible to tell if they are fit and trim (read have a nice body) or not. Not a fair deal for the girls, I think. Time was everyone had some idea what they might be dating by looking.

Anyway, it's not a big deal to me. Yet, I do like to see people dressed nicely.