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Tourists ripped off by Transport for London

Tourists ripped off by Transport for London

Feb 20th, 2007, 08:14 AM
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Tourists ripped off by Transport for London

According to this writer:


In defense of TfL, it should be pointed out that Oyster Fares and Travelcards are still pretty good deals. It's only the single fares that have doubled and tripled in the past couple of years. And that's not to rip anyone off - it's to encourage (okay, coerce) people to go Oyster, which will save TfL millions in salaries, equipment, and paper...which costs they won't have to pass through to customers.
Robespierre is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 08:19 AM
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And according to London papers last week when i was there the Oyster Card also can result in excessive fees if the user forgets to scan it upon exiting the system at stations that don't have automatic exit gates.
And most Overground train lines, though they participate in TravelCard schemes, also don't have facilities for scanning the Oyster Card yet, though i guess within a year most were. This is why for me, staying at suburban Lee, where only the Overground trains run and there were no Oyster Card scanners i had to buy regular TravelCards, which were OK as the Oyster Card would have capped me off at the same price once i obtained the TravelCard price, though i guess at 50 p or so cheaper as TravelCards are cheaper when bought with Oyster cards.
PalenQ is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 08:22 AM
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<<< The uproar from Londoners who use public transport everyday has been huge, >>>

Was there heck, just like all the idiots in Kensington who railed against the recent expansion of the Congestion Zone but now realise that for £4 a week they can drive anywhere in Central London without paying the charge. So expect to see hordes of Chelsea Tractors congesting Regent Street

As for most of the rest of the article, it seems to be a series of half truths

and as for statements like "Only one person can travel on an Oyster card at any one time (source: TFL web site). So if you plan to travel with another adult at the same time, you need an Oyster card each", what planet is the blogger on where you can use one ticket for 2 people
alanRow is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 08:28 AM
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"As for most of the rest of the article, it seems to be a series of half truths"

Don't exaggerate.

One-tenth truths at most. So awful, it's got me defending Livingstone.

A serious contender for the most counter-productive piece of advice ever given to London tourists.
flanneruk is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 08:35 AM
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I think the one card per person complaint is due to comparisons to other transit systems where a single discounted unit can be used by more than one person. A good example: In Paris one carnet of 10 tickets can be used by as many riders as desired. This option can be very convenient for tourists, and is not available in London. Being forced to buy 2 cards with 2 deposits is annoying.

AJPeabody is online now  
Feb 20th, 2007, 08:43 AM
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Yeah - and in Germany, some city transport companies sell tickets that can be used by four traveling together:


So the blogger has a (sort of) legitimate gripe.
Robespierre is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 08:48 AM
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The only truth could be that 4 quid for a single ride is ripping off the tourist who doesn't know and just goes to the ticket window. No Londoner would buy such a single i think and would have the Oyster Card. So i think 4 quid per ride is ripping off tourists.
Flanner defending 'Red' Ken. Heavens termergetroids, Batman!
PalenQ is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 09:05 AM
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I don't think that comment about one person per ticket was in reference to carnets in Paris, but probably just because there are family-type passes for some rail systems somewhere, I think, or people are just clueless so he is covering everything at a very basic level. After all, this was written for people who don't know much about this kind of transportation.

There are very few places in the world where they sell groups of indiv. tickets at a discount, like in Paris, that I've been. I can't think of any that I can recall other than Paris (London used to, didn't they, but that's gone) except maybe Madrid. Most systems offer daily passes which are often useful for tourists, or other ways of giving a little bonus depending on how much you load on a card. Where I live, you used to get a 5 pct bonus if you bought at least $20 on a card.

A lot of people just don't know anything about public transportation. Like once some tourists asked me where I live if you needed to buy a ticket to get on the metro car and ride it. Well, I thought that was a strange question, of course you need a ticket, we can't afford to give away free rides. But I suppose these tourists might have had a vision of some train conductor on board going around selling you tickets.. I don't know, I just thought it was weird to ask that. OF course, they would have found out you can't even get to the train through the turnstiles without a ticket, but they asked me this at the entrance to the station.
Christina is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 09:35 AM
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Heavens to Murgatroid (Snagglepuss).
Fidel is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 09:52 AM
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<<< and as for statements like "Only one person can travel on an Oyster card at any one time (source: TFL web site). So if you plan to travel with another adult at the same time, you need an Oyster card each", what planet is the blogger on where you can use one ticket for 2 people >>>

Maybe they're thinking of New York City. If you have a pay-per-ride Metrocard (where it deducts $2/ride vs. a time-period card), you can run it through twice to deduct $4 if there are 2 of you traveling together. (Or, I believe, more times if there are more than 2, but I have never actually done that.)

sanschag is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 02:34 PM
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Yes, the NYC Metro Card can be used by several people - you just swipe it and hand it back to anyone else in your group. It's quite convenient and I'm surprised London transit authorities don't offer it.
azzure is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 04:09 PM
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Presumably because LU fares are not one set price right across the system. Oyster works out the cheapest fare wherever you go and deducts that from your preloaded funds. But the point is it can only work that out at the end of your journey. So you couldn't swipe it more than once the the beginning for multiple people - it just wouldn't work. One card, one person.
RM67 is offline  
Feb 20th, 2007, 05:09 PM
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Look I'm sure Ken the Red is not upset that some tourists are contributing to the building of the London infra structure by spluring for 4 quid for a tube trip in central London but...

While I admit the description of just what children need to do is very convoluted and I am not sure when a child age 16 or 17 needs a photo oyster card to get half fare or to travel for free, the brochure is available on the tfl web site and I would suspect that an adult with average intelligence can decipher it.

As for me, I don't have to worry about the child's business so I stick to adult and for adults it is as clear as day.

1. You can put a 7 day travelcard on an oyster card...no deposit necessary and you pay exactly the same as for a paper 7 day card...of course a good point is that some of the national rail systems do not take oyster but take travelcards but for the most part this does not effect most tourists who stick to the buses and tube in zones 1 & 2....the advantage of oyster for the 7 day pass is the extension fares go right on oyster and the extension fares well...if you buy a 7 day travel card on oyster and want to travel out to Heathrow using it, you simply put an extension on the PAYG part of the same oyster card, £1.80 peak periods 0700 to 1900 weekdays and an amazingly low £1 other times...if you are coming in from Heathrow and will be spending 6 days or more in London, probably the best deal is the 7 day zone 1 & 2 travelcard with the extensions on PAYG. However, if there are a couple of days when you won't be using public transportation as, for example, you are taking a day trip to Paris, then it's PAYG.

2. PAYG simply means putting an amount on the card. Yes it does require a £3 deposit but it is refundable or you can hold the oyster card for future trips...don't think £3 should be a deal breaker. True cash fares on the tube in central London are £4 and bus fares are £2 and yes these are rip offs but with oyster...

Tube fare £1.50..bus fare £1 but there are caps...non peak use of a PAYG oyster card (after 0930 weekdays and all weenend) can at £4.60...50p below the price of a one day zone 1 & 2 travelcard (which has the same 0930 restriction)..if you only use the bus, it caps at £3.

My friends visited Lonon for the first time this past weekend....after much research, he was bringing his wife and 6 16 and 17 year old girls, he gave up on figuring out the kids fares and simply got 8 oyster card and loaded them up with £13.80 each and £3 deposit.

On Saturday, he simply took a return trip from the hotel (Victoria area) to Oxford Circus...expenditure £3....without Oyster, he might have bought a 1 day travelcard which would have cost £5.10....

On Sunday, they took the bus to Tottenham Court Rd. for a London Walk, the walk also took them on the tube to complete it, they then wanted to go to the Burbery outlet store so the tube back to London Bridge, the 48 bus, after shopping at the Burbery outlet store, the 48 bus back to Liverpool Street station, the Central Line to Green Park and then Victoria line to Pimlico...evening dinner was a bus ride to the restaurant (they walked back)..total outlay off the oyster card, £4.60..no hassle no worries no nothing.

Monday, it was the tube to Blackfriars for a morning at the Tate Modern, the tube from Blackfriars to Sloan Square for shopping, the tube to Westminster for the London Eye, the bus back to the hotel, the tube from Pimlico to Green Park to Picadilly for dinner, the bus to the Aldwycho to see Dirty Dancing, the #11 bus and the #24 bus back to the hotel....total outlay £4.60.

There was £1.60 left on the oyster cards...they left early and it was up to me to get the refunds for the unused time as well as the £3 deposits back...while the clerk was friendly and cheerful the paper work was a lot but when all was said and done they had nothing but praise for the oyster card system.
xyz123 is offline  

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