Okay, I now know that both "art" and "cuisine" should be capitalized, but I still don't know the reason.

BB

Hi Sarah,

As far as I have been able to ascertain, bagels were first made in Europe.

Please note, a bagel is not just a doughnut-shaped bread. It must be boiled in water before it is baked. Some bakers fry the dough as well.

Re apple strudel: Phyllo pastry was introduced to Europe by the Ottomans, but probably goes back as far as the Assyrians (800 BC).

hey Ira? Thanks for coming on. wolf said that the turks made the bagel in Vienna. Did you go to that website I left. It was pretty interesting there are a lot of articles from food professionals on different regions.

Don't think its the final word on Turkey but it did seem to support my claims. Ok now you have me on a search for the bagel.

PS Ira what is your source or hopefully sources on Apple Struedal origins?

Here is my dart another article calling apple strudal origins Turkish.

http://staff.sunrise.it/polovalboite/strudel_eng.htm

Apple strudel to bagels. That's not much alphabetically.

Hi sarah,

I don't dispute that apple strudel could have been introduced to Europe by the Ottomans. I think however, that the pastry goes bake earlier than the Turks.

As for bagels, most of the websites I found agree that it was invented in Europe in the 1600's.

I am not unaware that they all could be copying the same erroneous information.

I will repeat: A bagel is not just a round baked dough. It must be boiled before baking.

I get what your opinion is Ira just looking for your sources. Not seeing syrian connection in my look on the web....all articles point to turkey for the origin.

Ok now I am seeing that Bagel has a more recent relationship with Poland unless you look at an older Turkish cousin the simmit.

http://www.coenbros.co.nz/bagelology.html

seems to be no definitive answer for bagel origins. Still not seeing Assiyrian roots with Strudel.

Well at the end of the day butter you still should see examples of Turkish influence on world cuisine here....If you are still interested in your original question here.

China having finest cuisine? That must be a joke, lol . Have you ever tried Portuguese cuisine ans sweets? Then you haven't tried good cuisine!!!

It's all subjective.

Hi Sarah,

Here's one citation for the early origins of strudel,

http://www.worldonaplate.org/world_on_a_plate/2004/08/