NaxosTravels

I am reading Bill Bryson’s “Neither Here Nor There – Travels in Europe”. It’s a pleasant enough book – very low on the details or depth, but funny and light. Low and behold, I came across a rather scathing report on Florence. It has DW and I shaking our heads and wondering if Florence (which we choose over visiting Trentino Alto Adige) was the very best choice after all. We will of course not be changing our plans but... we would like to be realistic about our expectations so we aren’t disappointed

Now BEFORE you defenders of Florence get upset – we are sure there are many wonderful things about Florence – we would just like to hear about some of them from those that have been! Throughout our planning process we’ve had trouble picturing the scope and attractiveness of the streets etc.

Mr. Bryson had a few qualms (there was also a lot of mention on the unbelievable wealth of treasures, so he was not all negative). I should note he visited in April – we will going in late May.

“You wonder how many people one city can absorb....the annual ratio of tourist to locals is 14:1”

“Nowhere is the decline in quality in Florence more vivid than on the Ponte Vecchio....it was covered with people selling semi-crappy items....and the crowds among them were unbelievable.

“Even when I made allowance for the hordes of tourists, I couldn’t help feeling that much of it was tawdrier than any city this beautiful and historic and lavishly subsidized by visitors like me had any right to be”.

“The city fathers of Florence could do a great deal more to ease the pressures – like allow museums to be open for more than a couple of hours a day, so that everybody doesn’t have to go at once”.

“There was litter everywhere and gypsy beggars constantly importuning and street vendors cluttering every sidewalk.....you don’t so much walk around Florence as pick your way among the obstacles. “Everything seemed dusty and in need of a wash. The trattorias were crowded...and often unfriendly. Nobody seemed to love the city. Even rich people dropped litter without qualm.

“It was the gypsies who got to me the most. They sit along almost every street calling out to passers-by, with heart-breakingly filthy children of three and four stuck on their laps, made to sit there for hour after hour just to heighten the pathos.”

I’m sure it didn’t add to Mr. Bryson’s impression of the city that he got robbed on the way back to the train station. We appreciate his perspective, regardless of whether in the end it reflects our own.

We are just posting to hear some other opinions and thoughts.

WillTravel

BB is not known for understatement. I'll even go out on a limb and say that not everything he writes is exactly true.

I can't comment about a spring visit, as I was there in January. But on New Year's Eve, Florence was indeed very crowded, but not so pathetic as described in that snippet.

bobthenavigator

We have diverse opinions in our house. My wife loves it and has been 5 times---thrice with her girl friends. I find it just too crowded for my taste---too many people in a small space, and many of them being herded in groups. As Yogi would say, " no one goes there anymore, it is too crowded".

SeaUrchin

The first time I visited Florence, I nearly hated it. It was humid, hot and crowded, then it rained hot rain and made it even worse. The second time I went I was surprised that I didn't hate it but was actually enjoying it. The third time I went back because I had decided that I loved it and I still do, I go every year or so to that area.

I came to love it for the history of the people and their buidings. I had to develop a sense of walking where the Medici had walked, lived and worked. I read up on their history which is entwined in the makings of that city of course.

I got off the main roads, walked in the surrounding hills, shuffled in the leaves, breathed in the air. In other words I went not in high season and changed my attitude and expectations. I talked to the artisans in side streets. I walked in the areas where the locals actually live and dine.

Just standing by the palaces, walking by the Strozzi and examining the rocks that it is built of, blows me away.

Many people don't like Florence but that is OK. I am not that fond of Bryson's writings anyway.

dawnnoelm

I loved Florence. I prefered over Rome by a landslide.

I loved how walkable the entire city was. With a good map you can get all around.

I loved how beautiful I felt the city was... to me it was truly magical.

Was it crowded? Yes, I suppose it was - not Disneyland crowded though.

We were there in July and the weather was truly lovely (I heard we were very lucky).

I LOVED I mean LOVED the food...

Over looking the Orno - watching the sunset - I don't know - it did not get much more special to me.

I loved the history - I was in the middle of reading Agony and Ectasy - and was in AWE standing in front of the David...

My cousin has literally traveled the entire world and Florence is a magical city to her as well...

dawnnoelm

SeaUrchin - I have English Lit on the brain (see: mid term was today) and when I read your post I thought you said "I am not that found of Byron's writings anyway) (Thinking of Lord Byron!!)

TuckH

Florence will always have a special place in my heart - I met my wife there while we were both studying at the University of Florence.

On a beautiful September day a few years ago we returned for the first time, arriving by car as we were staying in an agriturismo in the Tuscan countryside.

It was a major disappointment to both of us. The swarming hordes of tourists made it very unpleasant as we tried to refresh our memories while making our way about the city. By late afternoon we were glad to be on our way...

janisj

I read those quotes as if they are from someone who loves a person who is abusing herself and is heartbroken about it.

many of the things he says about Florence are totally true - and some are exaggerated.

For instance - limited admission hours DOES mean the museums are crammed to the rafters . . . . .

SeaUrchin

Oh no, I love Bryon!

Bryson seems to seek out all negativity from a place. I quit reading his books.

Midnightsun

Maybe Bryson hit a bad patch or had a singular experience that soured him. Florence is a wonderful city, although like Sea Urchin, I wasn't terribly impressed by my first visit. We visited in June, and although the temperatures weren't oppressive, the crowds were overwhelming. We arrived early to line up for the Uffizzi, and we enjoyed our museum visit. However, when we returned to the streets in late morning, there were tour leaders everywhere shepherding (or should I say sheep-herding) crowds of apparently shell-shocked tourists through the streets. All the tour groups were nationalized, and the tour leaders held poles aloft to guide their flocks. Here a Japanese flag, here a German flag, here a Union Jack. We tried to outflank the crowds to see a few more of the main attractions, but it wasn't until late afternoon that the crowds thinned out to a manageable level. Nonetheless, we were relieved to drive back to the small town south of Florence where we were staying and where the crowds were thin and mainly local.

We have since returned to Florence on two other occasions, and each time we've enjoyed it more. We haven't had ambitious plans, perhaps just one main attraction each day and a lot of exploring time on these other trips to Florence. Each time it has been more fun as we've explored the hills and the back streets. We've preferred home bases in smaller towns, but on our next visit, we'll look for a place in Florence, so we can wander her streets in the evenings and in the early morning hours, when I expect that they are at their best. I'll agree with Bryson that the Ponte Vecchio may not be Florence at its best. I think I enjoy observing the Ponte Vecchio from a distance rather than strolling over it, but otherwise, it's a great city. Enjoy!

GiuliaPiraino

One memory comes to mind for me, paying 9 Euros for gelato on the Ponte Vecchio. Others have paid 12, it's kind of a running joke for Florence. I like Florence, but it's very expensive and tourists are often taken for a ride. It's hard to see authentic Italy there unless you really, really seek it out. But it's like Rome, it's a must see for sure, but I wouldn't personally spend more than 3 full days there. I liked wondering out of the city core into some of the back street neighborhoods. I have lovely memories of those walks. I remember the food was much better, more authentic, and better priced outside of the city core. We stayed at a really nice pensione in that area which was a significant walk to the main area of town, but it was nice to get out of all the buzz of the city center. I have never seen rats so big in my life as we did near the river we had to pass to go back to our room, I thought they were badgers-LOL These were of course not in the city but near the river, I don't want anyone to get the wrong impression.

dawnnoelm

We did a "food crawl" with a lovely tour guide from America who lives in Florence for many years now - she gave us GREAT tips on where to eat - the best of "this" or "That" what stores to shop in etc. It was one of our favorite tours the entire time in Europe.

It was through Context - highly recommend it.

dawnnoelm

SeaUrchin - glad to hear it . Lord Byron was something else...

StCirq

He wrote that book YEARS ago.
And he's not a travel writer, he's a humorist. Take all of him with a grain of salt.

Not that some of it isn't true. And there have been posts on Fodors by people who just loathed Florence.

What I can't get over is how all that stuff he mentions is so superficial. It's like people going "OMG, le Mont-St-Michel was just teeming with tourists and you should have seen the crappy souvenirs being touted at every turn." Yes, well, it's been that way for a few hundred years. It's a PILGRIMAGE site, and there have always been hordes of people and tacky souvenirs.

Same thing with Florence, but does that type of stuff really overshadow the wealth of art and architecture and history and culture? I guess it does if you're only looking at the surface.

dutyfree

Florence- I have been there several times and also studied French and Italian Art there one college semester back in 1971.
I went back this past summer with a friend and realized how much I do not like this particular Italian city. It is filled with tons of USA college students;tons of various tour groups and no where to move. It has become (in my opinion) the "Wisconsin Dells" of Italy-too many tourists,T-shirt shops and overpriced stuff.
I am glad that I saw and visited it before it gotten taken over...........There are many wonderful things to see and do in Florence but have a plan B when the lines get long.Personally, I would head up to the hills of Fiesole above Florence for a respite!

Favorite Italian places-Rome(yeah, I know you either love or hate that too),Torino(Piedmont) and my favorite-SICILY!!!

dawnnoelm

dutyfree - I missed out on the love of Rome... dh and I hope to get to Sicily someday!

Quark

We did the requisite Rome, Florence, Venice, Milan route as it was our first time to Italy. We were there in early June and never felt that it was overcrowded. The weather was great, not too hot and humid. While I remember the gypsies I can't say they impacted me in a negative way, but I live in NYC. However, moving on to Venice and on returning home we decided Florence was underwhelming. I think we felt we had spent too much time there, 4 days. But the more we've reminisced since our time there the more we would like to go back to Florence. I can't get out of my head the narrow streets and outside neighborhoods where we had a terrific Bistecca Alla florentine and pasta with sausage and mushrooms. Then being at the central market at 10 am eating boiled beef sandwiches and having wine with the locals. Plus we need new shoes. I had to get rid of the ones I bought there and wound up at Botticelli, but they are just not as nice as my Florence shoes were. While we didn't get it while we were there we now think it shouldn't be missed. OH, and there's the museums.

Jean

We've never been to Florence in high season (except for my visit in the summer of 1963 when I was 12!), so I can't relate to the disappointment of others who choose to go there when it sounds more like a mosh pit than a Renaissance jewel. I've spent a few months there in total over many trips and many years, and we've tossed around the idea of leasing or buying an apartment in or near the historical center. I can't get enough of the place, and still feel I haven't seen all of its treasures.

P.S. We've seen many more begging gypsies in Rome than Florence but fewer even in Rome in recent years. Ditto the litter problem, although Naples currently holds the record. There are people selling semi-crappy items in most of the larger cities, but they wouldn't be selling this stuff if tourists weren't buying, so it's hardly fair to put all the blame on the cities.

WTnow

I love Florence when there are no crowds, but I am afraid that Bryson is also dead on when it is crowded.

We were in Tuscany last May and could have seen Florence then, but the pictures of the crowds turned me off and it was over 100F.

We enjoyed the beauty of the Chianti hills and enjoyed time in an awesome water park ( we travel as a family).

Still, we did not want to miss the fantastic art of Florence and knew we would be back in the area in late October.

It was snowing on the day we arrived! Then a rainbow came out and much of our visit we had sublime weather, although we did get some rain.

It was a great time to see Florence.We could walk and walk with no body around.

If you can not handle suffocating crowds, Florence is best seen now in the off season...meaning very late fall or winter. You can actually see the city because it is not jam packed with tourists.

The Uffitzi was still packed in very late October, but every where else was lovely.


I have heard it is jam packed in May with endless tours. If you do not mind extreme crowds, it won't be a problem.

It is a beautiful city full of art, but for my taste, the crowds ruin it, so I would only go far off season.

DO see a great dvd called “The Medici, Godfathers of the Renaissance” by PBS. A must see before going!!

SusanSDG

I won't say hated Florence, but I think Bryson had the same experience I did. I was so disappointed-it felt like a Renaissance theme park. The city center, at least, wasn't just crowded-in March-but teeming! Of course, it was worth the trip for the Uffizi, and the Accademia, and the churches, but we had to cross the river and wander for a while to feel like we were in Italy again, and my expectations had been so high.