adrienne

I don't understand #18 - People in Paris don't drink water like we Americans do. What does this mean?

maitaitom

"You should trust your own body,do what is best for you."

Exactly my point! There is no ONE way that is correct for everyone.

ziggypop

eg, thanks for writing this list. We can all learn from each others experience's, well if we don't know everything allready

StCirq

But we can also very easily pick up misinformation if we read thinking that this is anything but completely subjective observations of a first-time traveler. It's just one person's experience and would best be presented as such, instead of "tips."

egwright10

29FEB,
Elementary? Maybe, but simply put, they are just things I learned.

Perhaps I should change the post "title". They aren't necessarily tips for everyone- things that I wish I'd known more of and things that you hear but don't really believe until you experience them yourself. Not sure what you think are elementary?

The trip reports I read on this forum usually included things about specific restaurants, food choices, shopping, things to avoid...I wish I'd seen something about the beggars with puppies and their children on the street-- I had no idea. Also about the kids trying to get you to sign their lists--how annoying! I would have been better prepared. But in all the stuff I read, I never saw any of that.

Comments about food and language, understood? Maybe. But until you're actually there you don't know what it's like. I traveled with my husband and teenagers NONE of whom knew any of the language and once we were there they realized how important knowing just a little of it was.

Maybe I'm stating the obvious, but I think it should be said to people who are new to traveling abroad and who are nervous about it, that learning some of the language and opening yourself up to the cultural experience will really help them during their travels.

I think most of the reports I read were written by people who had traveled several times to Paris and offered a different perspective. Two of my good friends who have been to Paris four times now, were shocked when I said that the city was gritty and dirty. They said they've never seen trash and graffiti! I said they travel with rose colored glasses. When I mentioned that the neighborhoods leading up to Sacre Coeur were a little rough, they were shocked again! They just couldn't believe it when we said we didn't necessarily feel safe walking certain streets in that area. Everyone has a different experience.

No one should be puzzled by what I've written. This isn't rocket science. Just my thoughts on a trip I took. No one told me some of these things and I really wish I'd known-- especially about the confusion, lines, and different rules of flying out of a foreign airport. What would have taken an hour in the US, took nearly 3 hours in Paris. So, I did my homework leading up to the trip, but even then, there were things I learned.

egwright10

adrienne- regarding the water: when you sit down to eat in an American restaurant, everyone at the table is offered water as well as any other drink they order. Our experience in Paris was not like that. We had to specifically order water and only those people who ordered it were given some. The glasses were small and never refilled. The wait staff returned to our table only occasionally, so asking for more was sometimes an inconvenience to them. So, we started by ordering water for everyone at the table and sometimes an extra glass/bottle or two just to be sure everyone had enough.

StCirq

<<I wish I'd seen something about the beggars with puppies and their children on the street-- I had no idea. Also about the kids trying to get you to sign their lists--how annoying! I would have been better prepared. But in all the stuff I read, I never saw any of that.>>

I wish you had, too, but in fact there are threads on Fodors almost every day about these issues.

Your comments about the level of formality and learning the language are great - they can never be reinforced enough.

My only puzzlement is in saying things like the Parisians serve frîtes with practically everything, the Parisians LOVE ham, they get up late, etc...OK, those were your observations regarding a handful of Parisians you encountered; not facts.

But that's OK. I'm sure there's enough good info in here to help out some new travelers.

29FEB

Thanks for your posting Eg.

As I said, you clearly did do a lot of research before your trip.
I wonder if the difference is akin to "book smart" vs "street smart."

Some things just don't sink in until one actually experiences the reality,
which of course is true for most people.

I'm glad you had a good family trip.

egwright10

StCirq- frites were served in the nicest of restaurants with some of the best dishes I've ever eaten. I was just surprised by that when fries in the states are mostly reserved to burgers and kid's food.
Sandwiches, eggs, burgers- were all served with ham. Even a chicken sandwich at Laduree had a slice of ham as a garnish on top and was served with Laduree frites.
On the mornings we got up and out early, there was nearly no one on the streets and even the stores were still closed (this was at 9:00!) When you're used to stores opening at 5:00am and people being out to run or get to work before 6:00am, 9:00 was late. We'd stop in to one of the local cafes for petite dejeuner around 9:00 and the place would be empty. If we came earlier, it wasn't even open yet.
My observations? Yes.

maitaitom

Again, these are your experiences, and they are interesting and should be taken for what they are...your trip experiences. But nothing is set in stone on any vacation.

You wrote about the "confusion, lines and different rules of flying out of a foreign airport and what would have taken an hour in the US took nearly 3 hours for you." Well, that doesn't happen every trip.

On this trip, it took us 30 minutes to go through Immigration/Customs at CDG. It took us nearly 3 hours at LAX when we returned hone. It took us ten minutes to check in at CDG for our flight home and we were at our gate in half an hour. I wouldn't tell people that CDG is a breeze, because for our friends it took them more than an hour just to check in, and I've also had my problems at CDG. The last time I went through CDG, I had my camera stolen by security.

I'm just saying, had this been my first trip to Paris, come back and written, "getting through CDG is as easy as pie," people would rightly disagree with me on this Forum. The next time you go, maybe CDG will be a breeze like it was for us. Every trip is different.

This is why most trip reports just state what the experiences were for them. I've been to Paris more than a dozen times. I have never been pick-pocketed, nor ever seen it happen. I would never in a trip report state, "There are no pickpockets in Paris." I've never had kids want me to sign a list. I've never even had the ring scam pulled on me. That doesn't mean I look at Paris with Rose-colored glasses, it just means it hasn't happened to me.

We were offered water,"sparkling (with gas, etc) or plain"" at most restaurants in France, but I would not say that is the norm because I have only eaten at a finite number of restaurants, so maybe we just hit the ones that offer water

Nobody is saying don't tell about your trip and what you feel. Many of things on your list I totally agree with. There are some, obviously, that I don't. Don't take it personally. Just because it happened to you, does not mean it happens to others or what is right for you is right for others. That's what makes traveling fun and unique.

denisea

You made a lot of great points that many would do well to pay attention to, especially on their first trip to Paris.

There is always disagreement on even the simplest things on this forum. Many will appreciate your points, tips or whatever Fodorites want to call them. I happen to agree with a lot of them.

Anyone can accept the advice or choose not to. It should always be understood that these are one person's observations.

I appreciate you sharing and look forward to your report...and you survived Paris with teenagers!

nytraveler

Well, I'm used to some store that are open 24 hours. And supermarketets are usually open by 8 am. But other types of stores typically don;t open until 9 or even 10 am here - although they are usually open until 8 or 9 pm - and in some neighborhoods midnight.

I would expect streets to be deserted at 5 or 6 am (aren't people sleeping - who gets up that early voluntarily?) Out work hours are from 9 to 5 - but that really means 9:30 to 7:30 or so - or until the project is done when you're on deadline. (That's why no one is eating dinner at 5 in the afternoon.)

Paris is a big city and I would expect it to operate like other big cities, not like small villages (again, no stores are open before 9 am) or farms.

And dining doesn't require "patience" it requires relaxation. If you gobble down dinner in an hour at 6 pm what do you do with the rest of the day. Dining from 8 to 10 pm with a nice wine and then a romantic long walk home through lovely places is a delightful way to spend an evening. Otherwise what do you do from 7 pm to midnight?

adrienne

I guess I'm used to European customs as I never noticed about the water (or perhaps I noticed when I originally went to Europe and have forgotten). I normally order water as my beverage (when I'm not ordering wine) and don't think twice about it. When ordering water I ask for a carafe, not a glass. Ordering water is something I would never have thought to mention to anyone since I've never had a problem obtaining it.

Did you notice that coffee is served after the dessert, not with dessert?

I don't feel that these customs are worth worrying about. You can always ask for water when you want it. Certain things become self evident.

BTW - if you want an early coffee then go to a bar, not a cafe. Every neighborhood has bars that open early. Same in Italy.

Some of the things you mention are the difference between city life and suburban life and apply to US cities as well as European cities.

Nikki

I know what I do after 7:00 in Paris Lots of times I go to concerts or dance performances or theater. And in Paris it is hard to eat dinner at many restaurants before the theater. It is good to know which types of restaurants serve food continuously, such as brasseries and some cafes, if you want to eat before the theater or an evening out . Yes, there is the option of eating after the theater, but this is too late for many people, especially if they are getting up early to go sightseeing.

Even at home I eat earlier than 8:00. I am out most evenings playing music. Many people have evening activities. Everybody does not live the same lifestyle. Even in New York, which is where I grew up and where I visit frequently, restaurants serve earlier than they do in Paris. I see many people in restaurants before the theater in New York.

Hoosier_Reader

"Also about the kids trying to get you to sign their lists--how annoying!"

Sorry, but what does this mean? What lists?

ahiddenbird

I was pretty worried on my first trip to Paris that I would look completely unfashionable and really stand out. But honestly as long as you're actually dressed (that is, no pyjamas/sweats etc.) you'll be just fine. I don't think Parisians are inherently more fashionable than the rest of the world, I think they maybe just take a little more time on the whole, keep it simple and therefore seem more put together. But I certainly never got any snide looks about my simple sandals and cotton sundresses

I was also surprised at how nice most Parisians seemed to be; you hear a lot of negative things about their attitudes to tourists. But you're right, as long as you're friendly and polite, and at least try to speak a bit of French, people will treat you kindly in return, and most of them will gladly speak English. I think at worst they found my attempts at French amusing, but no one was mean!

jmct714

I think #30 is a great one to note. I was glad my co-travelers and I remembered to pack our environsax (re-useable bags) on our recent trip. We used them everyday, and were struck that the vast majority of shoppers at the Carrefour near our apartment brought their own bags. I don't think that's terribly common in much of the US, or at least not where I live. People do it, of course, but not to the extent that we noticed in Paris.

FrenchMystiqueTours

Next time you want water at a restaurant ask for "une carafe d'eau" and you'll get a bottle/pitcher large enough for everyone and won't have to ask for individual glasses. It's just tap water and it's free.

LSky

It was an interesting list.

May I add one more, please?

Whatever you post on Fodors about travel will attract a lot of people who will tell you, "that's not the way."

Good for you because you took the most important thing with you, your manners.

That always makes for an outstanding trip.

I love Paris!

janisj

I don't have time to read the whole thread will come back later- but just a comment about the mealtimes, and nytraveler vs. egwright10

nyt lives in Manhattan - most Americans don't. 8PM actually IS quite late for dinner in some parts of the country. Dinner rush starts around 5:30PM and some even nice places stop serving around 9PM. This seems especially true in rural areas/smaller towns.

I personally prefer the later meal times, but nyt should realize NYC isn't the whole country.