RSchmalfeld

Hello Fodors Friends,

I have posted previously and am asking again for more advice. Our daughter will be married near in Provence near Paradou at the end of May in a four day Wedding Celebration! Afterwards my husband and I plan to travel and will be celebrating our 35th Wedding Anniversary.

We now think we would like to take the TGV from Avignon to Paris, stay there four nights, perhaps train to Epernay and spend a night or two (or possibly take a champagne tour from Paris), travel to Dijon via TGV for another few nights, and then head down to Nice or Antibes to end our vacation. We have nine days to travel and sightsee and will be flying home on our tenth day from Nice to Los Angeles.

We have never been to Europe before and are really looking forward to soaking in the culture, seeing historical sights, touring museums, walking a lot and and shopping a bit, and of course eating delicious meals. I would love any advice you have for us, especially on which area of Paris to stay in for walkability, markets, sightseeing etc, and suggestions on things we should not miss in Paris.

Initially we had planned stay in Provence for our entire trip, but we will be in the area for 5-6 days before and during the wedding extravaganza, and my husband would love to see more of the country. One thing to note is that I have recently had extensive back surgery, and expect to be feeling great by the end of May, fingers crossed!

I have appreciated these forums so much and look forward to your wise advice!

Thanks in advance,
Randa

nytraveler

You may have 9 days but I think you have listed places for 12 or 13. You will need to make some hard choices.

To figure this out in more detail remember:

To get a full day in a city youmust spend 2 nights there

Leave a half day to travel from one place to another (unless just going for a one hour day trip)

List your days one by one, including
Where you will start
What you will do
What transit there will be
Where you will sleep

I think when you do this you're see the problem.

You can do Paris and Eparnay and Dijon

Or Paris and Nice/Riviera

You can't fit it al into 9 days, esp if, as I suspect, you will fly home on day 9.

StuDudley

>> in the area for 5-6 days before and during the wedding extravaganza, and my husband would love to see more of the country.<<

What you will be seeing will be a lot of train stations and views from the train:

- Avignon to Paris 2 3/4 hrs train - no big deal. 4 nights Paris

- Paris to Epernay (not one of my favorite cities) 1 hr train. Stay 2 nights

- Epernay to Dijon lv 10:32 arrive at 16:29 1 train change. 6 hr trip. You loose an entire day. Stay 3 nights/2 days

- Dijon to Nice lv 9:21 arrive 15:46 6 1/2 hrs on the train. You loose another day. You have run out of days - so no time to visit Nice.

Better idea is just to visit Paris & Dijon. Skip Epernay (you don't have enough time available).

- Paris 4 nights
- 1 3/4 train to Dijon. Dijon 2 nights
- 6 1/2 hr train to Nice. Stay 3 nights/2 days.

You are going to be "rushed".

My opinion?

Paris is very easy to get to from LA. Make that another trip (with perhaps a day trip to Epernay & Dijon from Paris). Just visit Provence and the Cote d'Azur on this trip. Even your 9 days won't be enough to do it justice.

Stu Dudley

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StCirq

If you're starting out with the wedding in Provence, why would you then make a big loop up to Paris, over to Champagne country, then to Dijon, then back south to Provence? This doesn't make any sense to me at all. If you want to see the Côte d'Azur, which is part of Provence, fine, but why go all the way to Paris and back? Just stay there, and THEN make your way northwards. Please get and study a map of France.

You have only a very, very short window of time for this. I would forget Epernay (a very forgettable place, IMO) and visit just Paris and Provence (including the Côte d'Azur if you like). Fly into Paris before the wedding, enjoy it for a few days, then head south and leave at the end from Nice.

bilboburgler

I, on the other hand, love Epernay. Very much a market town with a world beating industry attached. I stay in Parva Domus (a fodorite put me onto this B&B) with perfect position, perfect hosts and their own champers. Staying is a very French experience.

jamikins

Agree with St Cirq...or enjoy the wedding, travel to the Côte d'Azur then travel to Paris and fly home from there.

We enjoyed the champagne region but it's not top of my list. You will be able to enjoy yummy champagne throughout France!

fuzzbucket

Or, you could just organize a day trip from Paris to Reims, and enjoy touring the champagne houses in that city.
The one-way direct trip takes only about an hour and if you buy tickets 3 months in advance, they will be very inexpensive.

RSchmalfeld

Hi Everyone ~

Thanks for your responses! After further thought I think that we are back to our plan to stay in Provence:

We will fly into Marsielle and spend Night 1 and the next day in Aix before meeting family for the wedding festivities..
4 Days and Nights of Wedding fun near Paradou
3 Nights in St Remy as a base for exploring - including a Wednesday Market
1 Night in Gordes/Rousslion (+ fabulous dinner)
2 Nights in Arles - including Saturday Market
3 Nights in Nice

I think we will rent a car in Marseille, then return it there after Arles and train to Nice, where we fly home from. Our flights are already booked using Advantage Miles, and we are booked business class, which should help my back.

Any suggestions for us on fun things to see and do along our travels would be very much appreciated. We have wondered about taking the Train des Pignes from Nice as a day trip, those foothills, which I think are at the base of the Alps.

I feel like we could spend several more weeks in the area and still be wanting more! Paris, Dijon, etc will have to wait till another time. You can't do it all on your first trip to Europe, right?

Thanks again for your wisdom and great advice!
Randa

StuDudley

It think I sent you my 30+ page itinerary - which is clock full of things to do & see in that region. E-mail me at [email protected] if you don't have a copy & I'll attach one to the reply e-mail.

Paradou is very close to Arles. I would not stay in Arles, because you probably will visit Arles from Paradou. Certainly while staying in St Remy. I suggest that you cancel Arles and extend your stay in the Luberon (Gordess/Roussillon). For many people (including me) the Luberon is their favorite region in Provence.

Stu Dudley

RSchmalfeld

Thanks Stu -

Yes, you sent your guide which is amazing and so detailed and helpful.

Do you think we should extend our stay in Gordes area and explore east one day and north & west the next? Do you suggest Avingon? I had heard that the Saturday Market in Arles is really great, so thought it would be fun to be there for that...

Do you have any thoughts on car drop off in Marseille vs keeping it and dropping in Nice?

Much appreciated,
Randa

StuDudley

>>Do you think we should extend our stay in Gordes area and explore east one day and north & west the next?<<

Defintely. Skip Arles & stay 3 nights in the Luberon - near Gordes/Roussillon/Menerbes/Bonnieux. Actually, if this was my trip - I would subtract a day in St Remy & add it to the Luberon. St Remy is near Paradou, so you'll visit some of the sites while staying in Paradou. Visit Uzes & the Pont du Gard from St Remy.

No need to explore west of Gordes, but north to Pernes & the "Fountain Walk" that's in my itinerary would be interesting. It will take you about 1 1/2 days to explore the northern Luberon. Then head over the Luberon Mtns & explore Lourmaron & other villages I mention in my itinerary. You could even go to the Cote du Rhone area if you want to be surrounded by vineyards & interesting wine & hilltip villages.

>>Do you suggest Avingon?<<

Not as a place to stay - but you'll be near Avignon while in Paradou & St Remy - so you can visit it from these places. However, you will be visiting Aix and then Nice. Both are big cities like Avignon. St Remy is a mid-sized village - but it is not "out in the countryside" like some of the places you find near Gores & Roussillon. You may want "more countryside" after St Remy - so wait till the latter part of your St Remy stay & then decide if you want to visit Avignon.


>I had heard that the Saturday Market in Arles is really great, so thought it would be fun to be there for that...<<

IMO, the Saturday morning market in Apt is better. It's in the Luberon.

>>Do you have any thoughts on car drop off in Marseille vs keeping it and dropping in Nice?<<

If your plan is to not have a car in Nice - I would drop it off at the Aix TGV station & take the 12:17 TGV to Nice that arrives at 14:55. The Aix TGV station is out in the countryside between Aix & Marseille - so it is easy to drive to & return the car. "Easy" is not the case with Marseille & Nice stations.

You mentioned the Train des Pignes. We stayed in a Gite just outside of Entrevaux for two weeks - which is on the train route. Frankly, unless you are a big train fan - I would drive this route instead of taking a train, so you can stop & explore several of the villages along the way and also visit the fabulous Gorges du Cains & Daluis just north of the train route. See the section of my itinerary titled "Got an extra day to explore more of the Nice Hinterland". This is a very scenic drive once past the Nice sprawl - and it takes slightly over an hour to drive to Entrevaux. So if you want to visit this region - keep the car an extra day & use it to explore this mountain region. Then return the car at the Nice station.

Stu Dudley

PalenQ

In any case book your train tickets ASAP - up to 3 months I think in advance to get nifty discounted fares (non-changeable however from a specific train but much cheaper than walk-up and fully flexible fares- www.voyages-sncf.com is easy now apparently to book yourself. www.seat61.com has great info on discounted tickets -for general info check also www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

If taking the TGV Duplex -double-decker be sure to book a seat on the upper deck or if down below you see very little but retaining walls and wind blocks-and check first class too as sometimes those discounted fares may not be much more than the cheapest 2ndclass ones (at times-not usually).

PalenQ

Epernay is an average smaller city with yes the most prestigious Champagne tours but Reims IMO would make a better base for a few days - great cathedral and also similar tours from similar companies for Champagne and you can easily train to nearby Epernay if you want.

Reims is a fascinating bustling regional town.

StuDudley

If you spend your last days in Arles - best place to return the car is at the Avignon TGV station. It's somewhat easy to get to, and you don't have to drive into Avignon center.

Stu Dudley