chernsu

4 sisters in their 50s will be traveling to these areas at the end of May/early June 2011. Need help getting started with an itinerary. We want a mix of city and scenery and hope to do most traveling by train. We'll have about 4 nights in each city.

*Need to know about train travel between all three destinations - how long?
*Can we see Bavaria without renting a car? If yes, which town(s) would you recommend?
*Another option is Zurich/Lucern instead of Salzburg. With the timing, which is more do-able?

PalenQ

Need to know about train travel between all three destinations - how long?

Go to www.bahn.de - the German Railways web site that i use for schedules all over Europe as it is the easiest and most informative i have seen - a good way to access its English-language schedule page is to go to the home page www.budgeteuropetravel.com and click on the link there Best On-line European Railways Timetable (or some such wording) and it brings you to the English schedule page where you fill in the From: and To: boxes, put in a date (any date now as travel usually run at similar times daily throughout the year - with some Sunday exceptions and you will get all the info - right now how long the train trip takes - what you are interested in now - I reference this home page link because on it they also give you several useful tips on using the Wunder bahn.de site that may not be apparent at first encounter.

And yes you can easily see Bavaria without a car - thanks to the very dense rail and bus system - I cannot think of one major or even minor tourist sight that could be on your list that is not easily reached by train and or bus (or boat in the case of Herrenchiemsee - only of Mad Ludwig's fantasy castles, this one lovingly on an island in the tranquil Chiemsee, surrounding by foothills of the Bavarian Alps.

Salzburg is infitintely more doable if in Bavaria than Zurich or Lucerne - several hours away by train from Munich - Salzburg is just about 80 minutes by fast train from Munich so can easily be a day trip but also makes a great base from which to hop to several nice nearby sights, like the fabled Sound of Music country just to the east (and easily done by frequent postal buses from Salzburg).

Aramis

It is about 4 hours to Zurich from Munich, and then another hour to Luzern. That would take the better part of a day up in travel time.

I agree with PalenQ that Salzburg is more doable.

ira

Hi cher,
ditto the ditto

Bavaria is a fairly large place.

If you are interested in Ludwig's castles, you can easily visit Neuchwanstin and Herrenchiemsee as well as the palace in Munich.

Enjoy your visit.

treplow

A neat way to travel by train within Bavaria is the use of the Bayernkarte (Bavaria ticket), a discounted train day pass valid throughout the whole state of Bavaria. The four of you can travel on one ticket, for EUR 28. Limitations: On weekdays, trip cannot commence before 9AM and has to be completed on the following day by 3AM; you can use only Regio trains (thus, be sure to use the www.bahn.de website palenQue mentions, it identifies the type of train). You cannot use IC, ICE or EC trains, 1st class or reserve seats. But that is all pretty academic, because all of the places you can/want to travel to are accesible by Regios; in fact, to some (Neuschwanstein/Fuessen, Garmisch-Partenkirchen) that's the only way you can go. Salzburg, although in Austria, can alo be reached on the Bayernkarte.

You can buy this ticket at the station, either at the ticket counter or a kiosk.

PalenQ

Ya Vol!

and there are lots and lots of regional trains going everywhere in Bavaria and like treplow says some destinations like Fuessen are basically only served by regional trains and this Lander Card as they call the regional passes throughout Germany can also be used on city transports, like S-Bahns and U-Bahns and buses as well for the whole day.

But do be careful as treplow warns about not getting on by mistake the express trains not covered or you could be considered to be riding without a valid ticket and then subject to paying the full fare for the ICE or IC or EC train - which can be really steep IME - plus potentially a fine on top of that.

On platforms at stations scrutinize the overhead monniker that tells where the train is going and also IME has the train number on it - it should say Regional and not IC, ICE or EC (or even ICN - a night train).

chernsu

Thank you everyone for the great advice. We will definitely go with Salzburg instead of Switzerland. Now that we know we don't need a car, I can spend some time figuring out the train options.

If anyone has suggestions for reasonably priced, convenient hotels in any of our travel areas, they'd be appreciated. And, towns that we shouldn't miss in Bavaria.

kfusto

What do you consider "reasonably priced"?

In Salzburg, we like to stay across the Salzach rather than in the Altstadt, personal preference. For a reasonable option in town, look at Hotel Weisse Taube or the Goldene Ente. Across from the altstadt, the Nh Salzburg is a new and modern hotel in a nice area, a short 12-15 minute stroll to the center.

In Munich, I like LeMeridien near the Hauptbanhof for large rooms, convenient location and great value for the money if you can find a good deal.

singfree

We were in Bavaria & Salzburg in late May-early June. We used Salzburg as a base to see Salzburgerland and Berchtesgaden. We stayed at the beautiful Gaestehaus-Steinerhof on Moosstrasse (60 Euros per night), breakfast included. Not right in the city, but in a quiet suburban setting, a 15 minute bus ride (bus stop is very close).

In Bavaria we stayed in a really nice apartment in Garmisch called Haus Annalina on Gehfeldstrasse, a 5 minute walk to the train station (50 Euros per night).

Both places were quiet and had great views of the mountains.

Both places are spacious and clean. The owners treat their guests like family.

Rail and bus travel is quick and easy. Never a need for a car, unless you plan to go to some obscure place.

Another great website (in addition to bahn.de) is www.oebb.at (Austrian Rail). They have a service called "Scotty", in which you can plan a trip right from your hotel or B&B to the destination address. It has an English section if you need it.