italy with a 2 year old

Old May 18th, 2004, 07:20 PM
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italy with a 2 year old

Hi Folks,
We are travelling to Italy for three weeks this summer with our 2 1/2 year old. We are going to Rome, Sicily, Florence, Cinque Terra, and other wonderful destinations.
Any advice on fun things to do with our daughter would be helpful and appreciated.
We will be spending 10 days in a villa in Ambra, Tuscany so we will be travelling to Assisi,Cortona as well as some other day trips.
We are nervous to fly with a toddler so any advice would help.

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Old May 19th, 2004, 05:07 AM
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Hi alimom,

Have you taken the child on a trip prior to this one?
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Old May 19th, 2004, 05:14 AM
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Are you talking about activities that the child is likely to enjoy? to remember?

Why are you "nervous" about flying with the child? About what in particular?

Sorry, more info needed I think.
 
Old May 19th, 2004, 11:40 AM
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I wouldn't think that the flying over would be the most difficult part but all the traveling around that you are planning to do once you get there might not be your toddler's favorite thing. On the flight, pack a small backpack for your child with some snacks, juice boxes and some new, small gifts: coloring book and crayons, small dolls, stickers, little magnetic doll house scenes etc. She will probably sleep most of the way over. Some people swear by giving their kids Benedryl or something similar but make sure it doesn't make your child jittery beforehand. Two and a half would be, to me, a difficult age to travel to Italy. My girls at that age were too big for a back carrier and strollers are a pain on cobblestones and up and down endless stairs and hills. But you will need one. I wouldn't recommend the Cinque Terre as a destination. Are you planning on hiking the five towns? Portions of the trail are extremely rugged and you or your spouse will need to carry your daughter on very steep, narrow and winding "trails." With young children, the fewer destinations and changes of hotel the better.
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Old May 19th, 2004, 12:03 PM
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I am travelling to Paris and London this September with my then 18 month old, and I can relate to your fear. When we first started considering the trip, we were completely unsure of it. Now that all the plans are made, we're very excited. This board was a great source of information.

That said, I have been to Italy 4 different times in the last 8 years prior to baby... and I have to agree with a previous poster about not going to Cinque Terre with the baby. The hiking trails are NOT baby friendly, though the villages have some charm. I remember watching this cute chubby little Italian boy eating gelato with his family in Vernazza, but I don't think I ever saw a child on the trails. If you want to visit that region there are a number of beach towns on that coastline where you could take your child to the beach. And that way if you really wanted to see one of the Cinque Terre towns or a couple, without all the hiking, you could take the train in.

Is the villa in Tuscany a private rental or a hotel? One of the best things I've learned on this board is renting an apartment... and when I go back to Tuscany we'll definitely be doing it again. (We rented with my parents a couple yars ago near Siena.) It will make it easier to maintain a routine for the baby, spread out, and take in life in Italian time... slow, wonderful, to enjoy it.

About all the "wonderful destinations" you mention... is this your first time to Italy? Those "wonderful destinations" I think would be potentialy ruined for you if you don't plan it well for the baby. I haven't been to Sicily yet, but have spent time just about everwhere else in Italy. I would bring the baby to Florence as it's one of my favorite cities in the world, but Rome is definitely a big urban sprawl.

One thing that might help you is to make a list of what you want to see... then make sure it jives with what would work for your child. You'll want to be near playgrounds, parks, the beach, etc. and keep big museum visits short and punctuated with down time. The good thing is that Italians adore children and are likely to give you a nice welcome, especially in the small villages.

And if you're going to be in Tuscany, there are numerous posts about what villages to see there. With 10 days you'll have plenty of time to roam around, find your favorite villages, your favorite gelato shops, your favorite piazzas, etc.

And remember that the first few days of your trip will be lost with jet lag and adjusting into a routine for the baby... so will you be starting your trip at the Villa or some other quiet place?

Sorry if this is overwhelming and my response a bit long. Just want to help you as I was in your shoes just a month ago when we decided to visit my in laws in London with a baby. If it weren't for this trip, my first overseas adventure with the baby would have been Italy.

Ciao,
Kat
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Old May 19th, 2004, 12:20 PM
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I agree with Grinisa about having fewer destinations.

We came back from Italy yesterday (a trip report is coming up soon). We traveled with a 5 year old and a 10 month old. In our experience, 4 hours of non kid-related activities was the threshold, before kids would start getting fussy. So we would take a big break and resume activities later. Tackle one or two major activities a day. We also realised that long dinners out would not work. So, we either cooked dinners in the apartments that we stayed in or did take out food for dinner. We used taxis a lot in Rome, very reasonable and convenient. Make sure you are flexible with your plans. Slow down. Me and my husband tackled major museums by ourselves (while the spouse took care of the kids). That was a great decision for us and the kids.

We lived in an agri-tourismo in Umbria and our daughter loved their garden. She picked "flowers", actually weeds in the grass and ran around a lot. For her it was the most memorable day. I could go on and on.

The most important advice is to slow down and enjoy the smells, sounds, sights, tastes of everything around you.
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Old May 19th, 2004, 06:20 PM
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We've traveled extensively with our boys (now 4 1/2 and 7) and cousins of all ages. If you have an evening flight, put your daughter in her pajamas at the airport prior to boarding or once your meal is done. Most airlines offer a kid's meal, call to request it, it will at least have food she might recognize. Encourage her to sleep, we always talk about how we're all going to sleep all night on the plane. Our boys have done great with minimal jet lag, we always try to keep to as regular schedule as possible the first day, with an opportunity for some really long naps.

We've used good quality, light-weight travel strollers, we still have an old Combi and are impressed with some of the newer travel strollers on the market. We've also traveled with a smaller lightweight jogging stroller now available. These fold up and can be packed in a "big" bag. Not the easiest way to travel but we've used ours on subways and trains, it can be difficult on buses. If you're doing day trips from one location it can be wonderful, especially in an area where you want to hike or on cobblestones. We like to walk and have toted strollers all over Europe.

Relax and enjoy your trip. There are play grounds scattered everywhere and at 2 1/2 your daughter will delight in almost anything. Traveling with children makes them appreciate other cultures, more flexible in new situations, and because you'll be going at a slower pace you'll see some new sites.
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Old May 19th, 2004, 08:55 PM
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I just got back from 4 weeks in Italy with an 18 month old. The tips given above are on the money. As a few more:

1. you do have to carry the stroller a bit, but you will need one. Also strong wrists, as you weave around people and up and down curbs

2. most hotels (3 star and below) do not have kettles. Many do not have bar fridges. If you think you might want a kettle, bring a portable one. Some hotels charge a lot for travel cots (if your bub still needs a cot). A team called "phil and ted" in NZ make a very portable lightweight travel cot (google them)

3. apartments are the way to go if you can. Even if its so you dont have to lie in the dark for 1/2 hr while bub goes to sleep every night. In Rome and Florence, definitely, you can short term rent apartments for only a few nights. However, it means you have to do a bit of cleaning and cooking etc

4. Cinque Terre - we were only able to do the 'lovers lane' walk; although had we a back pack for the bub I guess we could have managed at least one of the other walks. If you are going for a couple of days, then the villages are nice and peaceful (if its not the weekend). But I wouldnt plan a long stay there

5. alternating caring for kids/museums is a great idea, particularly if the kid sleeps. I found mine was fine walking around the street - kept him interested - but museums were a nightmare.

6. restaurants are also not the best.

7. however, we were told by several italians "let the kid be loud, that is what children do". We (he) got a lot of attention (bub is blonde), several toys given to him by shops (eg promo teddy bears).

8. the baby clothes shops are incredible. And expensive. But amazing

9. for your day trips - if the baby sleeps during the day, start early because you will be gone most of the day. Be prepared for an unhappy baby at times

In Rome: The Villa Borghese park is the place to go - lots of nannies bring their kids there. In Florence beware the merry go round in the central piazza! There is a large park about 25min walk west of the city centre. Santa Croce has nice and peaceful cloisters (although there is an entrace charge to the church). And, of course, many of the piazzas are pretty much traffic free.

It was, at times, exhausting and we certainly missed out on things - particularly good restaurants. However, we dont regret going as Italy is an exceptional place.
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Old May 19th, 2004, 11:38 PM
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There have been a lot of recent posts on traveling with kids that I have contributed to. I have been taking my daughter with me to Europe since she was 4 months old (she is now 4 years old). I always bring my light-weight Graco stroller that can easily be folded up and transported on top of a rolling suitcase. Since there is so much walking over there, little legs get tired and it has been a life-saver for me to have a stroller. On the airplane, I brought along little "gifts" that I had individually wrapped and gave one to her each hour (small coloring book/pack of crayons, miniature book, etc). These kept her engrossed and occupied for the entire flight, along with listening to the kids' songs on the airline's radio station (earphone are fun!). The one thing I have strived to do on all my trips is to maintain my itinerary as much as possible, knowing that I am traveling with a young child. I have learned that incorporating her into everything has only served to enrich her little life and she remembers so much from each trip that is invaluable. I took her to Pompeii and Paestum and it made such an impression on her that when we went to Ostia Antica 9 months ago, she remembered what "had happened to the people at Pompeii" and linked it to that site too. Over the years, in addition to teaching her Italian, I have shown her a lot of books on art, pictures, etc so when in Florence last year (age 3), she recognized the famous David both in the piazza and in the Accademia, as well as the Primavera painting by Boticelli in the Uffizi. The same went for Pisa - she recognized the leaning tower from the street and was happily exclaiming and pointing to it.

When I was in Italy 9 months ago, I took her to Pinocchio Park, located outside of Lucca in the small town of Collodi. She absolutely loved it - the park grounds, familiar images of the whale, Pinocchio, etc. (although different from the Disney version). We are going again in 3 months! Cortona was nice too, although because it is a hilltown, it is difficult to get around with a small child. We ate gelato in the main square, Piazza Signorelli, in front of the theatre where "Life is Beautiful" was filmed; and strolled up and down the main street looking in shops, had a caffe, etc. Assisi was the same, lots of hills and walking. The few fountains in front of the churches provided a respite from the heat and also a diversion for her, chasing the pigeons, etc. We walked all through St. Francis' basilica, including the lower basement level, with the nervous attendants (guards) hushing any audible noise. (Now that I've been there, I would not take her there again).

In the Cinque Terre, there are a couple parks for kids, you just have to know where to find them. In Vernazza, above the train station is a little outdoor park with swings, slide, etc that kept her enthralled for nearly 2 hours. Likewise, in Manarola, walk towards the marina/harbor, then veer to the R around the bend and up the hill. Above and beyond the local cemetery, there is a small park at the crest of the hill overlooking the magnificent Mediterranean and we played there for at least half the day! (There is a wonderful gelato place back at the harbor at water's edge that serves the best cioccolata ever). In Levanto (the town north of Monterosso), there is a nice public park area near the water where strolling musicians, clowns, and street shows are put on for the crowds.
Above all, taking the 5 Terre boats from CT town to CT town is the most fun for little kids. I got a seat out on the deck and the air, sea, spray and all was so much fun for us both!

In Roma, we went to the Zoo, located in the Borghese Gardens area. At 8,50 euros per adult ticket, it seemed a bit pricier than its U.S. counterparts, but you have to think that you are in Roma and it's different. Any child loves the zoo and she was no exception. I have that on our list to see again when we are there in September.

All in all, you will have a nice time. Italians love children so your daughter will be welcomed wherever you go. Enjoy yourselves and have a great trip!
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Old May 20th, 2004, 11:00 AM
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Huitres, I forgot all about that playground over by Pensione Sorriso in Vernazza. Your descriptions take me there. I didn't know there was one in Manarola. Great info to have.

Since you may know about this, another thought about visiting the Cinque Terre with kids... but do you know if there are good private rentals or agritourismos in the hills around le Cinque Terre? That way mommy and daddy can enjoy the views and serenity and the baby has room to walk around. That might be an option for the original poster, though it then makes train access more difficult.

Our next trip (probably at least another year or two till our pocketbooks recover from this one) will be to Italy and I'll be sure to read everything you've ever written here about kids in Italy!
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Old May 20th, 2004, 03:38 PM
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I forgot to mention - baby products (nappies - diapers - cereal, jar food, cups etc) are found at most pharmacies (green cross out the front). However often the full range is not displayed on the shelves eg the various disposable nappy sizes. Just ask at the counter (most pharmacists speak english, but obviously just learn the Italian for 'disposable nappy' and your child's weight). A lot of the brands seemed to be pull up nappies rather than tabbed.

If you aren't staying in an apartment, schedule 2-3hrs every 4 or 5 days to do your washing. Laundromats are around but aren't hugely common and you might not be able to walk to them. The Lonely Planet (and, I assume, Lets Go) guide books have location details.

Also - there arent very many nappy change rooms. I cant actually remember any, other than in the Vatican Museums. So just find a 'semi secluded' spot. Necessity forced us to do a nappy change in St Peters Square, Santa Croce Cloisters and the beach at Vernazza. No one arouned seemed to care (and, of course, why should they).

There is a little park outside the walls of Assisi - I can't remember the gate, but its the one at the other end of the town to the Basilica. The lawns out the front of the Basilica might be just as good. We took the view that, every hour or so, we would let bub out to walk around if possible for 10 minutes. As mentioned, many piazzas are usually fine (obviously keeping a close eye).
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Old May 20th, 2004, 10:36 PM
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Hi skatterfly: I am a divorced, single mom so you can imagine how difficult it is traveling solo, trying to manage a toddler! But I have made the best of it and don't let lack of help be a deterrent to my enjoying bella italia! There are so many friendly people in Italy that have helped me up flights of stairs with the stroller, carried my suitcase while I held my daughter's hand, etc etc. I could go on and on about the kindnesses I have been shown - all which serve to make me want to go back there time and time again. (I hope to move there next year!)

I know the Cinque Terre area very well as I have a lot of family friends there, specifically in Riomaggiore and Manarola. Regarding your question about apts or private rentals around the CT, I would recommend booking such a place through the Villa Argentina Hotel in Riomaggiore. I am biased.....my ex-fiance and his sister own Villa Argentina (Via Ave de Gasperi, 37, tel/fax 011-39-0187-920-213) and they have great rates and options available all throughout the town and up in the hills. Every time I had gone to visit over the years, we stayed in a great villa with terrific ocean views for like 100 euros a night, or in a small "cabin-like" place up in the woods as you are heading out for a hike (~70 euros a night). All of these places were completely furnished as a complete house with kitchen, livingroom, dining room, with 1, 2 or 3 bedrooms. There are even pricier versions for larger families (6-8+ persons), but from what I have stayed in and what I know they have, there are a lot of options available to families with children. Quite a few of the places have a small enclosed courtyard and my daughter played there. Also, I forgot to mention that La Spezia nearby is a great town to take the train into and then walk along Corso Cavour (the main pedestrian boulevard through the center of La Spezia). I took my daughter there many times during the day to peruse the morning open market (shopping!), go for a gelato, then walk to the park bordering the harbor. There were lots of play things for little ones there - including those motion ride "animals" that kids love to ride that go up and down (cost = 50 euro cents) with popsicles and fruit juice at vendors nearby (try a strawberry granita!)

ctd02, I remember that park outside the gates of Assisi, we stopped to play there too! I can't seem to remember the name either.....also played on the large expansive lawn in front of the Basilica as well -- thanks for jogging my memory!

Traveling with kids CAN be enjoyable (it doesn't have to be a chore) and it is nice to enrich their little lives with such an experience too!
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Old May 24th, 2004, 07:54 PM
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We spent 6 weeks last spring/summer with a 4 year old in Spain and Italy. I have suggestions about traveling with a child on my website. You may find some of the info. useful. http://www.janeandken.com/Travelwithchildren.html
You may also find more info and ideas if you then go to Italy 2003. By the way, we are returning with him for 5 weeks this fall--he loves Italy.
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Old May 25th, 2004, 10:59 AM
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We were in Italy last summer with our then 18 month old -- our friends had a 2 year old. You will have a wonderful time. The Italians LOVE children and are so interactive with them. We found dining out to be great (get a portable booster seat ... we picked up an inflatable one at Toys R Us which was easy to pack and worked really well). Always check on the opening times of restaurants. We were often the first ones there and as a previous poster indicated, it was unusual to be able to have a lengthy dinner but we always managed to have a nice meal. We had an apartment at a villa in Tuscany for a week (near San Gimignano) and an apartment in Rome (in Trastevere) for a week. The apartments were great so the kids could go down before us and also so we could have breakfast at home. They also provided much more space than a hotel room. The other couple often went back to the apartment in Rome for nap time. Our guy wasn't on any kind of schedule and often just slept in his stroller (or in the car -- we had a van in Tuscany). We took lightweight umbrella strollers. If I were doing it again, I'd invest in one that reclines (the Italians were not impressed with our son's bobbing head!). Ours had a sun shade and a basket underneath both of which were invaluable. The villa had a pool which was perfect for the hot weather and a fun diversion. The towns in Tuscany all seemed to have parks which allowed for some play time/run off steam time. In Rome the kids LOVED LOVED LOVED the fountains. Gelato breaks were frequent and well-received by young and old alike. I also agree with an earlier poster that fewer hotels/apartments is likely a better idea so everyone can get settled. We had wanted to see Cinque Terre too but decided it was too far away from our Villa for a daytrip (we would have done it in a heartbeat without the kids). Sounds like the climbing/hiking would also have been hard. We took TONS of diapers so we didn't have to find ones that fit there but the co-ops and drug stores would have been fine, I'm sure. The kids loved pasta and pizza and of course gelato. It was a totally positive experience. On occasion one of us would leave a church earlier than planned because the boys were listening to their voices echoing and disturbing others but they really enjoyed the new sights and even kept quiet for the entire Vatican Musuem tour (ok, so they slept for much of it ... we were very lucky to get away with that one, I think). Having the van in Tuscany was great as it (a) was air conditioned and (b)allowed us to go at our own pace without being tied to train or bus schedules (although we did take the train into Florence for a day). We rented car seats along with the car. In Rome we went everywhere by foot and found it to work out perfectly. It might be harder with a slightly older child. Our kids were pretty content to stay in their strollers. We took a bus and train to Ostia Antica one day. Not a good location to push a stroller. I'd recommend air conditioning in all of your hotels/apartments (in Tuscany were were fine without it but we weren't around during the day ... and there was a refreshing pool. Rome would have been absolutely unbearable without it -- we were there in late June - early July).

Have a wonderful trip! Take lots of pictures.

Tory
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Old May 25th, 2004, 04:43 PM
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janelp - great tips/comments on your website - I found myself nodding with just about every comment.

I thought I would add this tip in, if it helps. Often you will find that the high chairs in restaurants (if they have them) do not have safety straps, and if you use a blow up booster seat (great idea, wish I had thought of it) then there wont be any straps. Bring along one of those clip together straps that you wrap around your suitcase and use it as a seat belt. Its not perfect but it offers some security.

Toddlers also like playing with it anyway, so it doubles up as a 'toy' when not in use.
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Old May 26th, 2004, 07:22 AM
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Just a p.s. about the booster seat. If you can find the one I did (I think its a "First Years" (blue and green and a little bit of yellow), it comes with straps and really works as a highchair without the tray. Works like a charm and keeps the child in the seat!

Tory
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