tbrash

Hello,

My fiancé and I are in the process of planning a trip to Europe for our honeymoon. We will be arriving on December 14, 2015 and returning to the US on January 2nd, 2016. We are planning this trip ourselves, rather than going through a travel agent. We don't have too much experience with Europe, so I was hoping you guys could offer some basic advice. We know going in December, rather than more warm weather months, will likely change the dynamic and cost of the trip. I would greatly appreciate some feedback on which of the following itineraries will be more fitting for a honeymoon in December. I know the trip involves jumping around multiple countries, but we really want to experience each of these areas, if only for a brief period of time. From a budget standpoint, I would like to say we can keep the majority of hotels under $150 USD per night, which seems rather realistic in December, if that makes any bearing on which itinerary is best. My fiancé and I are both in our mid-late 20's and will be looking for a mixture of touring the historical areas as well as relaxing with a bottle of wine. Any and all advice will be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Itinerary 1
Rome (Dec 14, 15, 16) 3 nights and train to Florence
Florence (Dec 17, 18) 2 nights and train to Venice
Venice (Dec 19, 20) 2 nights and fly to London
London (Dec 21, 22, 23) 3 nights and train to Paris
Paris (Dec 24, 25, 26) 3 nights and train to French Riviera
French Riviera- Probably Nice (Dec 27, 28) 2 nights and train/drive to Spain
Barcelona/Madrid (Dec 29-January 2) 4 nights


OR

Itinerary 2
Rome (Dec 14, 15, 16) 3 nights and train to Florence
Florence (Dec 17, 18) 2 nights and train to Venice
Venice (Dec 19, 20) 2 nights and fly to Barcelona
Barcelona (Dec 21, 22, 23) 3 nights and fly to Paris
Paris (Dec 24, 25, 26) 3 nights and train to London
London (27, 28, 29) 3 nights and fly or train to Amsterdam
Amsterdam (30, 31, 1) 3 nights

RonZ

Everyone will advise you to cut back on destinations, because you have little
time for enjoyment when all the relocation time is backed out. Every train ride you burn up half a day or more. Every flight at least 3/4 of a day.

bilboburgler

Have you ever seen the film http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planes,...nd_Automobiles
given that no one in Europe cares about US Thanksgiving but the vast majority do care about Christmas, though of course don't agree what the date, followed by the second most important festival New Years eve. Basically you want to fit in holiday in the middle of this?

Steve Martin would have a word for it. I've done business trips in the US leading up to thanksgiving and I'd never do it again.

So, you need to cut like crazy, understand that shops are going to be crowded, restaurants pretty busy.

"I would like to say we can keep the majority of hotels under $150 USD per night, which seems rather realistic in December" what does this mean?

In terms of luggage you need too pack for cold and wet which means a lot of gear, only Barcelona is likely to be mild. Note that cheapo airlines charge for hold luggage and have carry on sizes way down on what US types expect.

In 12 months time the $/E exchange could be anywhere, so $150 does not help. If I was a betting man I'd say E will be down and £ will be up by then which will make staying in London a bit harder

If I was doing this I'd just do the Italian and Spanish bits, but up to you.

bilboburgler

Oh and congrats. Since this is an important life change moment I'd advise do less, and enjoy each other's company more.

janisj

>> I know the trip involves jumping around multiple countries, but we really want to experience each of these areas, <<

Sorry -- but w/ either of these itineraries you will 'experience' little more than jet lag, airports and train stations. Not a way to enjoy any trip let alone a honeymoon.

You can't simply levitate between all those major cities -- out of your 2+ week trip you'd spend the equivalent of 4 - 5 full days just in transit. Another day at least just recovering from jetlag. Add to that the delays that might be cause b the weather . . and you've shot a week of your time getting to/between and not 'being' anywhere.

Then - 2 nights only gives you one full day, 3 nights = 2 full days so VERY little time anyplace. London -- you need 4 - 6 days (5-7 nights) to barely scratch the surface, Paris maybe 3-5 (4-6 nights)days (still lots to see/do but less spread out than London)

Which 3 of those cities do you MOST want to see. Say it is London/Paris/Venice -- do those and <i>maybe</i> add one more like Rome or Florence.

Enjoy each others company and the sites -- not the insides of airports and trains/stations.

nytraveler

Agree that you are trying to squash 25 pounds of stuff in a 10 pound bag. You will spend a lot of time and money trekking all over the continent and not really stay anywhere long enough to see even the most major sights - never mind having any time to relax anywhere.

You need to understand that the time of year you have picked will present several problems

Everything or mostly so closed ) Dec 24 afternoon/eve, Dec 25 and Dec 31/Jan 1.

Also you will be there in winter which can mean chilly and rainy or cold and snow - which can hold up transit. Plus days are short - with sunlight only from 8 am to 3:30 or 4 in the afternoon.

Finally your hotel budget is very tight - esp for London - and will leave mostly you in quite basic properties.

Is this really what you want for your honeymoon?

I would do 2 or at most 3 cities - so you get a chance to see some major sights, relax a little and have time to work around the holidays.

candj83

Hi tbrash,

Congratulations on your upcoming wedding and honeymoon!

My two cents...I know what it feels like to try to see so many places on a short trip. I did a very fast back-packing trip in college in my early 20s. It was do-able and fun, but very tiring, at a pace similar to what you have listed. I wouldn't recommend this type of travel for a honeymoon, especially if your honeymoon directly follows your wedding since you'll be tired from all of those wedding festivities (I'm speaking from experience here).

I would recommend cutting two of your stops off either of your itineraries and allocate the rest of your days between the stops you have left. The others are correct about travel times...even if you travel within a country, say Rome to Florence, you have your time you spend checking out of your hotel, getting to the train station, waiting for your train, the train ride itself, arriving new destination and getting your bearings, finding your hotel, and checking in. This can easily take a half-day, just for in-country train travel.

I disagree that you need a week to "enjoy" places. I won't disagree that having more time is better, but I do believe that you can still get a taste for a place and plan to go back. My fast and furious trip in college had that affect on me.

With all of this intense moving around, I would definitely recommend to pack as lightly and efficiently as possible. Carting multiple pieces of luggage (and large luggage) around on trains is a pain. I'm sure it can't be much more enjoyable to do so on planes, either. Also, look into your luggage requirements for Venice. I believe I remember seeing that Venice was going to be restricting types of tourist luggage to protect their cobblestones, etc. Could be wrong, but I'd check into it.

Pare your itinerary(ies) down per your priorities and come back with your new ideas. You may consider googling your different destinations (with a tag of visiting in winter) and see what info you can find to help anticipate if it's truly the place you want to visit in wintertime. Here is an old thread for the French Riviera...http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic..._Provence.html

candj83

Also, by adding days to your other stops, you can manage some great day-trips from those locations. Versailles in Paris, small Tuscan towns from Florence, Montserrat from Barcelona, etc. There are so many great options!

Debs

Congrats on your upcoming wedding! Both itineries you've outlined will have you seeing more of train stations and/or airports than what you'll be seeing in the cities you're planning on visiting! As others have stated, you really need to cut this in half and plan from there. Train schedules will be reduced in the winter months and flying can get expensive. Is the timing right to visit the French Riviera in December? I would consider London, Rome and Paris and day trip from there. It's fun planning though!

hetismij2

I just want to say that most museums in Amsterdam are open on 25th and 26th December, unlike museums in some other cities, so If Amsterdam is still on the list when you have reduced it consider it for Christmas, though it is also a great place to see in the new year.

You are young, and will, if you want, get the chance to come to Europe again. Slow down, enjoy your honeymoon and each other and the places you finally decide upon.

janisj

>>$150 USD per night, which seems rather realistic in December,<<

Didn't notice this when first reading your post (was too flummoxed by the itineraries that I missed this crucial bot)

You will find in major European cities time of year makes very little difference re room rates. There might be a teensy reduction . . . But rates will just as likely be higher because you are there over the holidays. At today's exchange rates (but who knows where they are going??) $150 = about £95 and €130 . . . doable for sure, but definitely down market in London.

If you cut back on the destinations/internal travel (train stations ain 't all that attractive) you'll have more money available for nicer accommodations.

shelemm

in addition to what others have said, all true, many brides get physically and emotionally overwhelmed for the wedding, and going on a whirlwind trip is more energy, less fun. Especially those airport days, ugh, what a time killer.

sofarsogood

On your honeymoon in December, in Europe?

The only sensible choice is to rent a cottage miles from anywhere in somewhere like the west coast of Ireland or Scotland. Spend all your time indoors making your own amusement, (if you get my drift) won't cost you much, and you'll return home feeling wonderful!

Gretchen

Everyone else has pounded the " 'way too many places" part of your itinerary. And since you mention a fairly borderline amount for your hotel, I assume you may also have a pretty restricted budget overall. When you change locations so many times, you not only lose a LOT of time, but you also will spend more money that in some ways you can't pinpoint ahead of time--transfers, the extra meal, etc.
This looks like a forced march, not a desirable thing for a honeymoon. You are young. You'll return to Europe. Choose 2 or 3 places at the most and truly enjoy them without worrying about "seeing it all" and then "getting to the train station".
The Riviera? Puhleeze--it's December.
Paris, Amsterdam, maybe Venice or London. You will have a memorable honeymoon.

msteacher

You may want to start by looking at your flights to and from Europe. You will want to fly into one city, and home from another ( click on "multi-city" on airline websites when searching flights). The locations where you can get the cheapest and/or most convenient flights may dictate some of your itinerary. Then chose at most two other locations with easy connections. For example, fly into London, train to Paris, fly or train to Venice, train to Rome, and fly home. Happy planning and best wishes for a wonderful marriage and honeymoon!

kybourbon

>>>I would like to say we can keep the majority of hotels under $150 USD per night, which seems rather realistic in December<<<

Major cities don't really reduce hotel rates as they are busy year round. I think it's more likely you will see higher rates over Christmas than reduced rates.

You seem to have 18 days in Europe (not counting jetlagged arrival day). You have 7 days of travel - checking in/out of hotels, getting to/from transport, etc. That leaves you 11 days to actually see places. Can you realistically expect to see 7 major cities with only 11 days?

>>>will be looking for a mixture of touring the historical areas as well as relaxing with a bottle of wine<<<

Cut a few places from your list so you will have time for this. I would cut a country (or two). Stick to a couple of countries that has easy transport between them so you have more time to be places than traveling to places. Once you narrow your cities down, people can make hotel suggestions. No point suggesting now for places you might not go.

shelemm

I had no problem with the weather in December going to Paris and Provence, so I don't think that's an issue.

StuDudley

We had a problem with the weather in December in Paris.

Overnight show stopped almost all transportation within Paris, until the snow melted/was plowed in the afternoon.

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...-was-paris.cfm

Look for pictures of Paris in the snow later on in this thread.

Stu Dudley

janisj

The OP registered to post this . . . sure hope he isn't one of those waiting for an e-mail notification of responses (unfortunately it happens all the time w/ newbies - they don't know about all the suggestions/advice because they think no one's replied)

StuDudley

Or they didn't hear what they wanted to hear - and are now seeking "elsewhere" for people who agree with their itinerary?

"Man hears what he wants to hear, and disregards the rest"

"The Boxer"
Paul Simon

Stu Dudley