Jennifer_Scutari

I am hoping some of you well travelled fodorites can help me!

I have two boys ages 11 and 13 who we will be bringing to Switzerland and Italy this summer for 10 days. I admit they are spoiled brats who somehow manage to ruin vacations with their complaints of being bored and not enjoying food. We even went away a week without them because we knew it wouldn't be enjoyable with them 2 years ago! If it isn't electronic, and if it wasn't cooked at home - they don't like it. It ends here.....if I can help it.

I am determined to make this the best 10 day vacation they have ever had. So how do I plan to do that? I hope by taking their minds off how much walking they will have to do and different foods they will be sampling by creating a treasure hunt that they will have to complete during the vacation.

Can you help me come up with some things, foods, places that they will have to identify, find,or try in order to complete their treasure hunt? Any ideas are welcome!

Things we plan on doing in Switzerland: Chocolate Factory tour, Cheese factory tour, Summer Tobbogan Ride, Glacier Park, Nature Hike and underground waterfall, Berne zoo.

Things we plan to do in Italy (we will be in remote areas Noepoli and Torraca for 2 days visiting relatives) and then 3 days in Rome. Vatican, Sistine Chapel, Colloseum, Spanish Steps area, Bocca Della Veritas, Catacombs (maybe).

If you've travelled to these locations with these ages and have any suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

Thanks in advance for your help!

Dukey1

And no, I don't have kids but if I did...

nytraveler

You need to get the kids involved in the trip planing - and used to eating in restaurants - before you go - or the trip will be no fun for anyone. Have them watch some videos about Rome/the ancient world - so they know what they're looking at. Take them out for a couple of italian dinners - so they get used to the food (and they eat it or go hungry).

These kids are too old to have problems wth this - they're just manipulating. Tell them it's time they start to grow up.

Wekiva

Not an expert on Switzerland yet (hope to be some day though) but something my boys and I have been doing for the last year or so is geocaching. This is a great way to combine outdoor activities and electronics. You'll need a GPS unit. Go to geocaching.com to find out more. My boys LOVE it and it gives them something to focus on when hiking.

Basically you'll be using the GPS to search for things other people have hidden. They are usually small containers with a sign-in log inside. If you have a smart phone and will be using data in Switz then you'll be ready to go. On our trip I'm to cheap to use data over there so I'll find 5 caches near each hotel and preprint the data that I'll take along.

I can understand the need to want to be tough on kids who are a bit spoiled...but still at the same time not being too tough so everyone has fun. I'm in the same boat. I think that telling the kids to eat what's in front of or go hungry is unrealistic on a trip. Vacation isn't the time to try and retrain the kids. Ask them what they want to eat and let them do some research on finding places to eat...get's them involved in the planning.

Have a great trip...I'm sure you're kids will love it.

wayfinder45

Sounds like you have a great start putting together a fun trip for everyone! Italy should not be a problem in terms of food -- we went for two weeks and my kids ate "spaghetti al pomodoro" for nearly every meal. Spaghetti with a plain red sauce is probably the safest kid meal you can get! Another strategy is to take them to a supermarket and let them pick out some things that look appealing. Although my kids mostly played it safe, they just naturally picked up some new favorites: nutella (naturally!), bruschetta, succo di frutta (fruit nectar), and grilled panini sandwiches.

Setting expectations before the trip is a good idea -- and let them have a say in setting those expectations. At least they're too old to crawl under the table in restaurants -- that was always MY biggest challenge in eating out with my kids! Constant struggle to keep them in their chairs!!

I'll think about treasure hunt ideas for Rome.

jgg

Here is a link to a great resource called "Thrills and Chills in the Eternal City". Lists a bunch of locations where you can see bones/skeletons and other creepy places. We have been to almost all of them. I think your boys will find these very interesting: http://www.slowtrav.com/italy/rome/chills_thrills.htm

wayfinder45

I was thinking of Santa Maria Concezione, but couldn't remember the name! Thanks Jgg! It's quite something! Perfect for boys this age I think.

I've decided I'm not very good at treasure hunt ideas, but along the same lines, you could have a contest to see who can spot the most severed heads in the Vatican Museum (there's quite a few to be sure!). There's enough blood and gore in that museum to keep them entertained (there's quite a bit on display that would be of interest to boys that age in fact ).

Another suggestion is to take them to a football match -- Romans are very passionate about their soccer!

You've only got 3 days in Rome, that's not a lot of time to be sure. I took my daughter to Paris for 3 days a few years ago and we decided that each day we would do one thing I really wanted to do and one thing she really wanted to do -- so it ended up something like the Louvre in the morning (my pick) and 3 hours shopping at H&M in the afternoon (her pick). We did other things as well, but it worked out nicely when we each got one "must do" a day.

jujubean

I second the geocaching idea! My kids love it and are in your kids' general age group. As for activities, my kids were very compliant - though I did get the occasional "really Mom, another church?" We tried a scavenger hunt in Venice and it fell a bit flat, I'm not sure why - perhaps there was just so much to see that it kept them busy enough just looking around. Don't put all of your eggs in any one basket!

Food really wasn't an issue for my kids in Switzerland or Italy. They ate various shades of white/beige food - in Italy noodles with butter and parmesan; in Switzerland they ate their weight in Rosti. We picked up food from grocery stores and they made their own sandwiches - and of course they loved the nutella, we have it at home often. Always have a healthy snack available. We generally either stopped at open air markets or groceries and got fruit/granola bars. Gas stations in Italy are generally good stops for sandwiches - but my kids say don't eat the sausage pizza. We never fought over any food because we never made them eat any food - though we did encourage trying new things. But sometimes with all of the newness around them, they just need to stick to a food they know.

Here's her 13 year old daughter with some advice! A good bit of advice to conquer boredom is to make everything a competition. (boys are very competitive) It's a good idea to make a treasure hunt. On a nature hike it's a good idea to make a list of things to find that you know you'll probably see, but wont see too often. You should try looking up some of the flora and fauna that is common in those areas. You could try having them hunt for odd mushrooms or unique rocks. I just advise against too many flowers! A HUGE tip that would spare you and your kids hard feelings is: take some breaks. Sometimes I felt like my parents were running me to the moon and back. If your kids start to complain too much about their feet hurting or wanting a rest, then let them have a rest.

so there you have it - straight from the 13 yo.

My last, but not least advice is to lower your expectations!!! I guarantee this will not be the "best 10 day vacation ever." But it can be a great trip with lifetime memories. Your kids will get on your nerves, big time, and you will bug them too. I really like being around my kids and I needed some serious "alone" time toward the end of the trip!

BarbAnn

Where in Switzerland are you going? We took our son twice to Switzerland...when he was 11 and then when he was 14. I have a lot of suggestions for many areas.

Get your kids involved in the travel plans. I had my son read some books on the areas, look at photos and had him plan some sightseeing excursions (with my help). He liked to swim, so a few of the hotels I reserved had indoor pools.

Jujubean made some great points regarding food and taking breaks.

Both trips were a blast. He is 22 years old now and still talks about those vacations. We made lifetime memories together. So will you.

tipsygus

Just one small point do not, I repeat do not pick the wild flowers. Take photographs, so many wild plants and flowers are protected species and the penalty for picking them is heavy

tipsygus

Just one small point do not, I repeat do not pick the wild flowers. Take photographs, so many wild plants and flowers are protected species and the penalty for picking them is heavy

jujubean

yes tipsygus - good point! we picked neither the mushrooms or the flowers as we were there in December! I think my DD's point was to find common treasures - but certainly keep a video diary rather than decimating the flora!

one thing we also did was bring tv/video hookup cables for our video camera. At the end of the day the girls loved watching themselves in the cool places on the tv. also helped them to process all that we had seen that day.

Jennifer_Scutari

Great suggestions so far, and from 13 yr old jujubean...special thanks we won't push them too much!

Dukeyfan1...no offense but if you don't have kids - don't give advice on them. At home my kids are allowed electronics for specified amount of time. We are going to allow them to bring an electronic because we have a 5 hour drive to the airport and a 10+ hour flight during which they will need something to do when they are not sleeping. I don't have a problem with them playing it in the hotel and at my parents but they will not have them during the day. They are both readers and will have a book or two as well...but can only read for so long. They DO have to walk often, are both very athletic, but don't enjoy just walking when it doesn't involve a sport. Hence why I try to come up with things for them to look for.
As far as food. They don't manipulate at home. I make one meal if they don't like it too bad. I don't cook to please them, and will not cook a separate meal for them. They don't like restaurant food, there's nothing wrong with not liking to eat out. We certainly save alot by rarely eating out.

Nytraveler...the boys are involved in some of the planning. They are each choosing things they want to do and we are planning on doing those things. That is one thing that helps make it enjoyable is that they are getting to make some decisions rather than us just dragging them along. It's just once they are there, jet lag and being tired = whining and non compliance. We will NOT be doing much except hanging out with my parents in Bern the first day we arrive. So hopefully that will help them recover to start the trip off right.
Food - we don't have good italian restaurants here...and my in-laws are from Italy and no food can rival what my boys grew up eating because of that. Most of the time when we go out they DO get spaghetti with sauce or chicken tenders, but most spaghetti sauce is NOT to their liking. I luckily was informed by my Mom today that they will have no issues with the food in Switzerland - she knows what they like and they will have no trouble finding stuff there. So, they'll just have to deal with what they can get in Rome at least it's only 3 days The two we spend with my father-in-law in Torraca will all be homemade and what they grew up with!

Wekiva, Wayfinder45...thanks for the geocaching and food ideas. I hadn't even thought of the geocaching! I think I will do what someone stated and print out a few known locations and let THEM find it on the map. And the severed head or bones ideas is great! They will like that.


BarbAnn...we are going to be staying with my parents in Bern. We are planning several day trips to Broc (choc factory), Interlaken (subterranean waterfall and hiking), Engelberg (monastery/cheese making, Mt. Titlis cable car ride to the glacier park), and a summer toboggan ride somewhere within an hour of Bern. Just need to figure out which one. None of this is really set in stone-except the chocolate factory which was a chosen activity by my 11 yr old, so if you think of something that would be enjoyable for the boys please suggest!

Tipsygus...no we won't! I will probably have to remind the boys. They do like to pick and give me flowers they find outside, but I am also letting them bring our old digital camera so they can take their own pictures.

Jennifer_Scutari

jgg...I meant to say THANKS so much for the link! I left you for last on purpose to say it it a great site and then left you out..sorry and THANKS!

Jennifer_Scutari

Oh, and btw. The boys are the ones that CHOSE the Sistine Chapel and the Colloseum. Glad so I don't have to drag them there

gruezi

I say, send the boys to Dukey's and go have a great time on your trip!!

Seriously, I do have kids and I have a certain feeling about family vacations. I have dragged my teens all over Europe and beyond and learned a lot of lessons doing it.

First, lower your expectations. Family time is different than adult time. Second, make sure each day has only one cultural activity and that it is 3 hours or less. Do something physical every day - swimming, walk, etc. If your parents are there and want to hang out low key with the grandkids the first day or two let them while you squeeze in some things you know the boys won't like. Let them be slugs for a day or two. A long hike in the mountains is something I would never do with my kids. Just not their thing. I remember my parents dragging me on painfully long bike rides at that age because they enjoyed that. I did not and I do give my kids the right to not like to do all the same things I enjoy.

I have two very picky eaters and in Switzerland and Italy they mostly ate pasta with butter and parmesan cheese and were very, very happy with it. Much of the pasta in both countries is freshly made and delicious. (They also had certain 'requirements' about red sauce as your boys do.) My younger daughter still loves the baguette sandwiches she started eating in Switzerland. (We tease her about eating her Swiss man sandwiches now that we are back in the US but she does love them.) Perhaps your boys will like them and they are available everywhere. My kids also liked the chicken nuggets and hot dog in pastry (Wuerstchen im Blattertieg) found in the hot food section of every Migros.

IME, kids at 11 and 13 do not adjust very quickly to jet lag and can be VERY cranky. I have seen this with lots of 13/14 year olds. It's not an easy age hormone-wise and being out of their element somehow throws them a bit more than it does adults or younger children. (11 is a delightful age for travel but 13 CAN be a horrible age. Be sure the 13-year-old does not pollute the mind of the 11-year-old.)

My kids have very different tolerance level for museums. We found it worked best to split up sometimes. One daughter and I went and did our museum thing while Dad and the non-museum kid did something else. Sometimes it works if one parent spends a few hours with both kids while the other parent gets to really enjoy something the rest of the family is perhaps not so interested in. Don't be afraid to each have some 'me' time. If safe, don't be afraid to have some Mom and Dad time too. Certainly in Bern or most places in Switzerland your boys can have a walk in town or hang out in the hotel while you and your husband go off alone.

I worked in Bern and lived in Zurich and your kids are very safe in both places. Give them a timeframe (an hour or two), a cell phone, and let them explore a little. There is a lovely art museum in Bern you can see in an hour or two while they walk around and find the bear pit. (Children in Switzerland get themselves to and from school alone beginning at age 4/5. Most Swiss in the cities speak some English and are very helpful esp. in terms of directions.)

Take them to Schilthorn and have them do the climb up. My very, very lazy 14-year-old did this with her Dad and was pretty proud of herself. There is a Bond movie this was featured in and perhaps your boys might also bring that along to watch. (Sorry, I have girls and Bond is not one of my things but I know boys who go to Schilthorn just because of this...)

Okay, here is my last tip but maybe only good for girls who like to shop and therefore want to earn cash. It is a low level bribery but worked for us:

I would institute a small competition after visiting various places such as the Sistine Chapel (which btw both girls really loved this because they knew about it from school) or the Colloseum (bring along Gladiator to watch after this). I would have about 5 questions from the tour in my head and as we left the site I'd ask them. Whoever answered first would get a Euro or smaller change depending on the degree of difficulty. Somehow they really liked this game, it made them listen a bit better, and we had some fun, and they liked earning the money for souvenirs and such.

Have fun!! Soon you will be looking at colleges....

gruezi

Jennifer_Scutari

gruezi, thank you. Very great suggestions, and nice to hear of experiences with children there. Very strange that the 13/14 age has more difficulty adjusting to jet lag?! We can always make our second day very relaxed as well.

We are considering Schilthorn instead of the Mt. Titlis cable car (especially because of the Bond Film connection). My father just did this a few weeks ago and sent us some pictures, so we'll see which the boys prefer. I think the glacier park at Mt. Titlis was intriguing to the boys so they may choose for that reason.

Great suggestions on the movie connections, and the questions game. They love to earn money and buy things of their own.

We are certainly learning as we plan, and will try not to accomplish too much in one day. We have learned over the last year how much we can do in one day before the meltdowns happen.

Good to know that the food won't be as much of an issue as I had thought it would be. Good thing is, they both do love pasta and will eat with butter and cheese happily!

jgg

I think someone else mentioned watching movies before you go. We have traveled a lot with our kids since they were 9 and 12 (now 15 and 18), I always found watching movies before hand made them very interested in seeing more of the places when they got there. Here are some suggestions for Italy:
The Gladiator
Italian Job (new and old)
Twilight Saga: New Moon
Duplicity
Since their boys not sure if you can get them to watch these - but honestly, really good for scenes of Italy (and you can watch them!!):
The Lizzie Maguire Movie
One and Only
When in Rome (Mary Kate and Ashley)
Roman Holiday

Lexma90

Jet lag with our kids. Our son (now 15yo) adjusts to it about as well as we do. Our daughter has always had difficulty adjusting to time changes - when we visit my folks, here in the U.S. but 2 time zones away, she really never changes, just stays up really late (playing cards with my mom, who loves it). So I was worried about how she would adjust on her first trip to Europe - Italy - when she was 10yo. She had NO problem. She slept some on the plane, but did not catnap, as DH and I did, on the leg from Frankfurt to Venice. I bet her a Kinder egg, and lost, that she'd fall asleep during dinner. I lost that bet!

Other ideas on food. DS will eat anything, so never had a problem. DD went through a time period where sometimes she couldn't decide what she wanted, and would get upset that she couldn't decide. So we developed a backup food item that EVERY Italian restaurant could make, on the menu or not: spaghetti aglio e olio. That's spaghetti with olive oil and sauteed garlic; we eat it at home, and she likes it. We only had to resort to that once. Also, we found that if a waiter suggested a food item, she was more likely to go with their suggestion.

Another thing we did was that she and I would share dishes, and each have half of two different dishes. That way, she could try something new, but only commit to eating half of it.

In Rome, we went to lots of museums, because everyone in our family likes them. But in addition, San Clemente church is very cool; it's a church on top of an earlier church, on top of a Mithraic temple and an ancient Roman house. You can visit all of them; not just for kids, of course, but very appealing.

San Ignazio has a tricky trompe l'oeil ceiling; have your kids figure it out themselves.

Nobody has mentioned gelato! Totally delicious and kids love it (and adults). One thing my daughter and I did - we would share a 3-flavor cup, but I would choose the flavors. She would then try to guess what the flavors were. Another fun quest, which we've done with kids in Paris with different foods, is to pick a certain flavor and compare them at different gelaterias.

Jennifer_Scutari

jgg..I have thought about trying to get them to watch Roman Holiday, or at least the part with the Bocca Della Verita. I have already told them of the belief it is lie detector!

They have both recently studied Rome in same way, so they are excited to see some of the things they have studied.