Germany-Austria-Switzerland
Apr 8th, 2004 | 06:34 AM
#1
Original Poster
Joined: Sep 2003
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Germany-Austria-Switzerland
Hey guys, I need help. I am surprising my wife with our first trip to Europe. We are going in September and staying for 8 nights. We have free passes from Delta(gifts), and want to fly into Frankfurt and make a big circle through Austria,Switzerland and dip into France before returning to Frankfurt. As we have no experience with Europe, is it better to get a railpass or rent a car? Is this possible in 8 nights? Thanks!!
Apr 8th, 2004 | 06:52 AM
#2
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 250
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dmr1203;
IMHO, this is way too much to try and see in 8 days. I have tried to do this before and spent most of my time traveling and the friends I did this with to this day have a difficult time separating which city they were in when they took that picture. I would try to limit it to 2 countries.
Clea
IMHO, this is way too much to try and see in 8 days. I have tried to do this before and spent most of my time traveling and the friends I did this with to this day have a difficult time separating which city they were in when they took that picture. I would try to limit it to 2 countries.
Clea
Apr 8th, 2004 | 07:11 AM
#4
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,194
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<<Hey guys, I need help.>>
Hey sir - - this is intended as politely as possible - - but yes, indeed, <b>you do</b>.
I don't know what you mean by surprise (remember... you can't get a passport for her withut her knowledge), but I urge you NOT to make any non-refundable purchases for this trip too quickly - - you can surprise her with the <b>intention</b> - - but there are a number of notions in this "plan" that are not your best bet. Especially not a "rail pass", unless the goal is primarily to see the inside of trains.
While you state that the flights are courtesy of free (gift) passes, actually locating "award seats" that you want could be more difficult than you anticipate. I would simply put the free passes in an envelope - - and let that be the surprise. And then put your heads together to make an itinerary - - ideally one that does not require you to backtrack to the same airport for departure back home as your arrival in Europe (called an "open jaw", and your passes should permit that).
The shortest itinerary that fits your description would be Frankfurt-Munich-Innsbruck-Basel-Strasbourg-Frankfurt.
That's 3.5 + 3 + 6 + 1.5 + 2.5 hrs by train - - thus it could be done - - but I would not personally want to do that much ground travel in less than two weeks.
If visiting four different Alpine countries is you first objective - - then you might be able to accomplish much of what you seek by flying into Munich, and returning from Basel (or Geneva); even if Delta does not fly to each of these places, it has partners that do. Basel has the unique advantage of being a "tri-country" airport (Switzerland, France and Germany) so you can return a German car there with no drop charge. Two days in Munich, then start a week long rental as you leave and head towards the Mad Ludwig castles - - Linderhof and Neuschwanstein - - you can get your "taste" of Austria by staying in Reutte, right on the German border for night three. Drive onward to Luzern for nights four and five, Depending on whether you want to finish in Geneva or Basel, you could swing through Chamonix/Annecy/Talloires or take in some of Alsace by "over-shooting" Basel (only an hour or so, and some excellent September countryside driving). This is a plan that could involve as few as six nights, so you have two left to allocate as you see fit to match your wishes - - and hers. You could even include a fifth "country" (well, it actually IS a real country, though it seems a rather artificial designation) by stopping for lunch, dinner or overnight in Liechtenstein!
Whatever your plan ends up, welcome to the forum - - I apologize if my opening sounds snippy - - I am sure you will get lots of good advice here. Keep coming back with more questions - - both more specific and broad, "fishing expedition" types, as your plans evolve.
Best wishes,
Rex
Hey sir - - this is intended as politely as possible - - but yes, indeed, <b>you do</b>.
I don't know what you mean by surprise (remember... you can't get a passport for her withut her knowledge), but I urge you NOT to make any non-refundable purchases for this trip too quickly - - you can surprise her with the <b>intention</b> - - but there are a number of notions in this "plan" that are not your best bet. Especially not a "rail pass", unless the goal is primarily to see the inside of trains.
While you state that the flights are courtesy of free (gift) passes, actually locating "award seats" that you want could be more difficult than you anticipate. I would simply put the free passes in an envelope - - and let that be the surprise. And then put your heads together to make an itinerary - - ideally one that does not require you to backtrack to the same airport for departure back home as your arrival in Europe (called an "open jaw", and your passes should permit that).
The shortest itinerary that fits your description would be Frankfurt-Munich-Innsbruck-Basel-Strasbourg-Frankfurt.
That's 3.5 + 3 + 6 + 1.5 + 2.5 hrs by train - - thus it could be done - - but I would not personally want to do that much ground travel in less than two weeks.
If visiting four different Alpine countries is you first objective - - then you might be able to accomplish much of what you seek by flying into Munich, and returning from Basel (or Geneva); even if Delta does not fly to each of these places, it has partners that do. Basel has the unique advantage of being a "tri-country" airport (Switzerland, France and Germany) so you can return a German car there with no drop charge. Two days in Munich, then start a week long rental as you leave and head towards the Mad Ludwig castles - - Linderhof and Neuschwanstein - - you can get your "taste" of Austria by staying in Reutte, right on the German border for night three. Drive onward to Luzern for nights four and five, Depending on whether you want to finish in Geneva or Basel, you could swing through Chamonix/Annecy/Talloires or take in some of Alsace by "over-shooting" Basel (only an hour or so, and some excellent September countryside driving). This is a plan that could involve as few as six nights, so you have two left to allocate as you see fit to match your wishes - - and hers. You could even include a fifth "country" (well, it actually IS a real country, though it seems a rather artificial designation) by stopping for lunch, dinner or overnight in Liechtenstein!
Whatever your plan ends up, welcome to the forum - - I apologize if my opening sounds snippy - - I am sure you will get lots of good advice here. Keep coming back with more questions - - both more specific and broad, "fishing expedition" types, as your plans evolve.
Best wishes,
Rex
Apr 8th, 2004 | 11:09 AM
#5
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 194
Likes: 0
dmr1203:
I agree that all 3 countries is too much. Flying in to Frankfurt, a home base along the Rhein would be nice to explore these wine-growing towns and also the Mosel Valley (Bacharach, Boppard, St. Goar, Koblenz). September is the time for wine festivals and firework displays off the castles which tower above this river. Mainz is a lovely mid-size city for your culture fix, and Cologne is a beautiful large city with impressive cathedral and tons of varied museums (chocolate history, religious artifacts, nazism, photography, etc). The Mosel Valley is a nearby offshoot of the Rhein with lovely towns as well- Cochem, Bernkastel-Kues, Trier with its Roman remains. Two top castles are in this area as well- Burg Eltz and the one above Cochem.
I would then move for the second half of the trip to Lucerne , Switzerland for the mountains and all the charm associated. Towns of Brienz, Spiez, Lauterbrunnen, Thun, Zug, etc each have deserving lures. There are pristine lakes for cruising surrounded by idyllic snow-capped peaks. Zurich is a wonderful large city, especially for shopping, and Bern a favorite smaller personal favorite city with arcaded shops and bear pits.
Read a travel book to narrow down your personal likes and dislikes, then repost with specific questions...!
I agree that all 3 countries is too much. Flying in to Frankfurt, a home base along the Rhein would be nice to explore these wine-growing towns and also the Mosel Valley (Bacharach, Boppard, St. Goar, Koblenz). September is the time for wine festivals and firework displays off the castles which tower above this river. Mainz is a lovely mid-size city for your culture fix, and Cologne is a beautiful large city with impressive cathedral and tons of varied museums (chocolate history, religious artifacts, nazism, photography, etc). The Mosel Valley is a nearby offshoot of the Rhein with lovely towns as well- Cochem, Bernkastel-Kues, Trier with its Roman remains. Two top castles are in this area as well- Burg Eltz and the one above Cochem.
I would then move for the second half of the trip to Lucerne , Switzerland for the mountains and all the charm associated. Towns of Brienz, Spiez, Lauterbrunnen, Thun, Zug, etc each have deserving lures. There are pristine lakes for cruising surrounded by idyllic snow-capped peaks. Zurich is a wonderful large city, especially for shopping, and Bern a favorite smaller personal favorite city with arcaded shops and bear pits.
Read a travel book to narrow down your personal likes and dislikes, then repost with specific questions...!
Apr 8th, 2004 | 11:17 AM
#6
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 194
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dmr1203:
Forgot to mention, I always travel by rail and have never regretted it, but ONLY if you are not trying to encompass such a large area of Europe... The trains are frequent and reach all of the towns listed previously (and more, obviously). There are new 2-country combined passes available-check to see if any would suit your plans!
If you limit your circle of interest to 2 or 3 geographic locations, distances would not be all that far, and to me, it beats the hassle of driving and looking for a parking place in the towns.
But drivers have their preferences as well.....
Forgot to mention, I always travel by rail and have never regretted it, but ONLY if you are not trying to encompass such a large area of Europe... The trains are frequent and reach all of the towns listed previously (and more, obviously). There are new 2-country combined passes available-check to see if any would suit your plans!
If you limit your circle of interest to 2 or 3 geographic locations, distances would not be all that far, and to me, it beats the hassle of driving and looking for a parking place in the towns.
But drivers have their preferences as well.....
Apr 8th, 2004 | 11:25 AM
#7
Original Poster
Joined: Sep 2003
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Well, I know that I want to drive down the romantic road(staying in Rothenberg), and then Garmisch/Neuschweinstein. After that, it is still in planning, but I would like to see a little of Switzerland, and then if possible, my wife has always wanted to take an overnight train. I thought to Paris would be nice. Is it possible? I have 9 nights.
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Apr 8th, 2004 | 11:34 AM
#8
Joined: Feb 2003
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You'll be tired and not recalling much of your trip!
If Rothenburg and Garmisch are must -sees, I would dip a just a little more south to northern Switzerland--around the Lake Constance area(Bodensee). Stein am Rhein is a terrific small swiss town of medieval painted buildings with a fortress above. Lindau is warm and a favorite on this board for many. Appenzell is in northern Switzerland as well--this IS Heidi-country--rolling hills, cows, quaint dress. One local mountain reachable from Urnasch-impressive to me, but its no Alp!
To add Paris is a considerable hike away.
Would you consider a little taste of France just west of the Black Forest, Germany to save time? Strassbourg, Colmar, Riquewehr and Ribeaville are along a "Wine growers Route" in southeast France. That way, getting back to Frankfurt to fly back home would not be a major ordeal.
If Rothenburg and Garmisch are must -sees, I would dip a just a little more south to northern Switzerland--around the Lake Constance area(Bodensee). Stein am Rhein is a terrific small swiss town of medieval painted buildings with a fortress above. Lindau is warm and a favorite on this board for many. Appenzell is in northern Switzerland as well--this IS Heidi-country--rolling hills, cows, quaint dress. One local mountain reachable from Urnasch-impressive to me, but its no Alp!
To add Paris is a considerable hike away.
Would you consider a little taste of France just west of the Black Forest, Germany to save time? Strassbourg, Colmar, Riquewehr and Ribeaville are along a "Wine growers Route" in southeast France. That way, getting back to Frankfurt to fly back home would not be a major ordeal.
Apr 9th, 2004 | 06:17 AM
#11
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Posts: n/a
dmr1203,
I sure you didn't notice but you wrote "Neuschweinstein" instead of "Neuschwanstein". German folks will raise an eyebrow if you ask your way to "Neuschweinstein": A "Schwein" is a pig, whereas a "Schwan" is a swan
.
Perhaps that is why many Fodorites prefer Schloss Linderhof
I sure you didn't notice but you wrote "Neuschweinstein" instead of "Neuschwanstein". German folks will raise an eyebrow if you ask your way to "Neuschweinstein": A "Schwein" is a pig, whereas a "Schwan" is a swan
.Perhaps that is why many Fodorites prefer Schloss Linderhof
Apr 9th, 2004 | 06:28 AM
#12
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 13,194
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<<Since we are flying on pass, we can fly back to Atlanta(home) from Paris. Would that make it better?>>
It's a good idea if you are more interested in France than Alpine DE/CH/A. For eight nights, I would go straight from Frankfurt to Strasbourg by train, and spend one (or two) night(s) there. Then rent a car, and spend two-three days/nights in Alsace and/or the Black Forest. Head to Paris and turn in the car and spend the rest of the trip there.
But this is a very different trip than you started off asking about
It's a good idea if you are more interested in France than Alpine DE/CH/A. For eight nights, I would go straight from Frankfurt to Strasbourg by train, and spend one (or two) night(s) there. Then rent a car, and spend two-three days/nights in Alsace and/or the Black Forest. Head to Paris and turn in the car and spend the rest of the trip there.
But this is a very different trip than you started off asking about
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