Palenque

Business Travel News has published their annual Corporate Travel Index listing what a typical breakfast, lunch and dinner costs per diem for business travelers on expense accounts:

Number one most expensive food cities in the whole world: AMSTERDAM and PARIS tied, at $237 per day for the three meals

1-Amsterdam $237/day
1- Paris $237
3- Osaka-Kobe $207
4- Copenhagen $199
5- Stockholm $197
6- Lyon $196
7- Barcelona $195
7- Frankfurt $195
9- The Hague $194
10- Brussels $191
11 - Oslo $187
12- Dublin $185
12- Tokyo $185
14 Luxembourg $183
15 Milan $180
16 Helsinki $177
17 - Geneva $176
18- Doha -$173 (Where the H is Doha?)
19- Dubai $171
20 - Madrid $167

Note that meals do not include cost of alcoholic beverages, which for the typical business person could perhaps double the total - and would no doubt push Oslo, Stockholm and Helsinki much higher due to the predatory price one must pay for booze in those places.

London? #33 at $135 ("Central London)

skinnylizard

Doha is in Qatar, middle east.

skinnylizard

if you have the time and are into clothes, there is a mall an hour from Milan which is almost all discounted brands. i wanted to go but we didnt have the time on my last trip.

i cant recall the name as of now but i am sure someone here could guide you to it.

travelgourmet

Not sure where they get this from, because the numbers seem WAAAY off to me. I mean, if Zurich isn't on the list, I kind of have to dismiss it - absurdly expensive (and pretty lousy) food. And Copenhagen is certainly more expensive than Paris or Amsterdam. My company has guidelines for food costs each day. I've never heard anyone complain about coming in under the guidelines in Amsterdam, but everyone complains about Copenhagen. And what is Brussels doing on this list?

My guess is that they may be surveying corporations to find out what business travelers actually spend, not what they can or should spend. These things are always fun discussion starters, though.

More importantly, who spends this kind of money? Assuming even $30 for breakfast and $50 for lunch, you still have enough to go to a very high-end place for dinner. I've never seen a corporate travel policy that would allow this kind of spend. $75 or $100 is much more the norm, even in Europe. Maybe consulting or I-Banking, but we've seen that I-Banks don't really run themselves like businesses...

I would seriously considering firing someone that submitted $200 per day in food costs for business travel, because it calls into question their judgment. I have no trouble spending big money when I am paying, but I think it unethical to AVERAGE that kind of spend on expense account. Maybe once on a long assignment, management might treat an entire team to a blow-out meal, but to average it?

And no, I don't think London is that expensive for dining, so it isn't that surprising it is low.

hetismij

Where on earth are they eating in Amsterdam to spend that much?
I just don't believe it, unless they are eating at Ciel Bleu everyday. Then, if they chose the most expensive things on the menu they would exceed that figure, just for the meal, but that is a Michelin two star restaurant.

ira

Hi Pal,

>for business travelers on expense accounts:....1- Paris $237<

Then there are real people:....under $75.

ira

How can Osaka-Kobe be 20% higher than Tokyo?

As of March 1, 2009, the US State Dept lists $167 for Meals & Incidentals in Paris, $163 in Amsterdam, Osaka-Kobe is $193 and Tokyo is $211.

Dukey

I suspect some of the supposed "foodies" would know about the prices, especially those who are into the so-called "molecular cuisine" ...and obviously you can eat well, REAL food, and of UN-microscopic portions AND without any of that suspicious "drizzle" on the plates for a lot less in Amsterdam. Even if you brave "the worst french fries on the planet" at the Burger King at Schiphol!!!!

But I definitely agree that Zurich should be on there SOMEWHERE..a definite oversight but knowing the Swiss as we do, they're probably delighted to go unnoticed.

hetismij

I've never eaten at Ciel Bleu, I couldn't afford to even if I wanted to. I just looked up their menu on the net, figuring a 2 star restaurant in a chic hotel would be pretty darned expensive. I was right. But I can't imagine most business travellers eating there either, at least not normally. Maybe to celebrate a signed contract, (or their latest bonus ) but not on a normal business trip.
I'd love to see a breakdown of the prices they are allowing for the three meals.

I haven't even eaten at the one star restaurant where my DIL works. No corporate budget to pay for it.

USNR

Seems very high to me, but I haven't been on an expense account in a long, long time. London, in our most recent experience, seemed very expensive. But, like anywhere, it depends on where you eat and what you choose from the menu. Certainly, for a big city, Buenos Aires offered wonderful value. Amman, Athens, and Cairo offered bargains galore. China's and Viet Nam's cities were the best of all.

travelgourmet

<i>How can Osaka-Kobe be 20% higher than Tokyo?</i>

In my limited experience, I didn't find Tokyo any more expensive than Osaka (the price of Kobe beef may drive up those averages). In neither place did I find food prices to be as high as the reputation would suggest. Yes, we had a couple of a couple of blow-out sushi meals, but I don't recall them being much more expensive than a top sushi place in the US or Europe.

And there was plenty of "fast food" that was fantastic and a bargain. For example, we ate at a stand-up sushi bar in Tokyo that rivaled the quality of the better places, but was incredibly cheap. One guess would be that they have such a bad reputation because the western-oriented places are expensive?

Don't get me wrong, Japan is expensive. I was just expecting it to be the most expensive place I had ever been and to be walking around dazed and confused over the high prices. But I didn't think it much more expensive than places like Oslo, Zurich, and Copenhagen. We hit upon a good exchange rate, but even then. Heck, we went to Japan specifically because a trip to Southern France was looking so expensive.

Palenque

Zurich clocked in at #44 - $124/day
but Prague was higher - $127/day

that's mind-boggling

cheapest: La Paz $29/day

Cheapest in Europe - Bucharest $66/d
then Birmingham $90/d
Lisbon $96
Glasgow $100

For some reason New York city is not on the list - the list is not the 100 most expensive cities but a survey of "Food Costs in 100 International Cities.

RufusTFirefly

It does depend on where and what you eat. You can keep body and soul together quite nicely in Tokyo for $50 a day--and I'm not talking picking up packaged noodles at the grocery store. In Amsterdam, our dinners averaged about $30 per person, and we ate well.

Michael

Since I do not qualify for an AIG bonus, I can't frequent the establishments that were used for the survey.

Palenque

And the survey says Hotel costs make up 59% of per diem expenses - food 36% and Miscellaneous 5%

Methodology:

"The 2009 International Corporate Travel Index is based on research showing accepted negotiated upscale daily hotel rooms and actual 2008 menu item costs for hotel continental breakfasts, lunches of sandwich, sald and nonalcholic drink and dinners of a fish, chicken or beer entree, salad and a nonalcoholic drink."

RufusTFirefly

OK, dining at the hotel. Makes sense.