michelle1018

Hi,
My hubby & I are going to Germany, Austria & Italy in May. We're flying into Frankfurt, going to Munich for 3 days, taking day trips to Ludwig's castle & Dauchau. From there, we're going to Salzburg for a few days, then on to Venice. Would it be a better deal to get the German FlexiPass or just do point to point tix? I'm not sure what all the German pass covers.

Thanks a bunch!

Larryincolorado

For FRA to Munich, you can do it using a local transit (RMV) ticket to Kahl and a Bayern-Ticket from there to Munich. That way will cost far less than a rail pass day, but will take longer (about 2 hours), since you can't use the express trains, which you can use with a rail pass.

As for Dachau, with a local (MVV) day ticket (€11,80 for both of you), it will cost far less than a day each of a rail pass.

Likewise, Munich to Füssen and return can be done with a Bayern Ticket for €27 (for both of you, round trip). The trains to/from Füssen are all regional, so you won't be giving up anything timewise.

Same thing for Munich to Salzburg; one €27 Bayern-Ticket will cover the entire trip by regional trains (express trains only save a half hour).

So, two Bayern-Tickets for €27 each and an MVV Partner XXL Tageskarte for €10,80, will get you to Dachau, Füssen, and Salzburg for €65 total (about $88). FRA to Munich via regional trains will cost €40,20 ($55)using local RMV tickets to Bavaria and a Bayern-Ticket from there. That's $143 for the four days. How does that compare with the cost a four day German Rail twin pass ($346?). Is that worth the 2 hours you will save from FRA to Munich and half an hour to Salzburg?

If you want more info on how to do the trip using Bayern-Tickets, write me at larryincolorado at hotmail.com.

PalenQ

Or you could consider the Germany-Austria saver railpass which would take you on any train at any time for all your trip except the relatively cheap Austrian border (Villach) to Venice portion. much cheaper than a Eurail Select Pass - also a flexipass and comes in 2nd class for all ages as well. for info on any railpasses i always recommend a call to BETs (800-441-2387; www.budgeteuropetravel.com as they will patiently answer any rail question. www.ricksteves.com has good info as does the 'guru' of German trains on Fodor's - Larry in the above post. the value of the pass is that you can just hop trains - valid on all whereas regional passes are typically not valid on the fastest trains.

But easy to compare regular fares at www.bahn.de - put in Munich to Vienna via Salzburg to get the Munich-Salzburg-Vienna price if bahn.de does not give a Salzburg-Vienna price or go to www.obb.at - austrain rail web site.

michelle1018

Thanks so much!!! We're not in any hurry, so the point to point sounds great.

ira

Hi M,

For schedules and prices for trains in and from Germany, see www.bahn.de

PalenQ

<Thanks so much!!! We're not in any hurry, so the point to point sounds great.>

being in a hurry has nothing to do with whether a pass is good for you or not - it could save you money as well as giving flexibility so compare prices - and a pass could be mixed with the Bavarian Ticket too and still be economical perhaps. I haven't analyzed your trip train costs but you should and compare to pass and not dismiss because you are not in a hurry IMO

Larryincolorado

<I haven't analyzed your trip train costs but you should and compare to pass>.

I did that on Apr 20, above. It might cost her as little as $143 using some point-point tickets and Bayern-Tickets, compared to $346 for a German Rail Twin pass. When using the Bayern-Tickets, she would have the same on/off flexibility, albeit on regional trains.

Her reply about not being in any hurry was in response to my estimate that it would take 2-3 hours longer over the 4 days by using regional trains.

One more thing I should add. The Bayern-Ticket is available all day on weekends, but only after 9 AM on weekdays. If she can make the trip to Füssen on a Sat. or Sun. she could leave quite early and have some extra time.

On a weekday, there is a train that leaves Munich Hbf at 8:52 - too early for the Bayern-Ticket. However, that train goes through Geltendorf after 9 AM, so they could buy two MVV tickets to Geltendorf for €6,60 per person and use them before 9 AM. That would make the total cost about $160, still much less than a railpass, and it would cover any local transportation to the Hbf.

If they wanted to leave Munich reeaally early, they would have to buy two point-point tickets for the morning trip (one-way) for about €41. For the return, a Bayern-Ticket would still save them money. With an early morning trip from Munich to Füssen, the total cost of their rail travel in Germany would still be only about $200, much less than the railpass.

Lastly, if she wants to see more about using the Bayern-Ticket to get from FRA, I have some info about that on my website, http://www.geocities.com/reise_deuts...RA2Bayern.html.

PalenQ

ttt

PalenQ

I would still investigate the Eurail Select pass good for Germany, austria and italy - the Frankfurt to Munich train ride alone could cost 80 euros or more p.p. i think for a walk up ticket which is preferrable for taking the next convenient train after landing.

SPAR fares non-refundable, etc. you would need to build in a lot of fudge time in case plane is late, etc.

And Salzburg-Venice can cost a lot - pass for those over 25 is first class and that also has a lot of benefits in finding seats, luggage, etc.

Larryincolorado

>>I would still investigate the Eurail Select pass

It’s a little late for Michelle, considering they made the trip last month.

On the other hand, analyzing this use of a pass might be a good case study.

According to the RailEurope, RailPass, and Eurail websites, the 3 country select saverpass is available in 5 days minimum for $365 per person, $730 for two. OK, so you could use the pass for (day 1) FRA to Munich, (day 2) around Munich and Hbf to Dachau bahnhof (but only by S-bahn), (day 3) Munich to Füssen RT, (day 4) Munich to Salzburg, and (day 5) Salzburg to Venice. On day 2, the railpass is valid for the S-bahn to Dachau bahnhof, but not for the MVV bus to the memorial. Add €1,10 pP each way for the bus (€4,40 total). The best connection from Salzburg to Venice per DB is Salzburg to Innsbruck via Austrian EC, then Innsbruck to Venice via EC 87. EC 87 requires a reservation, probably €3 pP, €6 total. The trip from Füssen Bahnhof to Hohenschwangau via RVO bus is probably not included on a railpass, but I don’t know for sure, so I won’t count it. The final cost, then, of travel using a DE/AT/IT select saver pass would be $745, about €548.

While I completely concur with you about the inadvisability of using SparPreis fares on the day of arrival, he didn’t say he was leaving immediately for Munich, but for the sake of argument, we will assume he is. It really doesn't matter, because he has a walk-up option for only a little more than a SparPreis fare or a day of the railpass.

The MOST one should pay for FRA to Munich is via a direct ICE for €81. That trip takes 3-½ hours. The trip to Dachau is on MVV S-bahn, and will take the same time with or without a railpass. So also, the trip to Füssen will be by regional trains, no time advantage to using a railpass. The trip to Salzburg, using a railpass for the fastest train (IC) will take 1-½ hours. According to DB, the trip from Salzburg to Innsbruck to Venice is 8 hours. (There is a faster connection via Villach, but it gets into Venice late, at 21:20.) That is 13 hours total using the pass for FRA to Munich to Salzburg to Venice.

The absolutely least expensive way to get from FRA to Munich is RMV to Kahl and a Bayern-Ticket from Kahl to Munich. That is 2x €6,60 plus €27 for the BT - €40,20 total. That route takes about 6h 10m. Again, we neglect the time to Dachau and Füssen because it doesn’t matter which ticket means you use, but the fares are €27 for the BT to Füssen and €11,80 for the XXL day ticket to Dachau. Munich to Salzburg takes 2 hours (average) using a €27 Bayern-Ticket. The least expensive way I can find to Venice is back to Munich (2 hrs, €27), and then take EC 87 to Venice. Italien-Spezial tickets are available for that train for €32,50 per person, including the required reservation. That takes 9-1/4 hours, Salzburg to Venice.

So, the fastest way, using the rail pass, takes 13 hours; the least expensive way takes 17h 25 min. That’s 4h 25m longer. Total non-railpass cost was €198, about $269, a saving of $475 for your 4-½ hours of extra time.

If you want to spend a little more money to save some time, take the IC from FRA to Munich for €67 per person, €134 total. That takes 4 ½ hours, only an hour longer than the ICE. This way you will save $350 at a cost of 2h 45m more travel.

So, with the DE/AT/IT Eurail pass you get first class and a few less hours, but it costs, on average, more than twice as much.

PalenQ

Personally i may pay twice as much for first class fully flexible travel than 2nd class restricted. To me it's like staying in a youth hostel vs nice hotel.