Europe in 5 month
Dec 4th, 2014, 02:32 AM
#21
Five months sounds like a great length of time to be able to spend and IMO lends itself to a minimum of a week in each stopping place. After a week, I tend to get itchy feet and want to move on to the next place.
If you're looking for beach weather, I'd recommend Egypt at Sharm el Sheikh or maybe a Nile Cruise to start off with without biting into your Schengen time and then to Israel/Cyprus/Turkey for the next 3 weeks. As you then travel west, the temperatures will fall in the first couple of months, but then start to rise again in Spring.
You may need to finish off in the UK for the last month, but that's a great time to visit and it'll give you lots of time to see more of the place. Alternatively apply for individual visas to suit you route.
If you're looking for beach weather, I'd recommend Egypt at Sharm el Sheikh or maybe a Nile Cruise to start off with without biting into your Schengen time and then to Israel/Cyprus/Turkey for the next 3 weeks. As you then travel west, the temperatures will fall in the first couple of months, but then start to rise again in Spring.
You may need to finish off in the UK for the last month, but that's a great time to visit and it'll give you lots of time to see more of the place. Alternatively apply for individual visas to suit you route.
Dec 4th, 2014, 02:41 AM
#22
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
<< I don't think the people who advised you to reverse the order of your trip read that sentence very carefully. >>
I read what they wrote carefully.
Reversing the order did not mean that Israel would have beach weather in December nor did it mean that Europe would have beach weather in April. I never stated this nor did I imply it. I gave my rationale for reversing the order.
I read what they wrote carefully.
Reversing the order did not mean that Israel would have beach weather in December nor did it mean that Europe would have beach weather in April. I never stated this nor did I imply it. I gave my rationale for reversing the order.
Dec 4th, 2014, 02:51 AM
#23
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,971
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Interesting idea from Rubicund. Sharm el-Sheikh in the Red Sea is a good place for winter beach holidays, and unlike some parts of the Sinai Peninsula is perfectly safe for tourists. It's very popular with snorkelers and scuba divers for the coral and tropical fish.
If you started your trip in March, a few weeks later in April the weather will be warming up in places like Cyprus and Israel. Start your trip in December, however, and that won't work, because in southern Europe January and February will only get colder. There are good air connections with northern Europe, however, so you could fly from there to, say, the UK and Ireland which are outside the Schengen zone.
If you started your trip in March, a few weeks later in April the weather will be warming up in places like Cyprus and Israel. Start your trip in December, however, and that won't work, because in southern Europe January and February will only get colder. There are good air connections with northern Europe, however, so you could fly from there to, say, the UK and Ireland which are outside the Schengen zone.
Dec 4th, 2014, 02:55 AM
#24
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,971
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Adrienne, that would mean they would have dreary weather for most of their trip. I still think they should stick with their plan, or consider the suggestion by Rubicund. If the OP wants to end the trip with days on the beach we should be helping them with that.
Dec 4th, 2014, 04:36 AM
#25
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Ending the trip on a beach is not a definite since the OP said they are "thinking" of doing this. They're looking for overall suggestions. The following sentence is "I would appreciate any advise..."
I don't think they know what they want just yet; they're trying to formulate a plan.
I don't think they know what they want just yet; they're trying to formulate a plan.
Dec 4th, 2014, 04:43 AM
#26
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My suggestions were to help them avoid winter weather such as they have in Boston. Northern Europe in winter will not help with this desire.
Basically there are two extremes for this trip. Avoid winter weather and find a beach in April.
I agree with whomever said to delay the trip, if possible, to fit the weather criteria.
Basically there are two extremes for this trip. Avoid winter weather and find a beach in April.
I agree with whomever said to delay the trip, if possible, to fit the weather criteria.
Dec 4th, 2014, 06:00 AM
#27
>>>Yes -- it is a firm 90 days w/i any 180 day period.<<<
As Janis points out, it's 90 days within 180 days. It doesn't have to be all at once. You could spend 30 days in Schengen countries, travel to Israel for a while, back to Schengen countries for your remaining days as long as it's all completed within the 180 day time limit. You have to be out of Schengen when you hit day 90 and you might not want to cut it that close in case of strikes or other delays. The UK allows you to stay 6 months, but wasn't on your list.
As Janis points out, it's 90 days within 180 days. It doesn't have to be all at once. You could spend 30 days in Schengen countries, travel to Israel for a while, back to Schengen countries for your remaining days as long as it's all completed within the 180 day time limit. You have to be out of Schengen when you hit day 90 and you might not want to cut it that close in case of strikes or other delays. The UK allows you to stay 6 months, but wasn't on your list.
Dec 4th, 2014, 06:32 AM
#28
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,971
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Okay, adrienne, we may not agree but at least we are providing additional information. I would never go to Greece or anywhere else in the Med for beaches in April. Greek Orthodox Easter is April 12th in 2015, and that would be something to see, as it's the biggest holiday of the year in Greece. It's a great time to be there, but not for a swim.
Dec 4th, 2014, 08:32 AM
#29
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 57,890
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
For US citizens a tourist via to Schengen is limited very strictly to 90 days in any 180 days (that is, after 90 days you must leave and can;t come back until 90 more days have passed). This tourist visa is not specific paperwork, just a control on when your passport is stamped as entry.
If you want to stay longer you need to get a different type of visa (student, work, retirement, etc) which are actual visas you must get before you leave the US - and all have stringent requirements that I don't believe you would meet . So this is not a realistic option unless you want to go to a lot of trouble and expense - and figure out how you would qualify. You can go in and out of the UK - which is not part of Schengen.
As for healthcare, you need to check with your current insurer to see what they cover. Unless a strict HMO like Kaiser they usually cover you abroad - although you have to pay the bill and then collect from the company. Medicare is not valid outside the US. But if you are getting travel insurance anyway you may want to buy evacuation insurance - which typical US insurance plans do NOT cover,
If you want to stay longer you need to get a different type of visa (student, work, retirement, etc) which are actual visas you must get before you leave the US - and all have stringent requirements that I don't believe you would meet . So this is not a realistic option unless you want to go to a lot of trouble and expense - and figure out how you would qualify. You can go in and out of the UK - which is not part of Schengen.
As for healthcare, you need to check with your current insurer to see what they cover. Unless a strict HMO like Kaiser they usually cover you abroad - although you have to pay the bill and then collect from the company. Medicare is not valid outside the US. But if you are getting travel insurance anyway you may want to buy evacuation insurance - which typical US insurance plans do NOT cover,
Dec 4th, 2014, 09:13 AM
#31
Oh - >>Unless a strict HMO like Kaiser they usually cover you abroad -<<
Kaiser covers you for any emergency/urgent services.
But the main thing is you need to consider <u>medical evacuation</u>.
I severely sprained my ankle in May in the UK. A&E (emergency room) took acre of everything -- xrays, crutches, pain prescription, etc for free -- but if it had been a major injury and I needed to fly home immediately it would have been on my dime and if I had needed a medical/attended flight it would have cost 10' of thousands.
Kaiser covers you for any emergency/urgent services.
But the main thing is you need to consider <u>medical evacuation</u>.
I severely sprained my ankle in May in the UK. A&E (emergency room) took acre of everything -- xrays, crutches, pain prescription, etc for free -- but if it had been a major injury and I needed to fly home immediately it would have been on my dime and if I had needed a medical/attended flight it would have cost 10' of thousands.
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:05 AM
#33
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 78,320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I tripped in Naples and smashed my nose and head - blood all over -went to nearby train station medical room and they called an ambulence - got head X-rays (showed nothing!) - bandaged me up and all that there was no charge to me nor my insurance - the hospital there said they had no means of charging for medical care as it was free for all Italians at least.
ditto in the Florence ER when I had to get a tetanus shot.
But like janis and Heimdall say evacuation insurance is another thing - few insurance policies (health) cover that and yes it could cost zillions... you never know...
ditto in the Florence ER when I had to get a tetanus shot.
But like janis and Heimdall say evacuation insurance is another thing - few insurance policies (health) cover that and yes it could cost zillions... you never know...
Dec 4th, 2014, 11:03 AM
#34
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 660
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Schengen is 90 in 180 calendar days but it does NOT mean you must leave for 90 days before returning. People often misunderstand the Schengen Rule. It means you must look at the last 180 calendar days and count how many of them you spent in Schengen countries.
You can for example spend 1 month in and 1 month out forever if you wanted to. At no time will you exceed the 90 in 180 rule if you did that.
Or for example you could spend a month in Schengen (skiing, Vienna, etc.) and then go to Israel and work your way back over a month long period, then spend a month in Schengen, spend a month in the UK, go back into Schengen to spend a last month on a beach in Schengen.
My point is, do not get hung up on the '90 days outside of Schengen' that people often think you must do. It is the 'in 180 days' that matters.
I don't know how many people responding here have actually spent 5 months travelling but there are some things that differ from a 2 week vacation. One is burnout. Most people who travel for longer terms find they burn out after about 6 weeks maximum and need a longer stop to relax and recharge their batteries. The faster you travel (more moves you make) the faster you burn out.
Having 5 months available is ideal for 'Slow Travel' which basically means moving no more often than weekly and trying to 'live' in places as much as possible rather than just doing the typical tourist things every day.
http://www.slowmovement.com/slow_travel.php
It is just as easy to fall into the usual tourist mistake of trying to see/do too much in too little time with 5 months as it is with 2 weeks. Personally, I would suggest that 5 months is enough time for no more than 5 countries. Slow yourself down BEFORE you start planning.
That brings me to planning. When you travel for longer periods of time, there is more opportunity for things to just happen. Doing research beforehand is fine but locking yourself in to an itinerary is yet another typical tourist mistake.
Having 5 months to work with is a good period of time to enjoy the FREEDOM of travel. That is the freedom to get up each morning and say, 'what will we do today? Will we do something here or will we move on?' Why people want to give up that freedom by setting an itinerary makes no sense to me whatsoever. It is entirely about habit and conforming to a schedule in your everyday life. You do NOT have to meet a schedule when you are on vacation, so why self-impose one?
Learn to wing it and make it up as you go along. After 5 days in A if you feel like moving on fine, move on, if not stay longer. When you are ready to move on and not before, then decide where you would like to go next and go there. Repeat the process until either your available time or available funds runs out. Go home. Travel can be as simple or as complicated as you choose to make it. I prefer simple.
Things happen, you meet people who tell you about somewhere or some event etc. that you have never thought of. I always remember hearing someone being offered an opportunity to do something saying, 'Wow, I would love to do that BUT I have a reservation in X'. That person had blinders on thanks to a pre-planned itinerary and could not see the opportunity they were being offered.
A long term trip is not about how many places you get to in your available time, it is about what you get out of each day of your time in terms of quality not quantity.
Do your research, write your lists of places you would LIKE to see and then when you get on the plane to A, throw the list (figuratively) out the window.
You can for example spend 1 month in and 1 month out forever if you wanted to. At no time will you exceed the 90 in 180 rule if you did that.
Or for example you could spend a month in Schengen (skiing, Vienna, etc.) and then go to Israel and work your way back over a month long period, then spend a month in Schengen, spend a month in the UK, go back into Schengen to spend a last month on a beach in Schengen.
My point is, do not get hung up on the '90 days outside of Schengen' that people often think you must do. It is the 'in 180 days' that matters.
I don't know how many people responding here have actually spent 5 months travelling but there are some things that differ from a 2 week vacation. One is burnout. Most people who travel for longer terms find they burn out after about 6 weeks maximum and need a longer stop to relax and recharge their batteries. The faster you travel (more moves you make) the faster you burn out.
Having 5 months available is ideal for 'Slow Travel' which basically means moving no more often than weekly and trying to 'live' in places as much as possible rather than just doing the typical tourist things every day.
http://www.slowmovement.com/slow_travel.php
It is just as easy to fall into the usual tourist mistake of trying to see/do too much in too little time with 5 months as it is with 2 weeks. Personally, I would suggest that 5 months is enough time for no more than 5 countries. Slow yourself down BEFORE you start planning.
That brings me to planning. When you travel for longer periods of time, there is more opportunity for things to just happen. Doing research beforehand is fine but locking yourself in to an itinerary is yet another typical tourist mistake.
Having 5 months to work with is a good period of time to enjoy the FREEDOM of travel. That is the freedom to get up each morning and say, 'what will we do today? Will we do something here or will we move on?' Why people want to give up that freedom by setting an itinerary makes no sense to me whatsoever. It is entirely about habit and conforming to a schedule in your everyday life. You do NOT have to meet a schedule when you are on vacation, so why self-impose one?
Learn to wing it and make it up as you go along. After 5 days in A if you feel like moving on fine, move on, if not stay longer. When you are ready to move on and not before, then decide where you would like to go next and go there. Repeat the process until either your available time or available funds runs out. Go home. Travel can be as simple or as complicated as you choose to make it. I prefer simple.
Things happen, you meet people who tell you about somewhere or some event etc. that you have never thought of. I always remember hearing someone being offered an opportunity to do something saying, 'Wow, I would love to do that BUT I have a reservation in X'. That person had blinders on thanks to a pre-planned itinerary and could not see the opportunity they were being offered.
A long term trip is not about how many places you get to in your available time, it is about what you get out of each day of your time in terms of quality not quantity.
Do your research, write your lists of places you would LIKE to see and then when you get on the plane to A, throw the list (figuratively) out the window.
Dec 4th, 2014, 11:24 AM
#35
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,875
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Congrats on a nice, long trip. If I were you, I'd stay in Airbnbs - an affordable, convenient way to rent apartments, get to know 'real' neighborhoods and interact with locals. Many (especially off season, when you're going) are priced even more reasonably than hostels. We just stayed in two upscale ones in Prague and Croatia, and a less expensive but super charming one in Madrid, all booked at the last minute. I discuss the ins and outs in my ongoing trip report:
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...uca-madrid.cfm
-
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...uca-madrid.cfm
-
Dec 4th, 2014, 01:36 PM
#36
>> but it does NOT mean you must leave for 90 days before returning.<<
Yes one does have to leave for a full 90 days <u>If one is in Schengen for 90 days</u>.
If one is in Schengen for say 80 days -- then heck, sure, come back any time. But only for 10 days and then you have the remainder of the 180 days to wait til you can re-enter.
Yes one does have to leave for a full 90 days <u>If one is in Schengen for 90 days</u>.
If one is in Schengen for say 80 days -- then heck, sure, come back any time. But only for 10 days and then you have the remainder of the 180 days to wait til you can re-enter.
Dec 4th, 2014, 01:54 PM
#37
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dec 4th, 2014, 06:16 PM
#38
Original Poster
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You guys are wonderful!! Thank you so much for all that good information that we need to digest and research. I am so overwelmed that I am out of questions for now, but if you have more ideas or suggestions we will greatly appreciate your input.
Dec 4th, 2014, 11:46 PM
#40
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,968
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
<<Here are some photos of Austria in December!>>
The fools that travel to Austria in winter. Should I cancel my trip to the German Christmas markets and to Sweden?
<<The logic was that some of these places (like Prague, Budapest and Vienna) would be just as interesting in the winter as in the spring, as architecture, culture are the main attractions. Vienna at Christmas seemed like a good place to be.>> I agree with you, they are just as interesting in winter.
Southern Cyprus is in the EU, the north isn't. The south has much more advanced infrastructure, the north is an occupied territory with little development in comparison. Hence the difference in costs. For long term stays, one would hope an apartment or villa would be rented, making it less expensive. Also, since the OP has a moderate budget, there are options of staying in agrotourism accomodation or village houses which would bring them closer to local people/culture etc.
Beaches in Europe are not warm enough for swimming in April.
The fools that travel to Austria in winter. Should I cancel my trip to the German Christmas markets and to Sweden?
<<The logic was that some of these places (like Prague, Budapest and Vienna) would be just as interesting in the winter as in the spring, as architecture, culture are the main attractions. Vienna at Christmas seemed like a good place to be.>> I agree with you, they are just as interesting in winter.
Southern Cyprus is in the EU, the north isn't. The south has much more advanced infrastructure, the north is an occupied territory with little development in comparison. Hence the difference in costs. For long term stays, one would hope an apartment or villa would be rented, making it less expensive. Also, since the OP has a moderate budget, there are options of staying in agrotourism accomodation or village houses which would bring them closer to local people/culture etc.
Beaches in Europe are not warm enough for swimming in April.
