mapet19

I am planning a trip to Europe for 2 months, our family's first time going together (husband studied there years ago). We are buying a car through the European delivery program. I have tentative itinerary, more of a Wishlist, but need help with the route, destinations and duration of stay. Please help. Is it too much? Having a hard time cutting out destinations.

Gothenburg, Sweden (1), pick up car

Copenhagen, Denmark (2)

Berlin, Germany (2)

Bacharach, Germany (2)

Rothenburg, Germany (2)

Munich, Germany (2)

Gimmelwald or Murren, Berner Oberland, Switzerland (2)

Reutte, Tirol & Bavaria (2)

Including Neuschwanstein, Weiskirche

Salzburg (2)

Prague, Czech Republic (2)

Vienna, Austria (2)

Venice, Italy (3)

Assisi, Italy (1)

Sorrento, Italy (2)

Rome, Italy (4)

Florence, Italy (3)

Montesorro or Vernazza, Cinque Terre (2)

Arles or Aix en Provence, France (3)

Barcelona, Spain (3)

Madrid, Spain (3)

Lourdes, France (2)

Tours or Amboise, Loire Valley, France (2)

Paris, France (4)

Amsterdam, Netherlands (3)

Hamburg, Germany (1)

Gothenburg, Sweden (2)

Drop off car

janisj

I won't pussy foot here - That is close to insanity.

Just look at this first bit: >>Copenhagen, Denmark (2)
Berlin, Germany (2)<<

Copenhagen to Berlin is a 7 hour drive w/o stops so in reality an entire day. Then you will have one exhausted day free in Berlin and are off to Bacharach the next morning - a 6 hour drive . . . and repeat over and over.

You will be in continual motion for 2 full months. Why?

(2 nights nets you 1 day in a place, 3 nights = 2 days)

janisj

>>Venice, Italy (3)

Assisi, Italy (1)

Sorrento, Italy (2)<<

You leave Venice, drive 5 hours to Assisi, have an afternoon free, then the next morning drive 5 more hours to Sorrento.

What you have is a 4 month trip squeezed into 2 months. Cut your destinations/distance in half or double the length.

mapet19

That's what I thought. I based this itinerary on a guidebook's 2 month sample itinerary, minus most of Eastern Europe. I'm thinking of cutting out Switzerland, most of Germany and Sorrento. Thanks for the input.

fourfortravel

We have lived in Vienna now for four years, and often take driving holidays; though, none as ambitious as yours. What looks great on paper doesn't always translate into reality, even with GPS assistance. Road construction delays (currently in Austria, Czech Republic and Germany) add time; unfamiliarity with different drivers and driving etiquette can steal your Fahrvergnügen; weather is always a factor, too; and even a simple roadside stop for a snack or meal (even at McDonalds) can all add up to a disappointing experience.

Perhaps consider a more geographically defined holiday, and select "bases" from which you can take day trips, or at least not be on the road every other day. Two months in Germany, Austria and CZ, for example, would be a delightful holiday of castles, palaces, mountains, dynamic cities and darling villages, and everything in between. Or Germany, Belgium, the Netherlands and Denmark. And so forth.

mapet19

I don't know what else to cut. My husband wants Spain, I want Italy & my daughter wants France, my son is just want a beach somewhere. We pick up car in Sweden. Going in mid May to mid July so hoping for good weather. How about this route? Is it doable?

Gothenburg, Sweden (1)

197.1 miles, 3 hrs, 8 min to
Copenhagen, Denmark (2)

360.42 miles, 6 hrs, 32 min to
Berlin, Germany (4)

222.36 miles, 3 hrs, 41 min to
Prague, Czech Republic (3)

182 miles, 3 hrs, 35 min to
Vienna, Austria (3)

358.32 miles, 6 hrs, 4 min to
Venice, Italy (5)

162.89 miles, 2 hrs, 29 min to
Florence, Italy (4)

106.30 miles, 1 hr, 51 min to
Assisi, Italy (1)

115.25 miles, 2 hrs, 14 min to
Rome, Italy (5)

280 miles, 4 hrs, 36 min to
Vernazza, Cinque Terre (3)

338.64 miles, 5 hrs, 31 min to
Arles or Aix en Provence, France (4)

258 miles, 3 hrs, 42 min to
Barcelona, Spain (3)

389.97 miles, 6 hrs, 3 min to
Madrid, Spain (4)

401.49 miles, 6 hrs, 19 min to
Lourdes, France (2)

385.06 miles, 5 hrs, 20 min to
Tours or Amboise, Loire Valley, France (3)

139.39 miles, 2 hrs, 4 min to
Paris, France (5)

313 miles, 4 hrs, 55 min to
Amsterdam, Netherlands (3)

290 miles, 4 hrs, 32 min to
Hamburg, Germany (1)

324.44 miles, 6 hrs, 1 min to
Copenhagen (2)

171 miles, 3 hrs, 1 min to
Gothenburg, Sweden (2)

Drop off car

rhon

Just as a matter of interest, why are you picking up and returning the car in Sweden? Have you looked at the lease schemes offered by Peugeot, Renault and Citroen in France? These sound the same as what you are doing. Essentially you are "buying " the car and then they buy it back at the end.
You say you mainly want Spain, France and Italy. Sweden is a long way away.
You have mentioned mainly large cities. A car can be an expensive nuisance in cities, and Italian cities have large fines if you drive in certain areas in cities. You still have huge days of driving every two or three days .Remember that wherever you are getting your times, they are approximate and do not allow for stops or delays. They assume you drive to the speed limit and will usually be on autoroutes which are not the most scenic.
Good luck

ribeirasacra

rHon One can pick up a Volvo you purchase direct from the factory.


To the OP. Travel less and see more. One night stands do not work. Europe is not one country, but many fascinating and diverse cultures.This was implied in your first post "I am planning a trip to Europe for 2 months, our family's first time going together (husband studied there years ago).
What time of year is this adventure planned for?

Sarastro

I am not sure where you are getting these drive times mapet19 but they are wildly unrealistic. For example, you give Tours to Paris a time of 2+04. That's a route I know well and have driven many times. I wouldn't allocate less than 3 hours for planning purposes, mappy.fr shows 2+35 under ideal conditions. I am suspicious you are using google for planning and google is known to be very unreliable for drive times in Europe.

It would not be wise to plan such a voyage using only best case drive time scenarios. Add in weather, road repair and construction, traffic congestion, fuel stops, driver fatigue, bathroom stops, and food breaks (even very short ones) and you could easily boost your estimate times by 50% or more.

It's a wonderful idea but I don't see anyway that you can complete such an ambitious itinerary in only 2 months.

Sassafrass

Your trip is not terrible, but could sure be improved a lot!
You are gravely underestimating travel time. Those times are minimum. You must add in getting to your hotel and parking. On longer drives, you will need a stop. If you have even a few hours of driving, you can't count that as a day sightseeing in a place. Then you are seriously overestimating how much time you have in a place.

As someone pointed out, one question is why pick the car up in Sweden? That alone would save tons of time that you could use to explore other places.

My question is more the purpose of the car for your planned itinerary. Most people get a car when they want to slow down and see the country, and stop to visit unique small towns. Example would be Provence where there are many small towns set in beautiful landscapes that are best reached by car. You have mostly cities, and you are speeding between on highways, not picturesque back roads.

Your trip gets much worse from Italy through France and Spain. Anything over 6 hours driving time is pretty much just a travel day. Look realistically at how much time you are driving versus how much time you are in a place seeing and doing. When that ratio leans heavily to travel time, think how much of your vacation money is actually being spent to sit in a car going down a boring highway.

Trains go city center to city center and are fast.
Example. It is only about 2 hours by a fast train between Barcelona and Madrid, while the drive is over 6 hours and quite boring unless you make a stop which would take the whole day.

Some city center hotels do not have parking. If you have to park away from your hotel, that takes time. You will want to know the parking places ahead of time, not be trying to find one once you are there.
Some cities have no drive zones for non-residents, so you must avoid those or be fined.

It is not clear if you are listing days in each place, or nights.

You could plan in one or two ways.
Write your itinerary listing nights in each place. Two nights nets you 1 whole day and a bit of another.
Write your itinerary and include every travel day, adding in time to get to hotel, park, etc.

It is not a good idea to arrive after an international flight and start driving.

Day 1, arrive Gothenburg, afternoon, relax, 1 night, no sightseeing
Day 2, pick up car, drive to Copenhagen, 1/2 day, 2 nights (1 & 1/2 days)
Day 4, drive to Berlin, most of day, 4 nights (3 days)
Day 8, drive to Prague, 1/2 day, 3 nights (2 & 1/2 days)
Etc.

Or, pretending to start in Cinque Terre
Day 1, travel to Aix, just time for short walk and dinner, no tour time
Day 2, Aix or tour
Day 3, Aix or tour
Day 4, Aix or tour
Day 5, drive to Barcelona, 1/3 day for touring
Day 6, Barcelona
Day 7, Barcelona
Day 8, drive to Madrid, time only for walk and dinner
Day 9, Madrid
Day 10, Madrid or day trip
Day 11, Madrid or day trip
Etc.

Cowboy1968

In addition to all of the above:

IF that is your final itinerary, you can take the ferry from Rome/ Civitavecchia to Barcelona so you don't have to back track through half of Italy.

If I wanted a road trip like that, I would probably assign x days to major stops like Vienna and Venice. But also y days for the road in between to actually see something of the scenery, visit a winery or castle, take a gondola up a mountain, drive a time-consuming scenic alpine road with many vistas etc.

StCirq

It's getting a bit better, but it's still crazy, as I think you will discover after about Day 3.

Pick up the car somewhere other than Sweden if possible. Cut out anything less than a 4-night stay anywhere, stay longer in cities with lots of attractions, add in some time for small towns, and account for the days you will do nothing but be on the road. As it is now, even with improvements, you're not going to get to enjoy much of anything other than the interior of your new car and views of macadam. You don't have to see the entire continent in 2 months.

jamikins

I think they have to pick the car in Sweden because they are buying the car and that's where the pick up point is.

If your husband wants Spain, you want Italy & your daughter wants France why don't you just stick to mainly those countries? Understanding there is no way to each of these in so short an amount of time. And that driving down from the north makes it logistically inconvenient and will require some compromise.

Spend a week getting to France and a week returning to Sweden, then pick a region for each week you have remaining. So with 2 months, assuming 8 weeks that gives you a further 6 bases in Spain, Italy and France - including a base on the beach for your son.

The issue is getting to and from Sweden. It would be more convenient to skip Spain and maybe even Italy and focus on Germany, France and maybe the Netherlands from a logistics standpoint.

hetismij2

I personally don't have a problem with a long road trip with hours on the road and visiting many places, with some short overnight stops. But that is me, and my husband, not with any kids in tow, and we tend not to visit major cities on such trips.

Have you considered using your two months to explore Scandinavia, or maybe the Baltic States/Poland/Northern Germany? You could experience the midnight sun for instance.

Save the other destinations for when you don't have a car - driving and parking it in many of the cities you mention will be difficult and expensive.
It seems also to be a lot of highway driving for a brand new car. I know they don't have to be "driven in" any more but it pays to be kind to the engine for a while.

Whathello

You better add at least 10% on the driving time.

Then add about half an hour per day to reach your hotel, it is always surprising to realize how much time one needs in the city to do the last kms.

Then add time for checki-in and check-out.
Some days you will not have much time to visit anything.

Also some hints on driving in Europe :
- we have a lot of speeding cameras all over the place. I just drove 150 kms to and from Berlin, I know the road and I got caught 3 times (three times).
- our roads are congested around the cities. It means heavy traffic or traffic jams, pay attention to rush hours
- in some countries we are agressive drivers (Belgium and France notably);
- stay on the right lane as much as you can and it is forbidden to take over from a right lane;
- Paris Amsterdam will take you more time for example : leaving Paris will take time, you may be slowed down

nytraveler

Sorry - but you still have just too many places and too little time in most of them. This would be the type of road trip kids right ut of college do when they just want to drive by day and party by night. In most places you would not have time to see more than 1 or 1 sights.

And a car is a hindrance in most major cities. Many have pedestrian only zones in the center and you can't tours the city with a car so it just sits in a garage at 30 or 40 euros a day while you take public transit to and fro the centers.

Everyone can want what they want, but the driving simply takes a certain amount of time (often way more than you have allocated) and by the end of this rip you will have spent a fortune and have little more than a very confusing blur to remember it by.

Don't think I dislike road trips. I don't - I love them - and we have done more than 20 in europe. But we stay 4 or 5 nights in cities and at least 2 nights in smaller towns and we never drive more than 4 or 4.5 hours per day so we can have a nice lunch and some sightseeing in another town in the middle of the day. And we take turns driving and navigating. For one person to do all the riving would be sheet hell.

Strongly suggest you cut way back on the number of stops - and do day trips from some of the larger cities rather than bouncing around like a pingpong ball for 2 months.

mapet19

We are buying a Volvo so we have to pick up in Sweden. We don't have to drop it off there. They have other drop off locations. I was planning on looking for Airbnb so we can have free parking and explore big cities by public transport. There will be (3) drivers, my husband, daughter and myself. Our kids will be older, 19 and 11. We are planning the trip mid March to Mid July. Some of the stops, like Hamburg, was just to sleep and rest to cut driving time. Thanks so much. I'll work on it some more. The looked at Google and Mapquest for distances and times. I'll try via Michelin.

fourfortravel

There is "no" guarantee of free parking in big cities. Here in Vienna the outer neighborhoods have instituted parking permits for residents in order to eliminate the commuters and travelers looking for free parking. Within the InnerStadt parking is fee-based or time-limited. The situation is similar in other cities.

Gardyloo

<i>We are buying a Volvo so we have to pick up in Sweden.</i>

No you don't. Volvo has 12 alternative delivery centers. You pay extra to pick up at one of these, but if it saves driving and hotel nights, the total cost might equalize. http://www.volvocars.com/us/shopping...g-and-delivery (scroll down.)

<i>We are planning the trip mid March to Mid July.</i>

So, for example, you could pick up the car in Lisbon for an extra $1080, and in March that would put you in a much better weather zone if you plan to visit the Iberian peninsula anyway. You could travel from west to east, south to north, following the weather as it improves. Maybe you <i>drop</i> the car at Goteborg (free) instead of paying extra to drop it somewhere else.

While Volvo gives you "free" plane tickets to Goteborg, you can work with your dealer to have the tickets stop in Copenhagen (if they use SAS) or they might let you fly "free" to one of the alternate delivery points. If you can't work out an airfare deal with Volvo (they'll only provide two tickets anyway and your group is bigger) then you can fly into GOT on the program tickets, then jump on another flight to your delivery point. For example, British Airways flies one way from Goteborg to Lisbon (via London) for US$130 each in March, not a deal killer.

I picked up a Saab (RIP) in Germany some years ago because I too was traveling in late March and didn't fancy playing in the snow in Sweden en route to my actual destination, Narbonne in SW France. I saved several days' driving and hotel nights by doing so, which washed the upcharge for picking up the car near Frankfurt airport.

hetismij2

Mid March to Mid July is a problem. That is more than the 90 days you are allowed under Schengen rules.
Upthread I thought you said May to July, so I hope March is a typo on your part.