Do French people dislike Americans?
Jun 11th, 2012 | 10:16 AM
#184
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 17,106
Likes: 0
kerouac: thanks for the elucidation.
Thank goodness the French have simplified their language!
Over here in California, I never know whether to ask for "los popcornos" or "las popcornas". Such are the overwhelming difficulties in life sometimes!
Thank goodness the French have simplified their language!
Over here in California, I never know whether to ask for "los popcornos" or "las popcornas". Such are the overwhelming difficulties in life sometimes!
Jun 11th, 2012 | 12:06 PM
#191
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Well, I suspect all your husbands "sources" have never been to France. I have never had anyone in this country volunteer directions to me as I peered at a map, followed me to return money I've dropped, or volunteered to translate a menu....all unasked...and this in Paris, multiple times, over two trips.
The people in Normandy remind me of the wonderfully polite world, long gone, of my childhood in a rural area. Most of the visitors at the American cemetery at Omaha Beach were respectful French...in short, I wish more Americans were as nice as the French I've been fortunate enough to meet.
The people in Normandy remind me of the wonderfully polite world, long gone, of my childhood in a rural area. Most of the visitors at the American cemetery at Omaha Beach were respectful French...in short, I wish more Americans were as nice as the French I've been fortunate enough to meet.
Jun 11th, 2012 | 12:54 PM
#192
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,884
Likes: 0
Aduchamp--I would agree that SOME Parisians are unforgiving about pronouncing the language. But actually, we have had very few bad encounters that way.
In my French group at home, one of the Parisiennes is totally charming, a lovely, wonderful person. The other Parisienne is an arrogant, superior type. Guess what? We have two Americans that are horribly arrogant, superior types and the rest are just great people.
Basically I found that business is business no matter where one is. What gets anything done in the shortest amount of time works. Until I got to a certain level of communication, I do remember I wasn't allowed to finish a sentence in French with any cafe waiter before I was interrupted in English. It was a waste of their time.
As soon as my French was rather bearable (probably around my third or fourth trip), waiters were just fine with my imperfect French and I don't remember having any sort of problem since. Efficiency, efficiency.
My husband NEVER tries to speak any other language because his skills just don't lie there at all. Instead, he can order either a) beer or b) expresso in the right size in ANY country quite well with fingers and nods--and he always understands the change due him. No one ever seems upset with him.
An open outlook can do so much, too. A charming American couple staying in Amboise when we were only knew ONE single French phrase other than "please" and "thank-you" which they tailored to themselves in self-deprecating humor: "Nous parlons francais comme une vache anglaise" (the phrase is usually "une vache espagnole" I believe).
Bartenders and waiters adored them.
But here is where I say blanket statements really go wrong:
The positive: My sweet youngest daughter stayed in a rather snooty area for her four-month semester abroad. The market there was overrun by students, and market vendors tended to be rather brusque with them.
After her first week, though, those same vendors more or less "adopted" my daughter, going out of their way to make gentle and small corrections to her French. They would explain to other customers how well she was doing, and those customers eventually would join in, nodding approval or giving correction as needed.
The negative: Lest you think her charm or her language skill was the magic wand, she had a much less successful relationship, no matter how she tried, with the 7-11 type store on the corner. They just were not nice to her. However, at the end of her third month, she personally stopped a shoplifter in the store. After that, she could do no wrong.
Back to the negative: her Parisienne landlord (size 0) never quite got it, no matter how many times they spoke, that a) my daughter spoke excellent French and b) we all--including my linguistically challenged husband, could understand " 'tude" when we heard it. We have often said that had some Americans only met the landlord in Paris, they would have walked away with a total belief in the old stereotype.
Yet the older gentleman in charge of the new windows and window treatments for the apartment was simply adorable and absolutely gracious to her, speaking only in French to her during his three or four appointments--and he went out of his way to arrive early the day she left to help her down the stairs with her luggage.
People are people.
In my French group at home, one of the Parisiennes is totally charming, a lovely, wonderful person. The other Parisienne is an arrogant, superior type. Guess what? We have two Americans that are horribly arrogant, superior types and the rest are just great people.
Basically I found that business is business no matter where one is. What gets anything done in the shortest amount of time works. Until I got to a certain level of communication, I do remember I wasn't allowed to finish a sentence in French with any cafe waiter before I was interrupted in English. It was a waste of their time.
As soon as my French was rather bearable (probably around my third or fourth trip), waiters were just fine with my imperfect French and I don't remember having any sort of problem since. Efficiency, efficiency.
My husband NEVER tries to speak any other language because his skills just don't lie there at all. Instead, he can order either a) beer or b) expresso in the right size in ANY country quite well with fingers and nods--and he always understands the change due him. No one ever seems upset with him.
An open outlook can do so much, too. A charming American couple staying in Amboise when we were only knew ONE single French phrase other than "please" and "thank-you" which they tailored to themselves in self-deprecating humor: "Nous parlons francais comme une vache anglaise" (the phrase is usually "une vache espagnole" I believe).
Bartenders and waiters adored them.
But here is where I say blanket statements really go wrong:
The positive: My sweet youngest daughter stayed in a rather snooty area for her four-month semester abroad. The market there was overrun by students, and market vendors tended to be rather brusque with them.
After her first week, though, those same vendors more or less "adopted" my daughter, going out of their way to make gentle and small corrections to her French. They would explain to other customers how well she was doing, and those customers eventually would join in, nodding approval or giving correction as needed.
The negative: Lest you think her charm or her language skill was the magic wand, she had a much less successful relationship, no matter how she tried, with the 7-11 type store on the corner. They just were not nice to her. However, at the end of her third month, she personally stopped a shoplifter in the store. After that, she could do no wrong.
Back to the negative: her Parisienne landlord (size 0) never quite got it, no matter how many times they spoke, that a) my daughter spoke excellent French and b) we all--including my linguistically challenged husband, could understand " 'tude" when we heard it. We have often said that had some Americans only met the landlord in Paris, they would have walked away with a total belief in the old stereotype.
Yet the older gentleman in charge of the new windows and window treatments for the apartment was simply adorable and absolutely gracious to her, speaking only in French to her during his three or four appointments--and he went out of his way to arrive early the day she left to help her down the stairs with her luggage.
People are people.
Jun 11th, 2012 | 01:09 PM
#193
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 26,710
Likes: 0
French is about my ninth language and I only speak two. My French accent is admittedly awful. But Mrs. Adu tries to learn a few words of the language of the country we are visiting and she is always greeted gaciously except in France. Her father was an immigrant and both my grandmothers were immgrants and some of current friends and relatives speak with accents. Mrs Adu tutors as a volunteer ESL. And the first thing you do, is never insult, laugh at, or intimidate someone who is trying to learn a language. There are two exceptions. Mrs. Adu was tutoring a Brazialian woman, who became a good friend, who told my wife that she wanted to buy "a two-bedroom condom." While, that is indeed impressive, it is hard to get the proper realtor.
The other is a current student, a shy young Japanese woman who is kind beyond words and works as a nanny. She told her that she taught a youngster "to crap." She meant clap.
The other is a current student, a shy young Japanese woman who is kind beyond words and works as a nanny. She told her that she taught a youngster "to crap." She meant clap.
Jun 11th, 2012 | 01:29 PM
#194
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 43,742
Likes: 4
Reminds me of my goofs. My late husband spoke French, Spanish and Russian. Me? a mess. We were staying in Arles at the famous hotel where all the bull fighters stayed, the NORD PINUS.
I referred to it as the NORTH PINIS, which my husband liked telling. At a bistro in Paradouu, our usual waiter wasn't his usual smiling self. I meant to say smile, Sourire
instead I said souris which means mouse. With that he broke out laughing telling everyone I called him a mouse.
I referred to it as the NORTH PINIS, which my husband liked telling. At a bistro in Paradouu, our usual waiter wasn't his usual smiling self. I meant to say smile, Sourire
instead I said souris which means mouse. With that he broke out laughing telling everyone I called him a mouse.
Jun 12th, 2012 | 05:33 AM
#197
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,884
Likes: 0
justineparis--She was very much a tiny, svelte,dressed-to-the-tee, sophisticated Parisienne--and by her actions and words, we were made to understand that we were obviously overly tall, blobby American lifeforms she had to suffer. Favorite quote: in showing us "the dressing" (the closet), she said to my daughter (who is not overweight and is about 5' 6"), "It has room for normal clothes; even though your clothes will be much larger, I think you will be fine."
You obviously have not understood my point: I don't believe there is just one "type" of person in any city or country. Generalizations can be rampant and ultimately a disservice to all. For example, we were told Italian taxi drivers would rip us off--explain, then, the taxi driver in Florence who parked his car and chased after us into the airport to explain that we had overpaid him? I had a store clerk in "heartless" NY walk me down four blocks so I would get to the right place.
As I indicated, I have a very sophisticated Parisienne in my French group, equally well dressed (also size 0) who never would think of treating the rest of us as though we are cultural mutants.
The other Parisienne in the group, also size 0, consistently tells us that we Americans have no self control when it comes to food. Usually she states it just as we're reaching for our French cheese selection.
But we manage to regroup to reach for the cheese again, happily confirming her bad opinion of us. That makes her happy, too, so why not?
My point is that there are good, bad, rude, happy, sad people everywhere and blanket generalizations serve no one.
"are only fat people nice and thin ones mean"
????? How did you get that?
Personally, I think I was a MUCH nicer person when I was skinny. Shopping for a swimsuit didn't put me in a funk for three straight months
You obviously have not understood my point: I don't believe there is just one "type" of person in any city or country. Generalizations can be rampant and ultimately a disservice to all. For example, we were told Italian taxi drivers would rip us off--explain, then, the taxi driver in Florence who parked his car and chased after us into the airport to explain that we had overpaid him? I had a store clerk in "heartless" NY walk me down four blocks so I would get to the right place.
As I indicated, I have a very sophisticated Parisienne in my French group, equally well dressed (also size 0) who never would think of treating the rest of us as though we are cultural mutants.
The other Parisienne in the group, also size 0, consistently tells us that we Americans have no self control when it comes to food. Usually she states it just as we're reaching for our French cheese selection.
But we manage to regroup to reach for the cheese again, happily confirming her bad opinion of us. That makes her happy, too, so why not?
My point is that there are good, bad, rude, happy, sad people everywhere and blanket generalizations serve no one.
"are only fat people nice and thin ones mean"
????? How did you get that?
Personally, I think I was a MUCH nicer person when I was skinny. Shopping for a swimsuit didn't put me in a funk for three straight months
Jun 12th, 2012 | 08:02 AM
#198
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,505
Likes: 0
"The other Parisienne in the group, also size 0, consistently tells us that we Americans have no self control when it comes to food. Usually she states it just as we're reaching for our French cheese selection.But we manage to regroup to reach for the cheese again"
Not a very nice thing to say but according to my book of Table Manners you are not supposed to help you twice to the platter of cheese. In formal dinners, the hostess never passes it around a second time either.
Not a very nice thing to say but according to my book of Table Manners
you are not supposed to help you twice to the platter of cheese. In formal dinners, the hostess never passes it around a second time either.
Jun 12th, 2012 | 10:05 AM
#199
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,646
Likes: 11
Oops, now I am embarassed. Those of you who had dinner with me in Paris in March at Le Comptoir must have thought I was shameless. That cheese platter is now the screen saver on my phone. I will know better next time. Take only photographs, leave only footprints.
