Coffee in Paris...I'm confused
Jun 8th, 2004, 04:47 AM
#61
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The lon-absent "elvira" once posted here some great info on ordering coffee in Paris, and I've included it in my own Paris file for years. Here is the gist of it, with a few comments added by me:
<Coffee is another subject. Unless the restaurant is used to catering to Americans, it?s hard to get American-style coffee. When the French have coffee after dinner (and it is served after dessert) it is an ?express?, very concentrated coffee served in a smallish cup. ?Cafe creme? is, despite its
name, an express coffee with hot milk, but that is considered a breakfast item by the French as is cappuccino. This doesn?t mean that you absolutely can?t get milky coffee after dinner, it?s just not French and it?s not guaranteed.
(Elaine's note: cappuccino is "café cap". All of the above are an espresso base in a larger cup with varying amounts of milk. In the afternoon, if you ask for just ?un café?, nine times out of ten they won't ask any more questions and just bring you an espresso, a shot of very strong black coffee in a small cup. Sometimes they ask you if you want "un cafe noir" (a black coffee). If you say yes, you'll get an espresso. In the afternoon or evening, if you hopefully inquire if they have cafe americain, this is what you may get: a regular-size coffee cup with a shot of espresso at the bottom, plus a small pitcher filled with hot water, to dilute the inky stuff, I guess. Then there was a separate little pitcher of milk. In France, coffee is served after dessert, not with dessert, so as not to ?ruin? the taste of the dessert --end Elaine)?
If you must have an American-style coffee: Try one of the McDonalds. ?Decaf? in French is decafeine (day caf-ay-nay) or just ?deca? (dayka). If you count on artificial sweetener, bring your own. Tea in Paris is a hit or miss proposition-- forget decaf tea altogether. Some fancier places will offer ?tisanes?, herbal or fruit infusions of various flavors.
<Coffee is another subject. Unless the restaurant is used to catering to Americans, it?s hard to get American-style coffee. When the French have coffee after dinner (and it is served after dessert) it is an ?express?, very concentrated coffee served in a smallish cup. ?Cafe creme? is, despite its
name, an express coffee with hot milk, but that is considered a breakfast item by the French as is cappuccino. This doesn?t mean that you absolutely can?t get milky coffee after dinner, it?s just not French and it?s not guaranteed.
(Elaine's note: cappuccino is "café cap". All of the above are an espresso base in a larger cup with varying amounts of milk. In the afternoon, if you ask for just ?un café?, nine times out of ten they won't ask any more questions and just bring you an espresso, a shot of very strong black coffee in a small cup. Sometimes they ask you if you want "un cafe noir" (a black coffee). If you say yes, you'll get an espresso. In the afternoon or evening, if you hopefully inquire if they have cafe americain, this is what you may get: a regular-size coffee cup with a shot of espresso at the bottom, plus a small pitcher filled with hot water, to dilute the inky stuff, I guess. Then there was a separate little pitcher of milk. In France, coffee is served after dessert, not with dessert, so as not to ?ruin? the taste of the dessert --end Elaine)?
If you must have an American-style coffee: Try one of the McDonalds. ?Decaf? in French is decafeine (day caf-ay-nay) or just ?deca? (dayka). If you count on artificial sweetener, bring your own. Tea in Paris is a hit or miss proposition-- forget decaf tea altogether. Some fancier places will offer ?tisanes?, herbal or fruit infusions of various flavors.
Jun 8th, 2004, 05:59 AM
#62
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Amen, Shanna. Steve's post was patronizing--there are plenty of American baristas out there who don't need an Aussie to show them how to do their jobs. Even though the Pacific NW is the home of Starbucks, the NW also has hundreds of small independent coffee bars that make smashing coffee--the L & L market in Eugene, OR, for example. Or Torrefazione on NW 23rd in Portland. Try telling them how to make "proper" coffee and they'll be showing you the door!
I've had great coffee in Europe, but in Paris, also some bad coffee...
Elaine, I have to admit I've never heard anyone ordering a "cafe cap" in Paris--it's always been my experience that if someone wants a cappuccino, that's what they order. Where did you hear people ordering cafe cap?
One side note: on a business trip to Milan two weeks ago, I had a discussion with my Italian colleagues about coffee. They told me that Nescafe has become quite popular with young people--apparently Nescafe put on a very successful ad/marketing campaign about "fun" coffee drinks that has pulled a lot of young Italians away from traditional espresso, etc.
I've had great coffee in Europe, but in Paris, also some bad coffee...
Elaine, I have to admit I've never heard anyone ordering a "cafe cap" in Paris--it's always been my experience that if someone wants a cappuccino, that's what they order. Where did you hear people ordering cafe cap?
One side note: on a business trip to Milan two weeks ago, I had a discussion with my Italian colleagues about coffee. They told me that Nescafe has become quite popular with young people--apparently Nescafe put on a very successful ad/marketing campaign about "fun" coffee drinks that has pulled a lot of young Italians away from traditional espresso, etc.
Jun 8th, 2004, 07:30 AM
#63
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Lyb, sorry you don't get the joke. I have been a regualar here for a long time. My diatribes are meant as humour for people like Mimi, Scarlett, Sheila, Ira, St. Cirq, Foodsnob, etc., who are in on the joke.
You are correct, however. I am not educated. I am just a dumb slob like the rest of you.
You are correct, however. I am not educated. I am just a dumb slob like the rest of you.
Jun 8th, 2004, 08:34 AM
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What I think is funny about Steve's post is that he is quoting from a movie instead of it's original source, the book:
"reminds me of the behavour of the Morlocks in that great movie 'The Time Machine'"
Unless, of course, the Morlocks are markedly different from H.G. Wells classic, in that case I defer to Steve's opinion!
(this is intended as a gentle jibe)
"reminds me of the behavour of the Morlocks in that great movie 'The Time Machine'"
Unless, of course, the Morlocks are markedly different from H.G. Wells classic, in that case I defer to Steve's opinion!
(this is intended as a gentle jibe)
Jun 8th, 2004, 11:39 AM
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I'm so happy. I go to France and Germany regularly and adore their coffee (it is generally pants in the UK), and I sort of assumed that they do it best. Off to California in November, and now consider oneself a judge and jury of coffee quality. BTW, of course they flavour coffee in France, its just that they do it properly (ie. with spirits or liqueurs) not with icky icky syrups
I'm sure the angels make them!
