My husband and I really enjoyed a 17 day trip this summer to Portugal (including 3 days in Madrid) Advice from this forum helped tremendously!

We would really like to return to Europe next summer (got the travel bug back!) but need to stick to a very strict budget for our trip in order to make it happen - wanting around 10-14 days. We would really like to explore Italy and would like some advice on cost saving advantages of renting a camper/van vs. seeking out inexpensive accomodations. We don't want to travel extensively (would like to include Florence) since we enjoy staying in one place and taking in the local culture, local foods and people.

We were so appreciative of all the advice we received before our trip to Portugal and are looking to our seasoned travellers once again.

If yo0u do not intend to travel extensively, I think that a camper van would turn out to be expensive on a per day basis. It might be better to visit cities--Rome, Florence, Venice--using train travel (second class and Regionale are inexpensive where available) and looking for either apartments or some other less expensive accommodation.

You might want to start here to get a sense of what is available and at what price:

http://en.turismovenezia.it/

Having never rented a campervan anywhere at all, I'm not sure of costs but we have travelled on a budget in Italy and I would suggest travelling by train like the locals and book ahead for cheap but decent pensiones (like B&Bs, sometimes without breakfast). The reasonably priced but still decent accommodation gets booked first so I would do a lot of research on the web and try and get that sorted out well ahead of time.

A campervan in any of the cities in Italy could be a bit of a nightmare, nowhere to park and difficult to navigate. You would have the cost of hiring the van, fuel, tolls and parking to pay for. Also you couldn't leave it safely during the day while you go off sightseeing without the worry of it being broken into.

If you do lots of research on the train system in Italy, like timetables, tickets, Italian words for platform, one way, two adults etc, then you should find train travel a lot more relaxing than driving a campervan, with one of you watching the traffic and the other one with a nose in a map. On the train you can sit back, watch the scenery and eat the lunch you bought on the way to the station.

If you want to stay in only one or two places you could try and find a cheap apartment. You would still be able to shop in the local markets and put together meals in the kitchen apartment to save money.

Perhaps as a start you could put together a rough trip plan and figure out train fares, then compare that to the cost of hiring a van, bearing in mind the added costs I mentioned.

Kay

Go a lot cheap train like a local from 2 eu/hr

seat61.com/italy always cheaper than van rental kermabum.com

Eurocheapo.com cheap hotels city guides food tips

Hostelbookers.com cheaper if super budget.

BBplanet.it nice apts unless a group poor value many scammers

online craigslist vrbo use only agents like sleepinitaly.com

Was there in May found cheap hotels even 4 stars everywhere

Sheraton Roma $69 hotwire.com

Sorrento www.hoteldelfino.com booked on otel.com

Venice for me last www.hotelpausania.it $99 #211

cute little canal view sute in a great area www.otel.com

Happy Planning!

Also my wife and I got FREE air except for tax by getting

2 AAdvantage Citicards 40000 miles each booked out flights

closed the cards we paid only tax like $50 each way otherwise

FREE might look into that to save a lot.

For van camper info it is karmabum.com camping.it

But usually more and u have to camp outside big cites

or incur massive oosts. Train shoots city center to city

center the way to go unless stict rural travel for me.

If you want to tour and see some countryside then a camper is an option, but you do need to price it all carefully. It may be cheaper to hire a car and stay at small hotels. If your main aim is to visit the cities then forget the camper and travel by train.

There are several campsites in Florence.
If you leave the camper at a designated campsite it is perfectly safe. Even in a normal car park it will be relatively safe. Europeans travel in campers all the time, and Italians seem to particularly enjoy them.
They are not normally anything like as big as American campers are.

Do a lot of research - the internet is a great help in this, for finding camp-sites, and prices of campers, camp-sites hotels etc. before deciding what best fits your holiday plans, and your budget.

Unlike quovadis, we have had excellent experiences renting apartments from VRBO.com (VRBO = vacation rental by owner). I would not look on Craig's list, just because of its reputation. Sleepinitaly.com is a good place to look for apartments. If you are staying in the cities, definitely forget the camper. Even in small towns you can get inexpensive rooms or apartments. For example, in a tiny town near Orvieto we paid about $120 for room, breakfast and dinner for two at a small, clean, hotel. You can also look on slowtrav.com (Slow Travel) for apartment suggestions and reviews.

I have camped in nearly every big city in Europe - there are camps in suburbs with excellent transportation into the city center.

Thus despite what others above say I can attest that camping to see the huge cities is very viable and will save you a ton of money over even budget accommodations in those cities - especially in high season.

I just love the TCF Camp in Paris, in Joinville-le-Pont, with superb RER train links to all over Paris.

London's Crystal Palace is right in London with train links

Rome is ringed by camps

Amsterdam has a nice one right on the metro line.

One in Florence is right in the city, others in suburbs

The major expense of vans are of course the rental fee and petrol - overnight camping fees - and these camps are well equipped as camping cars as Europeans call them are extrememly popular way for Europeans themselves to travel.

Europeans do not call then camping cars. They are campers or campervans in English and variations of that in most other languages.
Most run on diesel.
Do not be put off by the nay sayers. Have look at prices and work out what suits your budget best.

Go a lot cheap train like a local from 2 eu/hr>

Oh lordy lordy here comes that trains from 2 euros an hour crapola - over and over even though asked to show one inter-city train that cheap never responds. Total misinformation as usual.

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In France at least, which last I knew was in Europe, they do call them camping cars! So Hetismij you are flat out wrong in what you say - Google Camping cars and France and you will get zillions of camping car references. One should have their facts right when so emphatic!

Thank you to everyone who responded. I know that we are just beginning our research into the most economical way of getting a vacation two years in a row! The fun of planning has just begun! !
I appreciate the various points of view and advice!

Using a camper is likely to be very expensive (renting one, paying for all that gas at $10 per gallon, paying for a place to put it - and then trekking in and out of whatever city every day.

You would probably get a much better deal renting a small apartment in Florence - which also gives you the option to do cooking on your own if you want.

I do hope you come back, olddognan, after you run the numbers, and let all of us who are too lazy to do our own research in on what you find. I for one would love to know how the two styles of travelling compare in cost.

Actually, a couple of years ago my wife and I looked into this exact thing...renting a small RV and just tooling around. At first it made perfect sense from both an appealing way of travel (we had an RV here in the States) and seemed on the surface to be pretty cost effective. Then I found the catch, insurance.

The insurance question was not just the cost of the coverage, but the deductibles, and I do mean that in a plural sense. Essentially, everything inside and out would be gone over with a fine tooth comb, so saith the various rental agencies. If you put a scratch on the outside from a tree limb and failed to absolutely document it on pickup, big bill. Table or chair gets broken/stained/torn, big bill. The potential liability was astonishing. The real "scam" was that let's say you got a scratch on the top right and had a very small dent (maybe already there but missed it on your end) on the bottom left. These could be claimed as two separate "accidents" and the $3,000 deductible would apply to each one individually. Needless to say, we dropped the idea.

So, before you sign the papers, be absolutely certain you understand ALL of the fine print and by the way, NO credit card will provide coverage on an RV.

dave

>>>In France at least, which last I knew was in Europe, they do call them camping cars! So Hetismij you are flat out wrong in what you say<<<

FYI - Hetismij2 lives in Europe and I would think someone living there would know what they call things.

Anyway, renting something to camp in for France is not the same as for Italy since the insurance requirements are much different (especially for non-Europeans).

There are lots of campgrounds in Italy, but most aren't in cities. The ones for Rome aren't really that convenient for sightseeing so you would spend a lot of time on public transport. You aren't allowed to drive in many cities and hill towns in Italy unless you are a resident. Do a search for ZTL.

Many campgrounds in Italy have cabins or bungalows (and sometimes tents) quite cheap if you just want to rent a car instead of a camper, but I don't think it would really save much money.
http://www.camping.it/english/

Now, continuing on the RV in Europe idea, there was an American retired couple that wrote a very interesting book titled something like "Take your RV to Europe". In their book they go through everything that did to allow them to bring their own small RV to Europe and it actually worked out very well, as they have just left it there and return every year to use it. Surprisingly, the shipping costs were not that high.

But do remember that if you go this route, then the camper must meet the safety and emission standards of the importing country as well as any additional requirements that may exist in other countries. Also, it only works out financially if you intend to actually leave it there and use it for multiple years.

dave

There are lots of campgrounds in Italy, but most aren't in cities>

I have stayed in campgrounds in virtually every major Italian tourist town and in some cases like Florence two are smack right in the city - one by the Piazza Michelangelo - and the one I stayed in in Rome was a short bus ride from the Piazza Poppola - not a remote commute.

The advantage of renting a camping car is that you can change your itinerary en route as there will always be a camping IME that has room where you want to go and in small towns the camps are often right in the town. In Venice some camps are within a short walk of the Mestre train station with constant trains to Venice proper. and I think there are camps on the Lido.

If driving and wanting to visit cities like Rome, Florence, etc I would argue that only by camping is this feasible - leave your camping car in the camping - no payments for parking and join the locals in a short commute to town - vehicles in those cities are useless.

>>In France at least, which last I knew was in Europe, they do call them camping cars! So Hetismij you are flat out wrong in what you say<<<

FYI - Hetismij2 lives in Europe and I would think someone living there would know what they call things.>

Well in this case they don't. 100% sure that in France they call RVs camping cars - or any car you can camp in - the word 'car' in French means long-distance bus not a vehicle - the word for that is voiture.

My French son confirmed that camping car is the term in France. And anyone who has driven in France will have seen the ubiquitous "No Camping Cars" signs posted everywhere.

kynourbon - in France it is camping car - even folks who live in Europe apparently do not know this!

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Le site de référence des aires de services et de stationnement camping-car en France.
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