bullfight
Mar 14th, 2006, 01:12 PM
#21
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But I explained that I thought the bullfight was not a bloodlust event, but a test of man's courage. In that respect, it is the same as all sports.
The bulls themselves live better pre-death lives than cattle bull. The bulls are free-range and taken very good care of. Their good health is crucial.
From what I've read, the killed bulls are promptly butchered and sold and eaten. So they are used for food and their skins for leather. Obviously the dogs from dog fighting are not eaten and there probably isn't enough meat left after a chicken fight. Plus those are animal vs. animal, fighting one species against itself.
I wasn't sure if I'd like the bullfight. I was prepared to come away from it thinking it was cruel. But I didn't. I saw the event and judged it for myself. Maybe you all should experience one before you tell others how it is.
The bulls themselves live better pre-death lives than cattle bull. The bulls are free-range and taken very good care of. Their good health is crucial.
From what I've read, the killed bulls are promptly butchered and sold and eaten. So they are used for food and their skins for leather. Obviously the dogs from dog fighting are not eaten and there probably isn't enough meat left after a chicken fight. Plus those are animal vs. animal, fighting one species against itself.
I wasn't sure if I'd like the bullfight. I was prepared to come away from it thinking it was cruel. But I didn't. I saw the event and judged it for myself. Maybe you all should experience one before you tell others how it is.
Mar 14th, 2006, 01:36 PM
#22
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Ok kelliebellie. I will just say that I respect everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I have never witnessed a bullfight firsthand, I have only seen video footage. It was a sad sight for me to see the spears being thrown at the bull and I just can't respect that as I can't accept the sacrifice. Regrettably though, there are many worse injustices in this world...
Mar 14th, 2006, 02:19 PM
#25
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hipvirgochick -
I think seeing video tape would make the event seem harsher. Like I said, I was very surprised by the nuances of the event. There was one bull that was amazing. You could tell the people in the ring were genuinly afraid for their lives. The matador ended up killing the bull too quickly for the crowd's taste. They wanted to see more interaction between this amazing animal and the matador. They booed him. They were all more on the bull's side.
After reading a bit about slaughterhouse conditions, I agree with you on better restrictions and inspections. I just think a lot of people have their heads in the sand when it comes to how the meal on their plate really got there.
I'm glad we could debate this issue without anyone ending up with hard feelings. No, as one poster said, we are not going to change each other's minds. But I think there is great merit to exchanging different view points.
I think seeing video tape would make the event seem harsher. Like I said, I was very surprised by the nuances of the event. There was one bull that was amazing. You could tell the people in the ring were genuinly afraid for their lives. The matador ended up killing the bull too quickly for the crowd's taste. They wanted to see more interaction between this amazing animal and the matador. They booed him. They were all more on the bull's side.
After reading a bit about slaughterhouse conditions, I agree with you on better restrictions and inspections. I just think a lot of people have their heads in the sand when it comes to how the meal on their plate really got there.
I'm glad we could debate this issue without anyone ending up with hard feelings. No, as one poster said, we are not going to change each other's minds. But I think there is great merit to exchanging different view points.
Mar 14th, 2006, 02:27 PM
#26
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I know that people feel strongly on the subject of animal rights, but this is a travel page, not a pulpit. Folks write to this forum for information and a bit of companionship in travel experience, not to be preached at!
Preaching is not the right tone for this forum. Screaming at fellow Fodorites that they and other cultures are "WRONG" is even less so. Condemnation of a religious practice would not be tolerated here, nor should railery against people's choice of foodstuffs, animal husbandry, or sport.
Go get a soapbox, this is getting ugly!
Preaching is not the right tone for this forum. Screaming at fellow Fodorites that they and other cultures are "WRONG" is even less so. Condemnation of a religious practice would not be tolerated here, nor should railery against people's choice of foodstuffs, animal husbandry, or sport.
Go get a soapbox, this is getting ugly!
Mar 14th, 2006, 03:18 PM
#28
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Come on now Nukesafe. I don't think anyone's been screaming here. The OP posted a question and basically got answers, or rather opinions, on the subject. That's how it goes on Fodors. Please don't get heavy handed about what we all can talk about here. This is afterall an interactive forum and you're setting unrealistic restrictions suggesting people should not comment on things going on in the world, whatever they may be. Posts about being current and future teachers aren't particularly travel related either, but people like to learn about others here. No hard feelings.
Mar 14th, 2006, 05:36 PM
#29
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Hipvirgochick,
You misunderstand. I welcome differing opinions on the subjets Fodorites discuss. That's what makes it fun. You like Rome, because. I like Dijon, because. An apartment is better than a hotel, IMO, etc. All of these are legitimate approaches to sharing ideas and experiences. However, I'm not absolutely wrong, and you are not absolutely right.
What I object to here is the TONE. The tone in many of these posts are, You are WRONG! You are a MONSTER if you eat meat. Slaughtering of animals is HORRIBLE, BARBARIC. "Anyone who watches is a sociopath".
It is the absolutist statements that pushed my button. We can disagree, but still respect alternative values. I have two sons who are Vegan/Animal-rights absolutists. They are committed activists who have been in the boats that throw themselves in front of the Japaneese whaling ships. It took years of maturing (on both sides) before we could reach an understanding that allowed us to rationally agree that each had valid points; but that the values each of us share are defensible, and not fair game for either condemnation or ridicule.
I just hope that this thread can lay off the vitriol.
My hope is that
You misunderstand. I welcome differing opinions on the subjets Fodorites discuss. That's what makes it fun. You like Rome, because. I like Dijon, because. An apartment is better than a hotel, IMO, etc. All of these are legitimate approaches to sharing ideas and experiences. However, I'm not absolutely wrong, and you are not absolutely right.
What I object to here is the TONE. The tone in many of these posts are, You are WRONG! You are a MONSTER if you eat meat. Slaughtering of animals is HORRIBLE, BARBARIC. "Anyone who watches is a sociopath".
It is the absolutist statements that pushed my button. We can disagree, but still respect alternative values. I have two sons who are Vegan/Animal-rights absolutists. They are committed activists who have been in the boats that throw themselves in front of the Japaneese whaling ships. It took years of maturing (on both sides) before we could reach an understanding that allowed us to rationally agree that each had valid points; but that the values each of us share are defensible, and not fair game for either condemnation or ridicule.
I just hope that this thread can lay off the vitriol.
My hope is that
Mar 14th, 2006, 06:04 PM
#30
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Answer for the OP : in April , Seville and in June Madrid. In every other month chances are better in Madrid, though, but it's not sure..there are not bullfights so often.
I'm Spanish, I don't like bullfighting at all but I also haven't enjoyed the kind of expressions people has used in this thread...it makes me wonder about cave people...
I'm Spanish, I don't like bullfighting at all but I also haven't enjoyed the kind of expressions people has used in this thread...it makes me wonder about cave people...
Mar 14th, 2006, 06:11 PM
#31
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Hey, if God didn't intend us to eat animals, why'd He make them out of meat?
And I doubt that cave people had the time or probably the inclination to risk their lives engaging in bull fights on any sort of regular basis.
And I doubt that cave people had the time or probably the inclination to risk their lives engaging in bull fights on any sort of regular basis.
Mar 14th, 2006, 06:42 PM
#32
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Pam- it really depends on the matador, however both rings tend to host the big ones.
I suggest sitting "al sol" (cheaper, as you are in the sun, and that is where the "real fans" sit). Just take sunblock. And careful, as the beer intake can be fierce and in the sun you can get pretty drunk.
I like to sit as near to the ring as possible (like in a sports match, who wants to sit nose bleed?), but as long as you have a seat, you are in for the day.
Read up about the art before going, though.
I suggest sitting "al sol" (cheaper, as you are in the sun, and that is where the "real fans" sit). Just take sunblock. And careful, as the beer intake can be fierce and in the sun you can get pretty drunk.
I like to sit as near to the ring as possible (like in a sports match, who wants to sit nose bleed?), but as long as you have a seat, you are in for the day.
Read up about the art before going, though.
Mar 14th, 2006, 08:42 PM
#35
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nukesafe -- Thanks for reiterating. I do appreciate your thoughts. I think this post represents peoples' heartfelt emotions and sometimes it's hard for some of us to respond in a way that everyone's ok with. Even though this spectacle is sickening to me personally, I'll stay off the thread now and let the OP get the answers she's looking for.
