Go Back  Fodor's Travel Talk Forums > Destinations > Europe
Reload this Page >

Brutal Crack Down on Peaceful Environmental Protest

Brutal Crack Down on Peaceful Environmental Protest

Old Jul 14th, 2013, 12:26 PM
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 650
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Happy Anniversary. Eser should get Turkey's highest military honor.
BigAleinstein is offline  
Old Jul 14th, 2013, 11:46 PM
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,326
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
Thanks, both.

Al, Eser is already inundated by medals given by family members (hers and mine) for keeping me in line, and stopping me from being a nuisance to society at large.
otherchelebi is offline  
Old Jul 15th, 2013, 05:54 AM
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,820
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Yes.. they are absolutely right!!!Is better for your well being if you keep a low profile..

Take care..
kismetchimera is offline  
Old Jul 16th, 2013, 12:07 PM
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 23,187
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Happy anniversary -- and be safe!
kja is offline  
Old Jul 17th, 2013, 12:07 AM
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,326
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
thanks kja,

There are not many demonstrations these days, but there are large and well organized democracy forums in some large parks within opposition controlled municipalities.

The witch hunt has grown wildly. They identify people from police videos of demonstrations and then raid their homes, taking all electronic storage, books, note pads, text books of students, etc and try to sue them for inciting the public to rebel against the government.

On the other hand, none of the police who injure over 800 protesters with unnecessary gas and water and direct shots, causing brain damage in 26, killing five, and causing loss of an eye of 11 young protesters through aimed shots at their heads, have been identified, and the one policeman identified as shooting and killing a protester with his regular gun is free because the prosecutor stated that it was when the gun moved accidentally.

A government supporter, wielding a machete attacking and injuring two was released from custody to take off to Morocco to visit his relatives because his decision of stay was somehow delayed in being record on the computer.

In another case, a young man was beaten to death by seven men four of whom were uniformed policemen according to witnesses, but the street and hotel security videos on the location somehow have 18 minutes missing from their recording.

On the other hand, 20 policemen have committed suicide in recent months. Most are complaining of very long hours, low pay, being treated like slaves, not receiving sufficient training, being forced to move all over the country at a moment's notice, and kept angry and unsatisfied so that they can act savagely like fighting dogs when confronted with "the enemy" even if the enemy are their own people.
otherchelebi is offline  
Old Jul 17th, 2013, 12:28 AM
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It is a good idea for U.S. travellers to get informed about contacts with embassies and consulates in the countries they are planning to visit. Especially the ones that are not very politically stable.
This can provide a small help since it does not require internet connection for data access:
acajic is offline  
Old Jul 18th, 2013, 08:53 AM
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,326
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
I came across this video of speech in Romania by the Turkish Ministre of Culture and Tourism.

Please do not think that this is the type of English you will have to decipher when you come to Turkey.

This is an example of Islamist leadership English language expertise in Turkey, usually read or spoken with a great deal of self importance.

No wonder no one understands the Turkish politicians in EU and Obama continues to misunderstand them.

What is worse, they have no way of checking up on their simultaneous translators during press conferences, speeches and one-to-one meetings.

Just another reminder, there is no revolution or coup or the possibility of one in Turkey. There are demands for early elections and definitely for democracy and human rights, but the consensus among the protesters is that the current level of protest and people's forums should cotinue till the local elections in seven months. The opposition parties are expected to reach some agreements on coming up with common candidates in certain key municipalities and also organize well and be on the lookout against any tampering during the voting and counting.

We expect that the Islamic AKP will lose both Istanbul and Ankara municipalities in addition to quite a few of the smaller cities.
otherchelebi is offline  
Old Aug 4th, 2013, 12:46 PM
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 12,820
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
"Together Against fascism" were the slogan of hundreds of demonstrators walking near the famous square.At least 10 people were wounded including 3 journalists.

kismetchimera is offline  
Old Aug 4th, 2013, 01:37 PM
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 650
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I saw video of water canons on Istiklal Street just a few days ago.
BigAleinstein is offline  
Old Aug 4th, 2013, 02:54 PM
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,326
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
The water cannons, pepper gas and plastic pellets with paint are a weekly occurance on Istiklal, every Saturday and some Sundays. Any kind of crowd from gay liberation to shoeshine boys will be doused and shops and restaurants will be forced to close so that protesters can be blamed.

The first big even of the period is tomorrow.
The Ergenekon court case will announce verdict for 260 odd government opponents, murderers, generals, members of parliament, journalists, intellectuals, all dumped together in an imaginary organization where the people have no connection, not even a cell structure.

The evidence is mostly wire taps where words and names have appeared, books written about the Gulen movement, criticism of the government, and secret informers.

Millions had planned to go to the countryside where the prison-coury complex is, 50 miles from Istanbul.

But, the Istanbul Occupational Forces Governor informed the public that only connected lawyers, accredited journalists and members of parliament will be allowed in the court room, that relatives and friends of the accused, even family will not be allowed and that anyone trying to get close to the complex will be considered to be breaking the law (did not tell what law!!!) and will be dealt with accordingly.

Then, yesterday and today, the police raided the homes of the leaders of the major NGOs one TV station and one newspaper which had called for the meeting at the prison/court and arrested 40 or more of them.

The fact that only the courts can decide and inform the public on who may and may not attend, that that decision must be made at an open hearing and that no governor can restrict the movement of people on public roads and highways are unimportant in Turkey these days.

Some Turkey experts at the recent Senate Hearing told the Foreign Relations Committe that they advise the United States government to not comment but sit and watch how things turn out, because the Turkish prime minister seems to be the most US friendly choice they have.

This is incredibly stupid. The guy can sneak behind the back of United States at any moment for any real or imaginary reason while the United States puts all its eggs in his basket making sure that other alternatives know that the United States considers them dispensable even if they are definitely more democratic than the present government.

Expect long prison terms including many "life" sentences tomorrow, with no real evidence of wrong doing and some major demonstartion and increased violence and arrests following that.
otherchelebi is offline  
Old Aug 4th, 2013, 03:06 PM
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 650
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thank you for the update.

As far as Ergogan and the US concerned, one never knows what is truly going on behind closed doors. And as you will recall Obama brokered a tentative truce between Turkey and Israel on his last visit to Israel. And in the US, the security of Israel is of primary concern in the MIddle East. Turkey, of course, is also a long standing NATO member and it is not common to criticize publicly the internal affairs of another member. Unfortunately, you also know that morality and foreign policy of just about every country can be mutually exlcusive.

One can only hope that behind the scenes they are trying to curtail Erdoğan.

For you and yours stay safe, well, and hopeful.
BigAleinstein is offline  
Old Aug 4th, 2013, 03:10 PM
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 15,095
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 1 Post
I'm so sorry this is happening to your country, OC.
It must be heartbreaking, infuriating, frustrating & frightening. All the best to you & yours.
Bokhara2 is offline  
Old Aug 5th, 2013, 09:22 AM
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 10,367
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes on 1 Post
And here you are: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/06/wo...plot.html?_r=0

Erdogen must go!
Fra_Diavolo is online now  
Old Aug 5th, 2013, 11:25 AM
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 18,172
Received 22 Likes on 4 Posts
OC, so sorry to read the NYT today. Be safe.
HappyTrvlr is offline  
Old Aug 5th, 2013, 01:25 PM
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,326
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
Living in a police state is not much fun.

A mafia boss received 10 years and a journalist who wrote about the sect leader FG who owns all those schools in the United States and all over the world received life+

The former Chief of the Armed Forces received life for being a member of a terrorist organization?????? even though he served under Erdogan????

There is no evidence of this terrorist organization called Ergenekon. No meetings, no organization, no cells, no safe houses, no plans, no instructions. Just unsigned letters and criminals or terrorists turned informer or unverified illegal wire taps or computer CDs supposedly found upon search of the premises.

I am just hoping that we can make the next elections free of any cheating. There are now two separate NGOs with that aim. Hopefully they can get together over a million observers at the ballot boxes.

In the meantime the witch hunt goes on.

This school and soccer season we will see special police for universities and stadiums and soccer fans will be filed and identified so that they can be detained if they chant against Erdogan.

Just three newspapers and two TV stations left which are not afraid of Erdogan's threats, arrests and fines.
otherchelebi is offline  
Old Aug 5th, 2013, 06:37 PM
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
OC and E our love and prayers and support are with you. We have continued to share your insights and news with people in our realm and hold you close. As the hard days continue to unfold, we will stay with you in love and solidarity. Let us know what would be best, ok? James and the Jazz Ambassadors
desertjames is offline  
Related Topics
Original Poster
Last Post
United States
Feb 27th, 2014 12:10 PM
United States
Jan 5th, 2011 10:48 AM
Nov 17th, 2008 02:54 AM
Africa & the Middle East
Oct 26th, 2008 09:21 PM
Oct 30th, 2004 06:39 AM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Your Privacy Choices -