Ever go into a European supermarket or outdoor market and marvel at how perfect those fruits and veg looked?

And perhaps attributed it to Europeans more demanding culinary demands.

But really it perhaps that the perfect carrots, potatoes and tomatoes were more because of an EU law that dictated that no disfigured fruits and veg be sold - even if they were otherwise healthy enough to eat

Well according to the NYTimes today the EU has voted to void the ban with most, but not all, fruits and veg and will allow less than perfect ones to be labeled so and sold as such.

throwing out good food was a prime reason. Yet some 16 EU countries voted against relaxing the ban, which will be done starting in July.

I'll take those 'seconds' at half the costs anyday.

Yeah - once a veg is sliced, diced, chopped, or grated, who cares what it looked like in the store?

HI! BILLY MAYS HERE...

California has the same rules for oranges (and maybe other fruit). I actually find the fruit in our SF Alemany farmer's market superior to fruit in France, with the exception of strawberries in the Dordogne and Charentais melons almost anywhere.

Come to think of it i'm not sure those Avocados i bought 5 for 1 euro recently at Paris' Marche Allegre could possible have met any standards.

wonder if the sub-par forbidden fruit finds a way to these type renegade markets?

PalenQ - Are you SURE the less-than-perfect fruits and veggies get thrown away?

I know (at least from a TV show) that in the US, the blemished fruits, eg, apples, will be used for making other apple products, such as apple juice, apple sauce, or those bagged sliced apples you get at McD and Subway.

No - but i'll have to re-read the article which said they cannot be sold i believe.

Maybe making fruit juice, sauces, etc. do not have the standard, i suspect but retail selling.

hopefully they do not get discarded but with the EU you never know

The EU isn't that insane, it just regulates what can be sold in a market as-is or whole in the fruit/vegetable, not what can be sold to the trade or used as ingredients. Maybe it's going too far, but doesn't seem that different to me as regulating what grades of beef are, etc.

My brother used to own an apple farm in the US, and it's the same way, he sold the inferior products for juice and applesauce.

From the NYTimes article (11-12-08)

"The rising cost of commodities also persuaded the E Commission that there was no point in throwing away food just because it looked strange."

"ending regulations on 28 types of fruit and veg

for 10 other types of fruit and veg, including apples, citrus, peaches, pears, strawberries and tomatoes, shape standards will remain. But items that do not meet the European norms will still be allowed onto the market provided they are marked as being substandard or intended for cooking or processing." (which leads me to think before they could not be sold at all, but not sure)

as does this quote from European commissioner for Agriculture:

"it makes no sense to throw perfectly good products away just because they are the 'wrong' shape."

thinking more about it

i would suspect that the grower would dispose of non-compliance produce before reaching the public market

but once at a supermarket however non-comforming fruit or veg could not be sold... and would unlikely be sold to processors then either i suspect (maybe go home with workers)

so they was some dictated waste - if i take the words above of the EC right.

Hi PQ,

The standards for perfection are not confined to the EU.

The US, and some States, also has standards.

That's one reason why, eg, tomatoes in the US are so poor in flavor.

Remember the big debate about the Florida Ugly tomatoes?

I don't think the US has a monopoly on bad tomatoes, though! Plenty of tasteless imports on European shelves, and plenty of great tomatoes for sale in the US--just know where to shop and do not buy out of season!

Unless fruit and veg met one of three grades it could not be sold retail. It could still be sold to food processors/go for animal feed.

I like quirky carrots, conjoined tomatoes and the like. Brings a bit of levity into life.

I can't see Tescos and the like starting to stock bent cucumbers or whatever though as they take up more room on the shelf and it seems that people expect their food to be as perfect as the models in their magazines nowadays.

My local organic shop always seems to have misshaped veg on sale, but maybe the rules for organic produce wasn't as strict? Who knows. Flanner no doubt

Some years ago I remember shopping for fruit at a local market in Austria and getting yelled at for picking the nicest ones!

flanner i think has been know to sell less than legally perfect fruit and veg - just like he was party to being a scofflaw by opening stores on Sunday when it was still against the law (he admits) - i bet he had a back bin of less than perfect fruits and veg on deep discount - an under the table thing.

Does anyone have any direct, specific knowledge on this topic?
Regarding tomatoes, for example (any other fruit/vegetable is equally requested): I'm curious what the rules were, how they read, etc. What did a rule or rules actually dictate? How would a rule dictating taste read, for example?

I have marvelled at the better taste I perceive in Franco/German produce, but am puzzled how that is achieved.

Recently I bought some hail-damaged premium species apples for 60% less than perfect apples, which had visual blemishes but whose taste and texture was unmatched.

I should have said Flanner had his underlings - store managers do the dirty - Flanner seems to have been (or is?) some corporate guru in food retailing and not a store manager (though with his education that may have been all that was expected of him) - maybe flannerpooch can tell all?

Tomatoes are one of the fruits (or is it a veg?) that still have controls so i'm sure some ECommission site would have all the nitty-gritty.

Taste i would not think enters into this - more of appearance.

On that TV show I watched on Apples (in the US), there's a computer/machine that automatically separates the perfect apples from the blemished ones. I think the machine has multiple cameras and as the apples come down the conveyor belt, it IDs the blemished ones and picks them out.

The perfect ones are then sorted out by size, IIRC.

I assume there is a certain program that one loads onto the computer/machine and tells it what is considered perfect vs blemished. And I assume the program is designed by some Govt agency?

(That's a lot of my personal assumptions in the last paragraph.)

hi pal,

these rules have long been used by supermarkets to gain a hold over producers - I remember hearing a fruit grower who'd fallen foul of some buyer who wanted all the conference pears to have a certain proportion of mottling, for example.

so getting rid will be great.

but they've also bee used by the anti-EC lobby who have often been known to make up regulations eg - no straight banenas.

personally I grow and dig my own whenever I can.

regards, ann

Hi ann:

Unfortunately the pear lobby i guess was strong enough that pears are one of 10 or so fruits exempt from the new loosening - why? who knows?

I grow and 'dig' many of my own veggies too in my allotment like they have on Coronation Street. Still cooking yummy kale that can grow when it's cold out.

Cheers - too bad about your Spurs. Condolences.