Lofty

I'm searching for a decent downtown hotel, and am having some difficulty managing this from London UK! I'm thinking about the Grand.. should I think again ??<BR><BR><BR>cheers

Geoff

Very nice hotel, not so nice area (although somewhat centrally located). <BR>If you're willing to take cabs to and from the Hotel, you shouldn't have a problem. Wouldn't recommend a nighttime stroll...<BR>Hope this helps.<BR>

Lofty

I thought that might be the case! I read in a guide to avoid Moss Park, is it very dangerous, or just unsavoury?<BR><BR>many thanks!

Geoff

Unsavoury during the day, maybe a little dangerous at night. Moss Park is surrounded my men's shelters, so it attracts some not-so-nice people. I feel uncomfortable passing through the park -- and I've lived in Toronto my entire life. <BR><BR>BUT...The Grand is really a nice hotel, and if you're planning to spend most of your days away from the hotel (i.e. at other Toronto attractions), you should have a great trip. Try http://www.grandhoteltoronto.com/. Apprently the rooftop jacuzzi is fantastic.<BR>

R&J

I often read here about "not a nice area" or "not nice people" when referencing a downtown location. Travellers need to remember that they are visiting a city, not a farm, inhabited by many people. Toronto has been voted by the UN as the most multicultural city in the world, and of the largest 50 cities in North America, is the 3rd safest (the 1st and 2nd are Edmonton AB and London ON). <BR><BR>There are homeless in our city. They are also harmless. I have heard of tragedy striking a homeless person, but we live right downtown and I've never ever heard of a homeless person being charged with any act of violence or agression. <BR><BR>Toronto's homeless are much like other Canadians. Incredibly polite and non obtrusive. They will try to sell you a newspaper, open a door for you, or just sit there with a paper cup but even if you ignore them, they are more inclined to say "God Bless" than anything else. <BR><BR>The downtown core is a wonderful, exciting, vibrant place, and more improtantly (and quite different from many American cities) it is ALIVE and SAFE. The city's slogan is The World Within a City, and that is what you will find.<BR><BR>The Grand Hotel and Suites is a new hotel (2 yrs old), very beautiful rooms, good rates, and fantastically located. It is adjacent to Moss Park, which is not a haven of criminals but in fact is the Armory. There are four or five shelters (Sally Ann, etc) on the street, but there are also some of the most expensive new loft condo conversions in the city. <BR><BR>Stay downtown. You will love it!<BR><BR>Rog & Jim<BR>Toronto DOWNTOWN Bed and Breakfast<BR>(That's known as "full disclosure" of our obvious bias!)<BR><BR>

Geoff

Lofty,<BR><BR>"Stay downtown" is great advice, just not in that area.<BR><BR>I agree -- the homeless are for the most part "harmless". However, the area attracts drug dealers and "women of the night", which inevitably attract the unsavoury (and sometimes dangerous) element of society. <BR><BR>As a member of a baseball league that plays at Moss Park, we're repeatedly interrupted by armed violence and police takedowns, and we have a "don't leave without an escort" rule after the games (ending around 8:30pm).<BR><BR>While this area isn't Compton, it sure isn't Dineyland.<BR><BR>As I mentioned earlier, the Grand is nice; just take cabs!<BR><BR>Cheers.<BR>

Geoff

Lofty,<BR><BR>"Stay downtown" is great advice, just not in that area.<BR><BR>I agree -- the homeless are for the most part "harmless". However, the area attracts drug dealers and "women of the night", which inevitably attract the unsavoury (and sometimes dangerous) element of society. <BR><BR>As a member of a baseball league that plays at Moss Park, we're repeatedly interrupted by armed violence and police takedowns, and we have a "don't leave without an escort" rule after the games (ending around 8:30pm).<BR><BR>While this area isn't Compton, it sure isn't Disneyland.<BR><BR>As I mentioned earlier, the Grand is nice; just take cabs!<BR><BR>Cheers.<BR>

R&J

Beg to differ. We lived, with our three young children, at 192 Jarvis Street for three years (1996-1999), the condo building exactly across the street from The Grand. We were there when it was renovated from the abandoned RCMP headquarters, into The Grand. We also continued to own the condo apt after we moved out, for two more years, renting it to Ryerson professors. (We now still live downtown, in the Bloor/Yorkvill area.) The J of R&J also worked at Sears HQ just half a block north, for 20 years, from 1971 to 1991. <BR><BR>So, having established our credentials, and showing we have no axe to grind nor any reason to promote an area that is not ours (and a hotel, for crying out loud, when we operate a Bed and Breakfast!) we still rise to the defence of that area of town.<BR><BR>The hookers Geoff mentions are north of there, basically moved over to Wellesley and Homewood area by the big Beaver sign (no pun intended). <BR><BR>When, oh when, Geoff, was there last a mugging or murder or whatever of a tourist or innocent bystander in that area? Never, I am quite sure! <BR><BR>There are an intersting collection of homeless that you come to recognize, "Dapper Dan" we call one, always impecably dressed in the most garish attire, smoking aromatic pipe tobacco; the "Fly Swatter" we call another, an old lady in black pacing up and down the street batting immaginary gremlims from in front of her face ... hardly anything to be afraid of. <BR><BR>Do not be afraid of that area. Walk and enjoy the city and the sights. If seeing the homeless bothers you, stay at home. If seeing something different bothers you, stay at home. As the sign in the now-defunct Ed's Warehouse restaurant use to read, "If you want home cooking ... eat at home."<BR><BR>And if you ARE propositioned by a hooker who has lost her way ... be flattered!

Mike

I think the area around the Grand is fine, but if you are not used to big cities or have had little interaction with the "grittiness" that comes with urban living, I would argure the neighhborhood may not be the best bet.<BR><BR>I love visiting Toronto, but I am struck by the large number of homeless and street people. It is due, in part, to the excellent social services provided by the city of Toronto and the province of Ontario but visiting from a city like Washington, D.C., which also has a lot of homeless/street people, I was surprised by how prevelant it was throughout most of Toronto.<BR><BR>OTOH, Toronto is a city where I never feel threatened or unsafe, even when I've been lost or out really really late.

Bonnie

Don't know if you've already been on your trip but thought I'd would still post, in case you hadn't. I was curious to see the Grand so I went to dinner one night in their dining-room. It was lovely. But all the rhetoric in the other posts couldn't convince me to put my guests there. I love to walk when I go to a new place. And I'd sooner see you set out from a hotel in Yorkville/Bloor such as the Marriott or if you were looking for a suite-type arrangement the look at the Bay/Bloor Executive Suites south of Bloor. You'd also be near the subway. Hope this helps.