Nornny

Hi everyone, I have finally decided that my next destination will be Australia this year. The only thing I have firmed at this point is that I will be going in the first and second week of October. The first week, I will be by myself, and the second week, I will meet up with my friend who already lives and works in Sydney to explore other parts of the country.

A quick bit about myself and my friend. We're both young 20-somethings not too far off from graduating college. I'm personally looking for more of an outdoorsy, nature/scenery/wildlife-focused adventure for this trip. However, I am far from outdoorsy and prefer hotels to hostels. The cost of this trip and the fact that I will be traveling alone (my first time) for part of the leg may force some hostel and roughing it.

With very basic research, I'm interested in starting in Darwin and doing 2-3 days in Kakadu. Then going to Alice Springs and seeing Red Center/Ayers Rock (2-3 days). I would then go to Adelaide and meet my friend, and we would spend a few days (2-3) in Kangaroo Island. We want to finish our leg in Tasmania (2-4 days).


1. I am looking into the Travelwild tours (travelwild.com.au) for my solo leg in Kakadu and Uluru/Ayers Rock, does anyone have any experience with it? I like the small groups and the age demographic as well as the itinerary (looking at 3 day), but I'm nervous about the camping aspects of it. I'm very much a city/suburban slicker, not an experienced backpacker/camper.

2. How realistic is this itinerary to get accomplished in 2 weeks? With my vacation days, I could probably go up to 2.5 weeks, but probably not any more. I have not considered transportation, but assume I wil fly to each destination to save time. Are my guesses to days enough to see the major highlights at each destination? Will I regret not seeing any of the bigger cities? I wanted something a little bit more offbeat than the traditional Australia itinerary.

3. Any other advice? This itinerary is totally open to discussion and revision. I'd love to hear suggestions as to what to see in my major destinations.

huonapple

Hi Nornny
I hope you realise how big Tasmania is let alone the big Island of Australia. You are not allowing yourself much time to enjoy the many experiences that Australia has to offer. You will probally spend a majority of the time in transit.
Maybe you should be doing a working Holiday? huonapple

Bushranger

By all means extend yourself to 2.5 weeks for with only 2-3 days at your first three locations you're already got that first week well and truly used and when you put airport and flight times into it as well there goes another day or even two at each location.

I've never been to Kangaroo Island but it is expensive to get to.

You also need to work out your flioght connections to Darwin as well and just on going in October, it is only getting to be about one of the two worst months of the year up that way and Kakadu could be very dry and thus detract enpormously from the experience - for a NY softie it could work out to be a miserable experience.

I reckon you might be happier to head up to FNQ, be warm there but more reasonable and there'll be some rain forest if limited water coming off falls but you also have the Great Barrier Reef, Whitsunday Islands - http://www.whitsundays.com.au/ , Fraser Island you'd probably like and there's a LEI/Fraser package that could suit you to a tee - http://www.ladyelliot.com.au/ look under bookings.

So I'd suggest with having that extra time you get an open jaw ticket that allows you to fly into Brisbane to get to LEI and then fly Brisbane to Alice Springs and use the likes of www.waywardbus.com.au and then fly to Melbourne to meet your friend there or in Tassie, www.tigerairways.com.au have cheap flights between Alice Springs and Melbourne and also from Melbourne into Tasmania.

Didn't answer your question on travelwild but there are a heap of different tour companies operating out of Darwin for Kakadu and you kind of get what you pay for - minimum cost for minimum comfort and a bit more for a bit more and if you go camping you have to expect to be roughing it a little, being a bit smelly maybe and doing quite a bit of hiking to find a cool rockpool to have a swim in.

But really, you'd possibly need a minimum of five days for Darwin/Kakadu - fly in one day, three days for a tour and fly out day five or you could cut one day off by take an evening flight and landing sometime after midnight and kipping on a pool side deck longe like I did last year if you thought you were up to that and then jump into the tour vehicle about 6.30 am.

My experience and your admissions make Cairns/GBR or LEI/Fraser Is. and then Alice Springs a much better option for you, believe me.

Neil_Oz

I think you could skip Kangaroo Island - there'll be plenty of other opportunities to see native wildlife, and it isn't all that impressive if you don't ante up for an expensive B&B and guided night tours etc.

BTW, may I say what a pleasure it is to see a well-written post complete with good spelling and grammar (i.e. not written in textspeak) from someone your age. Keep it up!

Bushranger

And sorry Nornny, for having you down as a NY softie - that was another poster Marsha planning a trip too.

You do not need to be nervous of any backpacking/camping trips wherever you go and on those types of trips it'll be quite likely you can meet up with a good mix of people, but I just repeat that October will be a testing time weatherwise for Kakadu and as I've indicated you'd need to allow at least five days to do it justice and not be seeing it at its best, far from it in fact.

And for Tasmania, if your friend in Sydney does not get around to doing any planning, have a look at www.underdownunder.com.au is one touring company that could give you some ideas for there and you could also hire a vehicle - www.drivenow.com.au to give you an idea on costs.
Fuel is about A$1.20/L here at moment, was up to over $1.50/L before the GEC and anyone's guess what it might be by October.
A small car should do about 100km./7L and so you can work out comparative transport costs.
There are lots of moderately priced B&Bs and motels about Tassie and you'll also find that hostels have twin share rooms and are good venues for meeting other travellers too.
www.bugaustralia.com is a reasonable guide to hostels.

http://www.parks.tas.gov.au/index.aspx?base=1315 is a good aid re Tasmanian outdoors and do try and make time for northern Tasmania/Cradle Mountain region - http://www.cradlemountainlodge.com.au/ being a major lodge but there is also smaller cheaper accommodations about and there is Freycinet NP/Wineglass Bay and Tasman Penibsula/Port Arthur you ought to include.

Hobart is a great compact city and http://www.ballandchain.com.au/ is a restaurant that has been there quite a few decades in its historic port side Salamanca Place - http://www.salamanca.com.au/ so if you can schedule being there for Friday evening and Saturday markets, what you miss out on in bigger cities, you'll make up some there.

If you depart Sydney, a couple of days there will not go astray by any means.

Neil_Oz

"And sorry Nornny, for having you down as a NY softie"

I can't think of anything more wounding (and inaccurate) to say about a New Yorker!

Bushranger

Oh Snozza,
what is it with your claims of mediocrity, recommendations on paint sniffing in Bunnings and is it something close to stalking!

I think Nornny will have no problems with the comment, given her self description and " but I'm nervous about the camping aspects of it. I'm very much a city/suburban slicker, not an experienced backpacker/camper."

And why the hell btw would you think someone of their young twenties would not have a good grasp of english?

I recall an old adage that if you have nothing useful to say, why say anything at all!

Sorry about the distraction Nornny.

afterall

Hi Nornny,

So you're thinking of skipping the GBR!! That's unusual but why not, and maybe you have your reasons. It's nice to see an alternative plan and finding Travelwild is not bad for early research.

I thought it was their 3 day/2 night trip to KI that I did c.5 years ago, but it may have been campwild.com.au. Anyway, very similar in what's covered and style. I have looked at their Kakadu offerings and they sound very like the trip I did even longer ago. They visit the main sites, except Mary River is substituted for the expensive and everyone-does-it Yellow Waters Cruise. I would recommend the three day Kakadu and Lichfield combo just because Lichfield is a treasure in its own right. The camping was fun and an experience not to be missed when the nights are black as black and the stars are all different from the Northern Hemisphere. I confess (and I'm much older than you) that I'd done a lot of bush camping elsewhere but find as long as it's WARM it's wonderful. Don't ask me to sleep in a tent if it's raining!! BTW I've visited the Top End in November and Sept and reckon October should be fine.

Timing. If you can get that extra 3-4 days please do! But still I don't think you have time to visit Kakadu, Uluru, KI and Tassie. And have you not allowed any time for Sydney?

Can I tentatively suggest, like Neil I think, that KI is not up there with the other options on your list. Yes, I have been, but only after I had lived here for a while and had visited many, many other places. If you want to see Uluru then I would skip KI. Add the days to Tassie, and remember every time you move it costs you a day, eg. tours generally leave at 0600 - if you get lucky and your inbound flight arrives at, say, 2000 and not much later then it's doable otherwise you have to wait for the following day. Ditto leaving for the next destination after a tour ends. There are cheap air carriers for you to check out, but flight timings are not always the most convenient.

All the best with your planning. Come back and ask as many questions as you like.

Cheers.

Nornny

Thank you for the help everyone so far. I have some more clarification if this helps in leading to more fruitful advice (the advice so far has been amazing!! Keep them coming if you have them!)

Kangaroo Island was actually my friend's suggestion. She has been living in Sydney and been around Australia already. She's wanted to go there for a while. Tasmania is also new to her. I wanted to make sure that when she joins me, she's not leading me around. I want it to be as much of a new experience for her as it was to me. I will see if we can cut out KI for more time in Tasmania however. I would love to get up to the northen end of Tasmania

I have no issues, and would probably prefer doing the latter leg independently with my friend than pay money for a tour (unless a tour group is more recommended). I'm not sure if I'm adventurous enough to do the first half by myself, though, which is why I'm trying to find a good tour in Kakadu and Red Center.

No real interest in Great Barrier Reef just because I'm not a great swimmer. I LOVE aquatic life, but unfortunately, it has to be limited to aquariums. The outback appealed to me more for its landscape and sense of adventure.

As for Sydney, I'm sure I'll be flying into/out of there. My friend is there so I can spend a night. For some reason, I'm just not as interested in the major cities as I am the offbeat and adventurous sites.

Bushranger

There's an old saying Nornny "you can only lead a horse to water"

I suggest you do your own research on what weather to expect around October in north of the NT and how comfortable some camping out will be - a time when more than a few territorians start to think on heading south - a few sites to get you started: http://www.goseeaustralia.com.au/art..._tropic_topic/ http://www.bom.gov.au/lam/climate/le.../ausclimnt.htm http://www.abc.net.au/dimensions/dim...ts/s533413.htm http://www.cultureandrecreation.gov....icles/weather/

Wherever you go outback in October, have some light loose clothing, a broadbrimmed hat, plenty of protective suncream and insect repellant will not go astray either - Bushmans being a good brand.

Pula

One of the hardest lessons to learn about Australia is that it takes TIME to see, like nowhere else. You will want to spend more time everywhere you go, and traveling at a slightly slower pace suits Australia far more than constantly being "on deadline." Just doing Kakadu and the Red Center in one week is frankly a tall order. I agree totally with those who recommend giving Kangaroo Island a miss - I enjoyed it but really only because I was staying in Adelaide for a week and had the time to do an overnight, but I don't consider it a destination on its own. Tasmania on the other hand -- you could spend two weeks right there! The thing about Tas is it's the least "Australian" of the places you're considering. It reminds me of New Zealand more than Oz. So, FWIW, I'd recommend that you and your friend be as flexible as possible for that second week, and spend more time in one place if you're having fun -- and you will be!

Saltuarius

I would consider Kangaroo Island a destination in its own right. Without checking my diary, I think we spent 5 days there and could have spent more. But then again I am a wildlife junky. That said I would give it a miss this trip due to lack of time.

Bokhara2

Hi Nornny,
If you could fly into Darwin and out of Sydney or Melbourne, it would ease the time & cost constraints. And do add any extra days you can because these long leg flights do take their toll, and internal flights can take a good half-day between the time you leave one hotel & arrive at the next.

If you have some time between your arrival in Darwin & the tour departure, take the hop-on/hop-off bus to see the key sights and sites. The drivers are enthusiastic & informative and you can get quite a good overview in a relatively short time; going back to visit those places that particularly interest you. You can either book the bus to collect you at your hotel, or take it from down town (ask your hotel, they will know). The Mindil Markets aren't to be missed for some really interesting browsing and foods. Buy something to eat on the beach as you watch the sun drop into the ocean. www.mindil.com.au

I've done a Kakadu/Litchfield tour similar to the one you're contemplating, also in early October and loved it. It is hot & humid (think NYC on a hot August afternoon & add a bit but the vehicles are air conditioned and it usually cools down a bit at night. The tour I went on had on-site tents with camp beds, so we didn't need to do any pitching of tents etc., and the tents were zippered & had netting inlets to allow good air flow but exclude mosquitoes. You will need a hat, sunscreen and insect repellent as others have said (I use Bushmens or Rid tropical strength.)Take a small torch/flashlight.

There are buses that go from Darwin to Uluru & Alice Springs and perhaps this option might also appeal to you. I'll have a look for some links to small group operators later & post what I find for you. Do go to the Cultural Centre at Uluru. There's a wealth of information about the area and you may want to go on a walk around Ayers Rock led by one of the Aboriginal guides.

I think Alice Springs is well worth the effort to get there. It has a fantastic desert park where you can see all manner of native animals, reptiles and birds. And a magnificent a birds-of-prey show in the natural ampitheatre formed by the cliffs. I think it's one of our most interesting places and very close to what one might describe as a frontier town. It's the home of the Royal Flying Doctor, School of the Air, early Telegraph; lots of Aboriginal art & culture. Uluru and Alice Springs can get quite chilly at night (Desert climate).

I'm assuming your friend lives in Adelaide. There's a Tiger Air flight for $98 Alice Springs-Adelaide on the internet today.

I think your plan is achievable, particularly if you can add an extra few days. I'd be tempted to leave King Island out and spread the extra days across Tasmania & the rest of your itinerary.

marshacarlin

Well, I guess I'm Marsha, the other New York softee that was referred to, BUT I'm going to let this dig ride this time since I did come off as not being interested in much hiking, etc. HOWEVER, you can't live in NYC and be a softee....no how! It's just a matter of where you chose to take your blows...on your back side or upside your head.........actually just kidding......we find NYCers to be helpful, kindly, yes in a hurry but willing to take a minute when asked..........just thought I'd let you know.

Neil_Oz

Marsha, you can ignore Bushranger's comment, which I suspect is based on very little acquaintance with New Yorkers in the flesh. Personally I found New Yorkers to be as helpful and welcoming, in their own unique style, as other Americans.

Bushranger

Yes Marsha, you're the NYorker and it was not a dig at NYorkers or any other city living folk, but more Nornny's reference to being far from an outdoorsy type and nervous about backpacking/camping and then my mixing that with your revelation of coming from New York.

I had explained that already but then along comes the Snoz

I quite understand your comments and do appreciate that there is the hard/tough side if you like of surviving in any city or anywhere for that matter and not just NY and then at same time different places can be stereotyped whilst the population at large can be as you say, and as I hope you will find Australians.

The Snoz has seen to drivel on further, seeming to want to make an impact on my connection or lack of it with NYers. He obviously is so very ignorant if his ignorance of post explanations is anything to go by and is quite adept at that, becoming close to a stalker of mine, enough said!.

Neil_Oz

Damn, Bushranger - I thought you were stalking me!