Lindsey

Craig,
We went to Tonle Sap a couple of years ago in March and it was very dry at that point, part of the natural phenonmenon of that lake (it loses something like half its volume in dry season). We could still manage the trip but when the water is really low, it's difficult for the rental boats to get close enough to the road to pick up their passengers. We ended up climbing over a few boats that were beached in the mud flats and teetering on some flat boards laid down as bridges over the mud to our boat.
The other problem is that the people who live on the lake use it for everything....washing, cooking AND sanitation. So when the water recedes everything that was in the water is left to rot and dry in the sun, if you get my drift. So there is quite a fierce odor until you get away from the shore. Once in the middle of the lake, I no longer noticed it.
Tonle Sap area is not nearly as prosperous as Inle Lake in Myanmar...in fact this was probably the worst poverty my kids had yet encountered to that point, and they were a bit shellshocked.
Even with all these issues, I found the trip a fasinating look at the lives and culture of the lake dwellers. We went out there late in the afternoon, so we watched a gorgeous sunset while on the lake.
The biggest problem we encountered going back from there in the dark was that the local govt had decided to do some road work while we were there. They basically tore out a huge chunk of the only road out of the lake area and just left it. Thank goodness for the skill of our driver, who was forced to depart the road and navigate over who knows what in the dark. I shut my eyes and prayed. Obviously we survived to tell the story.
BTW, our trip and driver was all arranged by Ponheary Ly (who also accompanied us there) and we only decided to do it that morning. No advance planning necessary. You need someone to negotiate the boat rental for you because no one at the lake speaks English. My advice would be to speak to the guide when you get there about the state of the lake at that time and then decide if you want to go. It's an hour drive each way and a couple of hours on the lake. we left the hotel at about 3:30pm and got back around 8pm.

Kathie

Bob, it's intereesting that your driver didn't speak any English. Our driver, while not fluent, spoke enough that we were able to communicate about which entrance to drop us off at, which to pick us up at, and when the best time was to go places. Obviously, your experience was different.

althom1122

Wow - thanks for all the great feedback and additional tips.

Bob - have already added La Noria to my spreadsheet for dinner in SR. Forgot to mention that we're also planning dinner at the Red Piano there.
And yes, I'll try hard to put away the spreadsheet most of the time! I've grown SO laid back as the years have passed. For our first trip to Europe, I had each day planned literally DOWN TO THE HOUR, as in, 0900 Notre Dame, 1000 Sainte Chapelle, 1100 d'Orsay Museum... you get the idea. Julie referred to my trips back then as "forced marches" - she'll be so happy with this one.

Kathie - regarding Tonle Sap (Tonele?) we'll probably play it by ear, depending on whether we're templed out. I notice though that it's at least a 4-hour investment, so we'll see. (PLAY IT BY EAR - can you BELIEVE I said that?)

Craig - glad I've inspired you to do a pre-trip report! Get busy on it! I'm sure there's plenty more for me to learn. And thanks for the info on when it gets dark and the other waterfall - I have a feeling we won't have time for a waterfall, though.

Lindsey - great description on Tonle Sap - thanks. It does sound fascinating to me...

And I'm still debating on the driver/guide or just driver at Siem Reap... will discuss with Julie.

Two other things - can't believe no one commented on the "wedding ceremony on the elephants" - seriously, does anyone know what they mean? Is it a mating thing?

And Gloria - come on - "Gloria-s scenery" (Glorious scenery) - I was waiting for the groans on that pun. Was it just so bad that everyone rolled their eyes and blew by it?

Oh - and one minor crisis. In reviewing my emails, I noticed that Eddie had made reference to sending me an e-ticket - but I didn't get it! I sent him a note yesterday morning and he hasn't responded. Plus, I just realized the fares have not shown up on my Master Card. Gulp! He emailed me that everything was set, so now what? Has this happened to anyone else? I'll try him again tonight, but I'm a little nervous...

althom1122

Oops - actually, I see it was charged to my MasterCard...

Kathie

Karen, I'm delighted to hear that you're going to play it by ear!

(and yes, I did groan at Gloria-s scenery)

artmarth

Hi Karen---- A few of the "regulars" may recall a couple of my postings, where I noted my wife & I were doing a "private tour" with guide/driver leaving Feb 27, for 36 days in Thailand, Myanmar, Laos, VN & Cambodia.
As such, I have very much enjoyed your postings including your concerns, trepidations, and ultimately, your accomplishment.
On one of your last postings, you listed your expenditures.
I'm not here to give you advice, but I will tell you, one thing you left off your list. You're not going to get into Laos, VN or Cambodia without one item----- A VISA. We got ours beforehand through the applicable embassies in Wash DC. You can do it now, or do it there, but in any case, you'll need to add approx. $240 for you & your daughter for those 3 countries. Also, don't forget, you'll need a have about 6 ea photos for the visa applic.
Anyway-----good job. You certainly should feel proud of yourself for getting this far. Enjoy your trip, and like many others, we'll be looking forward to post trip postings.
Art

althom1122

Art - THAT'S RIGHT! I forgot to list the visas in my spreadsheet. I knew about them, but hadn't totaled up the cost - yikes, didn't realize it would amount to so much. At this point, not a big deal. Thanks for the reminder. I hadn't figured up the number of visa pictures - but I knew it would be several. There are so many details to keep in mind. The hotel in Siem Reap sent me detailed instructions on getting the Cambodian visa - really helpful. One other thing I haven't yet done is figure out how much cash I want to take in U.S. dollars - will likely be asking some questions about that once I do some reading on my own.

Also, I just heard from Eddie - he resent the e-tickets at around 8:30 so I'm good to go! Guess he's just starting work for the morning.

Craig

Gloria - I will research the origins of the Pomelo this weekend and get back to you.

Craig

althom1122

The other cost item I neglected to add in is for shots and malaria medication. I'm up to date on all my shots (went to Africa last year with my master's degree program and got my shots free from the govt), but my daughter will need all the recommended ones and we'll both need malaria meds.

rhkkmk

karen...don't forget pics for the pass for the park in angkor as well...one or two...i forget which....you can also easily get extras made in bkk in 10 minutes...any camera shop...

i did think your transportation (taxis/guide) costs might be a bit high but that is better figured high...

it will be very interesting to see if you can keep to this schedule in the intense heat and humidity...

smeddum

Just returned from Bangkok this morning. Visited Chiang Mai and Luang Prabang (just like Chiang Mai 30 years ago).
Chiang Mai - be sure to buy Map of Chiang Mai by Nancy Chandler. Wonderful for walking around in the old City. V. useful.
If you are there on a Sunday, the Sunday Market is amazing in the old City and the best market we came across anywhere in terms of size, feel and interest. Extremely festive, lots more locals than tourists. Go between 4-6:30pm before it gets packed.
Best shopping was inside the covered night bazzar building.
Oasis Spa has amazing 2 hour traditional thai massages-New (her name) was wonderful. Chiang Mai is the place to get one.
We hired a driver through ad for Mr. Lee's. Was always early and reasonable. Spoke understandable English but keen and good guy,Songbay or something. If interested, will dig contact info. out of suitcase.
New metered taxi company just started-from town center cost 120 baht approx. to airport.
Luang Prabang. We loved and extended our stay. We took the 13:50 flight back to Bangkok but it was delayed for almost four hours! Bonus-got to watch the country president fly in while we hung around. Meanwhile, the first flight of the day left 1/2 hour late. Luckily we had one night in Bangkok before international flight but many on board had connections elsewhere and were jumping up and down so best if you can go to Siem Reip on same carrier.
Red Cross give the best Thai massages-plus goes to a good cause.
Tiger Trails - check out their website. THey have a rather expensive tour ($28-$29 dollars) relative to Loas includes 1 1/2 hr. elephant ride to the falls. New elephant conservation center where they also do brief mahout training.
Monks - be sure to purchase your sticky rice bundles etc. from the market or arrange with a restaurant/guest house before you get there. We wanted to do this but were outvoted by the others who joined us that morning. Otherwise you will be accosted by five women with baskets yelling at you and who will continue to bother you throughout the actual process to keep buying more! Stick to the tourist authority flyer which includes instructions on how to give the items correctly to the monks. The problem with the women selling, although free enterprise is good, was quite unpleasant and completely took away from the feel of the ceremony. Plus we can only see this get worse if people don't stick to the guidelines.
Many places here charged 3or4% service fee on credit cards, best to use Kips. Bring lots of small $ bills.
Enjoyed dinner at Nezim (curry) and Hong's (fun place in the residentail area near guesthouses).
Look for the woman selling handmade handbags at the night market-usually on the lower down near the start of the market on the left if looking up the street. Told her she needed to get a brand going.
The boat trip to caves left at 8:00am. stopped for 15 mins. each at textile village and whisky (rice wine) village en route to caves. We found one tour a day enough.
We went to the taller of the falls. Bring your swimming costume as amazing to swim in the clear upper pool. We went in the late morning before all the tours arrived in the afternoon.
Bangkok - skytrain, change at Siam station (new shopping center opened on Friday called Paragon with aquarium), for skytrain to Siskim (ferry). Take Ferry to Palace, for two approx. 22 bahts or 32 bahts depending on the conductor! pay on board boat) Walk to Wat Po for reflexology after touring the palace.

smeddum

Visa - the Loa visa cost $30 at the airport and was a very organized process. For public holidays, you pay an extra $1 towards cost of staff working. $10 departure tax.
Vietnam visa took 3 days so we didn't go there. However, we heard that if you are in Bangkok you might be able to get it quicker, up to one day but I would not chance that.

smeddum

Bangkok - when you come of ferry for the palace, walk straight ahead. One side of the road are covered shops and the other is the palace grounds. The stories are true re: "guides" telling you the palace is closed. One had us initially walk to the right (don't do this) where we then had to backtrack to the entrance. Go when the place opens as it is always busy, and hot. We had approx. four people try to tell us the place was closed (all for different reasons) even though we did not encourage them and kept insisting we did not need help.

smeddum

One last note, splurge for the car to meet you at the airport upon arrival in Bangkok. Although there are cheaper alternatives, it is so nice after a long flight and sets a great tone for the trip ahead to be greeted upon arrival and ferried quickly, hazzle-free to your location. You'll have enough opportunities for the rest of the trip to save using other transport methods. The greeters/drivers area (v. organized) is after customs you walk to the right about 300 feet. You will pass tourist/hotel booths which are helpful for those who need them.
Also at the skytrain station at the ferry, there was a wonderful tourist information center. Generally very efficient, skytrain employees were happy and seemed keen to help. V. refreshing.

Craig

Thanks very much for your POST-trip report. Now that you have been there, do you think you could have just hired a driver in Luang Prabang to go to the falls or to the caves or was there value added from the tours? Are there other ways to get to the falls beside the 1-1/2 hour elephant ride - we have done elephant rides several times and 1-1/2 hours sounds like a long time.

smeddum

Caves - we booked thru one of the many offices along the main street the night before. $5 each approx. Only thing is the whole boat had to wait for the last people to arrive before it left. About 10-12 people aboard. We would have liked more time at the two stops-15 mins. was enough to either go to the toilet or walk around but not much else. That being said it was efficient and was a great intro. morning. Beautiful and smooth ride up the river. However, the boat driver did not speak except to tell us when to return to boat. Also you need to dig in your pockets to pay the entrance fee to the caves-they don't mention this (can't remember but may 10,000 kips?, guide books say you get a flashlight and guide for the price--we did not see evidence of this. We brought our own flashlight which you use at the upper caves--note: many steps!
Other people then had tours to the Mae Sae falls (the smaller ones) but the tour operators are still getting it together so no one met them to pick them up or tell them what came next until about 30 mins. later. We were happy we didn't have to deal with that. One organized tour was truly enough each day (you could always do the monks first as that starts at approx. 6z:30 am and done by 7:00 or so--time for breakfast and then the boat). Instead we grabbed a bite and a coconut smoothy (with the additon of the rice wine we'd bought tasted like the best pina colada we've ever had) overlooking the river by the boats. Then walked slowly down to the tip of town to visit the Wat, explore the lower area and ended at Garden Spa for massage. You can also hire your own boat for approx. $15-20 for the day. Be sure to see the boat. You can then tailor the amount of time you spend at the stops along the river.
The next day we went to the taller of the falls-hired our own tuk tuk driver (with seats facing forward-he's usually around the Villa Santi hotel--that morning for $25. Probably could have got him for less but was fine. He took us to the exchange so we paid in kips and waited for us. Stopped for petrol just outside town and was glad I took opporunity to use the loo before heading out. Took about 1 hour going. Nice to see the falls before the crowds. Hubby swam in the upper pool - just below the picnic area (we'd tried to climb above the falls but gave up 2/3 way up do to extreme mud and slidding). He said was one of the best experiences of the trip--when he came out, the first of the organized groups was just starting to walk past at about 12:30pm. If you go in a group through the tour groups will be about $3-5 depending on number joining you. There is a 5 year old tiger and two bear cubs here as well. Be sure to walk up along the waterfall path, turn off at the first small path to the right after paying the park entrance fee. Walk back via the concrete road with refreshment stands and tiger/bear enclosures.
The Mae Sae falls - you can take a tuk tuk there but takes 1 1/2 hours to the stop near the falls. The Tiger Trail tour takes a minibus for 50 mins. to their property further down the river. You can then go across the river and visit the elephant center and then take a boat both up/down the river-$25, with elephant-$28-29. Some people kayak-$35. You'll need to check the pricing as this was all given verbally to me and things may change due to time of year.
We'd have liked to take a boat to the Mae Sae falls - the boat people said they could go their, others said the river wasn't high enough. Didn't find out which was correct as did other walks instead.
We walked around the residential section near Hong's looking at the neighborhood. Walked around the corner and there, in a tree in the front drive of a home sat two hawks/ eagles tied to someone's tree beside two tropical birds in cages. Surprise to see but reminded us how close to nature we are in that area.
The Palace Museum is closed on Tuesday (I believe--again check) and took us about 1 hour to explore. The wat on top of the hill took about 2 hours climbing up, exploring/resting and then down the otherside across from the Museum.

CFW

Smeddum, Is there a place to change into swimming suit at the falls or did you have to wear your swim suit under your regular clothes? A little less comfortable & hot, but may be worth it to swim in the pools created by the falls. Sounds lovely.

althom1122

And did you bring a towel? (Thanks, so much, by the way, for adding to this post. Your report was wonderful!)

marcy_

smeddum,
I enjoyed your report, too!

I would suggest, though, that people start a <b>new</b> post for each trip report-- that way more people are likely to see it, and to be able to find it later as a reference to help them plan their trips.

It also helps if you put in your title the names of the places you're talking about-- This also helps when using the search function.
Thanks!

althom1122

I just remembered that I never posted my list of links (I forgot!). So here are some of the ones I used. I'm sure you all can do your own web searches, but I found these helpful. (I don't know how to create actual LINKS here on the board that you can just click to get to. Sorry. Anyone know how?)

Bangkok:

http://thailandforvisitors.com/ (and other areas of Thailand)

http://bangkok.thailandtoday.com/sightseeing/index.html

http://asiarooms.com/thailand/bangko...p;type=#hotels

http://www.city-discovery.com/thailand/index.php

http://www.into-asia.com/thailand/

Mae Hong Son:

http://www.maehongsontravel.com/

http://www.thailandguidebook.com/pro..._hong_son.html

http://www.amazing-thailand.com/MaeHong.html


Chiang Mai:

http://www.chiangmaitours.com/index.html

http://www.chiangmai1.com/buddy/index.html

http://www.chiangmai1.com/tours/english.shtml

http://www.1stopchiangmai.com/

http://www.wayfarersthailand.com/chiangmai.htm (some interesting tours – looked pricey)




Cooking schools in Chiang Mai:

http://www.kaohom.com/index.html

http://www.alotofthai.com/ (the one we’ve booked)

http://www.cookinthai.com/


Luang Prabang:

http://www.laohotelgroup.org/Luang_P...ommodation.php

http://www.virtualtourist.com/travel...bang-BR-1.html


Siem Reap:

http://www.angkorhotels.org/country_guides.php

General (or sections on multiple countries):

http://www.travelfish.org/country/thailand

http://www.virtualtourist.com/travel...uide-Asia.html

http://www.igougo.com/maps/default.asp

Pai:

http://www.paiguide.com/home.htm (not going to Pai, but site was interesting)