Oh, agtoau, I have to take issue with what you reckon is 'symptomatic' about tourism in India outside the 5 star level.

I mean, maybe you are right. Things may have changed enormously in the 6 years since I was last there. And if that's true then it's sad, but I find it hard to believe.

Touts and people wanting to part you from your money are a factor in tourism everywhere - including Europe. Maybe the USA is different? But in the developing world - India, Bali, SE Asia, Africa it's hardly surprising. And it does get annoying - but it comes with the territory. And if you do travel outside the 5 star/private driver ambit then you meet all sorts of wonderful ordinary genuine people on the buses and trains, in the bazaars, the cheap and cheerful eateries, the day trips run by state tourism in India for Indian tourists.

I can't imagine that will change any time soon.

fuzzylogic,

Touts are everywhere, true, but the in developed Western countries, people are mindful of other's personal space to a degree far greater than in a country like India.

Sure, there are wonderful people all over India (that was hardly the crux of my post), but if you are a white Western tourist chances are high that the ones approaching you unsolicited will be the touts and peddlers. The ordinary Indian people you will have to seek out.

Walking around in Panjim today, I was witness to this distressing sight of Western tourists being relentlessly accosted by sellers of two-sided Indian musical drums (called "dholak&quot. And a plain "no" is not enough to ward them. Since when has "dholak" become a hot item with the Westerners?

fuzzylogic - re. my point about the 5-star ambit: it provides a buffer to the harsher elements of the Indian interface. To really know what India is all about, one has to get way beyond one's comfort zone. Few Westerners would want to do that (and with justification), given that for most India as a destination is a once-in-a-lifetime thing.

I can suggest you a person who will do the jobs for you where in u can get the best suggestion u may mail to [email protected]

Agtoau - I agree that Goa - away from the beaches - is fabulous. I made particular ref to beaches as twiz was looking for some R&R by the sea. Inland Goa has fabulous scenery, friendly laid back people and peace & quiet - have you ever been to Tamdi Surla temple, it's magic. I also agree with you that touts etc in India are far more aggresive than elsewhere - having said that there is no country on earth I would rather spend time in than India. I too was hounded to death in Panjim by a guy selling drums - the funny thing was that when we reached the airport someone had obviously decided to ditch their purchase after security scanning and for the two hours we waited for our flight one of the airport staff wandered around the departure lounge looking for their owner, all the time banging the drums to catch our attention!! This time there was no escape apart from perhaps claiming them myself!!

Dear lyall,

Yes, of course, I have been to the Tambdi Surla temple of Mahadeva (Lord Shiva) in the interior of Goa but I was in my teens then. Now that you have mentioned it, I am thinking of cutting a trip there in the next week or two. The temple dates to around the 12th C. There are also Buddhist caves and ruins in Goa that are seldom explored by tourists. The Dudhsagar waterfall is not too far from Tambdi Surla.

The region around Ponda is also interesting for its temples and tranquil environs. This is the general area in the Goan hinterland where the Hindu idols were reinstalled after the temples lining up on the Goan shores were powderised by the Portuguese.

Thank you all for your advice! There are so many places we want to see that the decision is almost impossible! But, we'll have to start saying "we'll do that on our 2nd trip".

Thanks again

Just got back from 2 weeks in India, and I must say that whatsoever do not miss seeing the Akshardam temple on the east side of the Yamuna river about 10-15 mins taxi from central Delhi. It's a brand new temple that's an awesome collection of carvings. It opens at 0900, but if you get there ~ 0700 you can sit in on the temple service going on via the back gate (Gate 6?) We arrived 17 Dec and thankfully saw the earlier Fodor's posting on this and were the only ones in our tour group to see it by getting up early while everyone slept in and waited for the 100 tour to begin. You won't go wrong, I promise. Good luck.

I am also preparing for my first trip to India next winter, and planning to spend around 2 weeks. From what I have read, it looks like we should plan for the following itinerary:

Days 1-2: Fly to Delhi from USA
Days 3-4: Delhi (Akshardam temple)
Days 5-6: Agra (Taj Mahal, Fort Agra, “Baby Taj”). [Hotel rec’d: Amarvilas]
Days 7-8: Jaipur (Amber Fort, Hawa Mahal, City Palace and Jantar Mantar Observatory)
Days 9-10: Udaipur (CITY PALACE)
Days 11-12: Mumbai
Days 13-14: Kerala (backwaters cruise, Kathakali performance, tea plantations in Munnar or Peermede)
Day 15: Fly home to USA

Please let me know any thoughts as I am eager for feedback from those who have been. It looks like a busy trip with lots of travel and I'd prefer to cut that back if possible but don't want to miss any "must sees". The beach at the end sounded like a great way to wrap up a whirlwind trip, though my friends I am travelling with have been to Goa so I selected Kerala for something different.

lw2117, suggest u start a post else will miss out on advcie. IMO your trip is too rushed - too little time in Delhi, 1 night in Jaipur and Udaipur hectic and I would drop Kerala out of this itinerary altogether as it is too rushed and involves too much travel time.

Twiz

I just saw this thread. Thank goodness someone out there said in Agra not to miss the Agra Fort and the magnificent Fatepuhr Sikri.
The tigers of Ranthambore are worth the drive.
And find a way to get to Varanasi. Much more important than seeing a bunch of luxuray beaches!

www.waynehazle.com/india/

Check out my pictures

Thanks Hobbes! Will do.

Hi twiz. I'm a huge fan of Jaipur. It is a magic city if you have the inclination & time to discovery its great shopping, fabulous buidlings & markets, superb food at cheap local eateries. And Panjim in Goa is also marvellous. We're returning to India on Mar 2 2006 for our third trip in the past 13 months. Of all the cities we've passed through or bothered to explore, Jaipur has been the most memorable. If you're into great mid priced hotels then check out www.jasvilas.com-the owners are charming & full of info on Jaipur. Really upper crust Indians with a down to earth modern approach to hospitality.

The road from Jaipur to Udaipur passes close to Deogarh Mahal Palace. We had a wonderful night there Dec 26 2004 and the palace & the hospitality & food are remarkable. See this website -www.deogarhmahal.com. Check out Ranakpur Jain temples on the way to Udaipur. Truly amazing. Have a great trip.

Lyndie. I will be in Jaipur in March. Can you recommend any nice resonably priced restaurants in that city. I would also like to buy some gold or gem jewelry. Any suggestions for a reputable store? Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Hi lilypoo-we buy costume jewellery with semi-precious stones & we loved Silver Mines for some beautiful pieces, especially garnets. They have 2 showrooms, one in MI Road and another in Bani Park.
We were guests of Mahendra & Lily Singh at www.jasvilas.com who specifically gave us contact details for Jaipur retailers and wholesalers. The Singhs are wonderful hosts & I'd suggest your stay in Jaipur would be enhanced hugely if you were to stay at Jas Vilas. They have wonderful contacts & advice & we're looking forward to seeing them again in 2006.

Some of our favourite restaurants are:- Handi & Copper Chimney in MI Road, Jas Vilas dining room and Laxmi at Johari Bazaar. We loved walking around the city & bazaars and had a great auto rickshaw driver from out the front of Jas Vilas who took us to Indian sweet shops and restaurants, we might never have found ourselves. You're in for a treat if you have an open enquiring mind and a positive attitude.

Another great choice for jewellery was Gem Palace in MI Road & also at the Rambagh Palace Hotel. Expensive but gorgeous stuff.

The best advice I can give you is to buy a Footprint India Guide. It's simply the best!

Good luck.

Lyndie. Thanks for the great info. While in Jaipur we will be staying at the Alsisar Haveli. Have you heard anything about this property?

Lyall, I did get to the Mahadeva temple in Tambdi Surla, Goa. Here's a picture -

http://www.parrikar.org/images/rp_tambdisurla.jpg

Will post more pictures of Goa soon.


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