Hi all,

I have never been to either of Bali or Bora Bora and I am looking for a great place for a romantic getaway for this November to celebrate an anniversary. I know both places are different but the prices seem much less expensive in Bali. We want to stay at a Four Seasons property and again the Bali prices are much less. I guess my questions are having never been to Asia or the Pacific islands what would be a good first trip. We are an adventurous couple in our early 40's and we don't want to be somewhere terribly touristy or filled with cruise ships. We definitely want to spend some time at the beach but it does not have to be a perfect beach. Is Bali very built up now? Are there big cities there now? I have heard it was beautiful many years ago but wondered what it is like now? Ar e the beaches alright at Jimbarian Bay? Any advice would be much appreciated. The plane flight is longer to Bali is it worth it? We like activities but also relaxing. Thanks in advance for any responses.

Bali would be a wonderful place for an anniversary trip and a great introduction to traveling in SE Asia. In Bali, you'll have much more opportunity to experience the culture. Bali is unique, the only island in Indonesia that is predominantly Hindu. If you opt for Bali, you'll likely want to stay in two places, a beach location and an inland location overlooking the river valley and the rice terraces. Note that there is a Four Seasons in both locations. Often they have a special package that gives you a discount for staying at both properties.

thanks so much. Is November an alright time to go in terms of weather? Also is the beach nice at Jimbarian Bay?

November is moving toward the rainy season, December - February are the rainiest. I've been to Bali a couple of times in November. When we got rain, it was a short (and intense) shower in the afternoon.

I haven't stayed at Jimbaran, so I'll let someone who has stayed there address that question.

Another vote for Bali. We went there in 2008 - spent 8 days and absolutely loved it. I would go back in a heartbeat. And I think it will meet your desire not to go someplace terribly built up or crammed with cruise ships. I am not sure it even have a port large enough for cruise ships. And there are strict building codes about the height of buildings, so you don't get high rise hotels or anything.

We went to Jimbaran Bay for an afternoon and thought it was ok. The beach is pretty good there - fairly wide with nice sand. It is very close to the airport though, which may not be what you are looking for. For our next trip, I think we will stay in the Sanur area - still fairly close to Denpasar (where the airport is), but on the east coast rather than the west coast. That area seems like a good mix of nice beaches and villages. I have heard that Seminyak is good too.

On our trip, we split our time between Ubud and Amed. Ubud is in the mountains and a neat town for local arts and crafts. Amed is on the northeast coast and pretty out of the way - we wanted some time to basically just check out from the world awhile, so that is why we chose it.

thanks so very much for all of the feedback. I was worried about landing at the airport and seeing an American fast food chain or something. Are there any nice hotels on par with Four Seasons at some of the other nicer beaches near the airport(within an hour) but not staring at it like Jimbarian Bay?

thanks again.

I haven’t been to Bora Bora so I can’t give you a comparison. Bali has a good deal of tourism oriented development but most of it is concentrated in the southern beach area. As November moon mentioned building height is restricted to under palm tree level so though the beaches do have a lot of side by side resorts it’s not of the high rise variety.

Weather is variable in Novemeber. You may get rain off and on or you may not. You will definitely see American fast food chains and other manifestations of mass tourism in Bali but it’s fairly easy to avoid, especially in the Ubud area.

All of the southern beaches are within 30 minutes of the airport (which is actually in Jimbaran) and Ubud is about an hour’s drive.

I’ve stayed at the Four Seasons in Jimbaran several times and have visited their Sayan property but not stayed there. The FS Jimbaran was one of the forerunners of villa-style resort architecture that is now popular all over the world. It’s perched on the side of a cliff so every villa has a little garden with a plunge pool and a magnificent view. The beach is just okay – somewhat eroded in the FS area, but overall good for swimming. The FS itself has a handful of restaurants, but aside from the nearby and very popular seafood restaurants, there are not a lot of eating/shopping options in Jimbaran.

Personally, I prefer Seminyak, though the surf is more aggressive. Long sandy beach and plenty of choices in restaurants, shops, spas, clubs within walking distance or a short taxi ride. I’d suggest The Legian Seminyak in the same price level as the FS. I like the regular rooms or suites which all have large balconies with seaviews over the villas.

You might also look at renting a private villas in the Seminyak area, not on the beach but within walking distance. There are dozens of choices. This site will give you an overview. http://www.seminyakvillas.net/

The FS Sayan which is on the outskirts of Ubud is generally well reviewed. I also like the nearby Como Shambhala a lot, but it's somewhat more isolated. In the town of Ubud, take a look at the Uma Ubud.

This is a somewhat delightful dilemma I would say. I do not think you would be disappointed with either. I have been to Bora Bora once probably a decade ago. I have been to Bali numerous times over the last quarter century and lived there for about 6 months at one point. Here are my thoughts:

1. Bali will be in the early stage of the rainy season in November, but that should not interfere unduly; however do be aware that you could have overcast days even if you don’t have rain. Also, if you go toward the end of the month, IMO, you will probably run into more chance of rain. If you plan on doing a lot of snorkeling or diving, this may be an issue for you. If you want a chance of sunnier days, going in October would be a better idea. I also believe that November is a somewhat high rainfall month for Bora Bora. I have not been there in the rainier season, which I believe includes November, so can’t speak to how it works; but in the Maldives, which may be similar, the rainy season manifests itself in afternoon thunderstorms which can last for several hours. Again, if you plan to do a lot of snorkeling or diving, going in October may be a better idea. For both places, see, weatherbase.com and other weather websites to get an idea of what to expect in terms of rain to make sure you are OK with the possibilities.

2. If you want really beautiful beaches, azure water, soft white sand, pristine snorkeling and diving and over-the-water bungalows, you need to go to Bora Bora. You won’t find those on Bali. The beaches can be very pretty to be sure, in some cases with black sand, and in some cases long and flat with lovely cliff vistas. However, they are not the most beautiful beaches in the world. There is some good snorkeling and diving, but not as good as you will find in Bora Bora. Bali is really much more about inland areas (they have some stunning rice terrace areas). There is nothing wrong with wanting gorgeous beaches and sparkling blue water, and if that is what you want, that is what you should have.

3. Of the two, I believe Bora Bora gets more cruise ships and IMO the main town is somewhat more touristy, esp. when a ship is in town (although Bali certainly has its overloaded tourist areas). Bora Bora is considerably more expensive, as you have found. Not only for hotels, but for every meal you will eat out, for wine/alcohol and for shopping. But if you stick near your hotel in Bora Bora, I am fairly sure you won’t encounter cruise ship crowds.

4. Bora Bora is Polynesian culture with a polytheistic religion which includes worship of physical forces (like volcanoes), as well as a good number of Catholics from the French presence; Bali is Hindu which is gloriously polytheistic and also includes some animist practices left over from the pre-Hindu era (evil forces live in low places and travel in a straight line, which is why entrances to homes have steps and false fronts, to keep out bad spirits). But the cultures are quite different, esp. in terms of art, music and food. Bora Bora is a French protectorate and is quite heavily influenced by the French. The Balinese are rather conservative and are SE Asian in terms of their culture. That being said, the culture of Bali is incredibly rich and dance, music, painting and sculpture in particular are to be found all over the island. I did not find this to be the same in Bora Bora, but perhaps my limited experience there was insufficient.

5. There is really no place to go on Bora Bora other than the main town and as I recall, the one road up into the mountains. Bali by contrast is a larger island, with many areas to explore either by road, bicycle or on foot. Some whitewater rafting is also available in mountain areas. (Although you can certainly ocean kayak in Bora Bora.) There are numerous small villages dotting the island and several national parks. In my recollection, Bora Bora did not have a lot of night life to speak of, while Bali offers a great deal in terms of restaurants and cultural events. The shopping on Bora Bora seems to be limited to black pearls and some local coconut handicrafts. The shopping on Bali includes a rich array of local handicrafts and artwork, textiles, furniture and goods from other parts of SE Asia.

6. Bali has changed drastically in the 25 years I have been going there; some places, like Ubud have almost changed beyond recognition. Bali seems to be a victim of its own success, and has become far more touristed. (I shudder to think what will happen when “Eat, Pray Love” comes out in theatres…) Areas like Seminyak, which was a tiny, very sleepy artist’s colony, is just Yuppie Ville now (to use an old phrase) and has traffic jams. It’s still small in terms of size and is perfectly fine if you want to sit on the beach in the morning, have a cappuccino in the afternoon, shop for hand made paper, go have an Italian dinner, and head back to your villa. But it does not feel at all like Bali to me. It is certainly enjoyable; and I myself do spend time there at times when I am in Bali. (But I only have to fly 4 hours to get there from Hong Kong, and I am not looking for the exotic on a weekend break. I want the hand made paper sometimes.) But none of these are “big cities” by any stretch of the imagination. They are more like small villages, or perhaps Kuta qualifies as a small town. Denpassar, where the airport is located, is a small city, but you will not go there as a tourist. And there are many places you can go to get away from the more touristy areas. The north east and far north of the island are much less developed. It would also be possible to go to Lombok, the island to the east of Bali, but note that this is not a Hindu island, is drier and is in no way “like Bali used to be 20 years ago”. It’s just less developed and can be interesting from that perspective. There is an Aman hotel there if you want luxury (see below), and other hotel choices.

7. Personally, if I were going to Bali, I would not choose the Four Seasons Jimbarin for the beach location. I would go with a hotel along the north east coast, like the Amankila, see http://www.amanresorts.com/ for a list of all their resorts, they run the Hotel Bora Bora as well). I think the Four Seasons in Ubud (i.e. Sayan) has a spectacular location, but their beach location does not thrill me as much. Alternatively, in the same area as the Jimbaran, if you don’t mind spending the money, you could consider the Bvlgari, which really is in a stunning setting (http://www.bulgarihotels.com/). There are lots of good choices in Bali, including renting your own villa in the hills or elsewhere. See vrbo.com for a start.

8. I would also say you could look at the Maldives, but in November you would have about the same rain issues you will find in Bora Bora and Bali. November is a tricky month to try to plan a beach vacation in the Pacific and SE Asia, as two monsoons are moving through the area at that time. IMO the best place to go in November in SE Asia for a beach would be the Philippines (see something like El Nido in Palawan http://www.elnidoresorts.com/ or consider the Amanpulo in the Philippines, see the Aman website above). This can then be combined with places like Hong Kong, Singapore or Bangkok or even cities in the PRC. Otherwise, your best plan may be Australia, the beaches of the west coast of India (Goa and Kerala) and possibly parts of Sri Lanka. Or move your trip back a month to October.

the beaches are ok in bali but not fantastic.... the 4 seasons would keep their beach nice...

Bora Bora in the 1980's was wonerful but in the 2001 I would take a pass. Bali in 2000 was awesome, in 2005 it was getting touristy and in 2010 it was Bora Bora od 2001. So my vote is Bali. But the Aman is too sterile and everyione believes it must offer something speciakl because it's rates are 25%-40% over the other best in Bali. Having stayed there and 2 other Aman I have finally decided I will not get taken again. I visit most destinations where there are Aman resorts to tour 5-8 hours a day so the sleek pool means little to me. I have always found the Four Seasons-Sayan in Ubud to be outstanding especially when I take a king deluxe room backing up on a large part of the river behind. the rates are about 30++% less and I think it is a better resort experierience considering how little time (12-13 hours including sleeping I am actually at the facility.You do not get the beach but you get a lovely surroundings and with a quality private guide/driver for $60-70day tops/day for 9-10 hours you tour the countryside that is simply beatiful. But, do your research in advance on a quality licenced guide.

The above post is so funny to me because it illustrates a point perfectly. I was in Ubud in 2000 as well. That was the trip on which I saw my first 2-story commerical building in Ubud. I wept. I thought it was so awful that "progress" had come to the village which I had been visting for 15 years, and had lived in during the early 1990s. Bali in 2000 was <i>incredibly</i> touristy to me. It was nothing at all like Bali in 1985. But I am sure Bali in 1985 was nothing at all like Bali in 1970. So it is all a matter of your perspective -- or lack of it. Sometimes never having been someplace is better because you don't have memories to compare it to.

Penelope, I have no doubt that you would think either Bora Bora or Bali in 2010 is wonderful...

Marmot; If you were in Bora Bora in 2000 you likely would have found Bali still quite primitive something I like and what we found in Central Java.

Stan, I was in Ubud in the late 1980s. Electricity had arrived in Ubud the previous year. Those of us who have witnessed some of these places many years ago see them as nothing like they were before. That doesn't mean that we or someone with a new set of eyes won't enjoy them! Everywhere in the world has changed since 1985. I was first in central Java about 1990. I'm sure it has changed since then. Still, you enjoyed it a lot - and I'm glad you were able to enjoy it. But it doesn't mean that people coming after you won't enjoy it.

My parents lived in Bali in the late 1970's, and I love looking at their photos from that time. I first went to Bali as a kid in the mid 1980's and didn't make a return trip until last summer. Yes, it was more developed and built up than I remember it, particularly in the South....but Bali is still a magical place, and the people are lovely, and the culture so vibrant. I truly think it is one of the most unique and special places in the world, and a perfect vacation spot.

Katie; If you went into the town of Ubud as I did on March 17 you would have thought you were in Cancun, downtown Cabo, etc. is was that disapointing. Ten(10) miles out of Ubud you were in Bali of2002-4. Trust me I say it and was so upset.If you saw the small villages in Megedlang, Central Java they have not chnges in 30+ years according to locals and 2 guests we met who had traveled there years ago. We met at Sony Santoso's art compound. He is now one of Indonesia's most highly regarded artists and a real charchater to boot.

thanks everyone for all of the insights. I really appreciate and will probably go with Bali since it sounds more interesting. I will post a report when I return. Thanks again.

My husband & I celebrated our 25th anniversary in Bali & it was perfect. October-weather wonderful The spa treatments are sooooooooo inexpensive. Not sure at the Four Seasons. I have been to Bora Bora-but in the 80's & it was expensive then. My vote Bali enjoy whatever you choose-Chris

Speaking of inexpensive spa treatments - Bali is definitely the place for that. My husband isn't really a spa sort of person, but even he got a couple massages while we were there because the price was so good.