KLM with 11 months old
May 7th, 2012, 09:20 AM
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KLM with 11 months old
I will be flying from Los Angeles to Amsterdam with a then 11 months old. I did purchase a seat for her, but am reluctant to bring a car seat for her to sit in for 11 hours. Does KLM have special seat belts for babies her age? Does anyone have any experience?
May 7th, 2012, 10:23 AM
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If a seat has been reserved for your child, we recommend that you bring your own car/child seat (child restraint device) aboard on the condition that it fits between the armrests of the aircraft seat (42 cm/16.5 inches). Only forward facing child seats that display no defects and that carry a visible seal of approval awarded by the European Union or an official government agency may be taken aboard.
Officially approved brands:
UN Standard ECE R44-03 and 44-04
US FMVSS no. 213
Canadian CMVSS 213/123.1
German TÜV/958-01/2001
Types marked approved by Transport Canada
Types marked approved by the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA)
Types marked approved by Joint Civil Aviation Authority (JAA)
A seat for a second baby, or the use of a car/child seat must be reserved in advance. Please contact KLM Telephone Reservations or your local KLM ticket office for this service.
Officially approved brands:
UN Standard ECE R44-03 and 44-04
US FMVSS no. 213
Canadian CMVSS 213/123.1
German TÜV/958-01/2001
Types marked approved by Transport Canada
Types marked approved by the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA)
Types marked approved by Joint Civil Aviation Authority (JAA)
A seat for a second baby, or the use of a car/child seat must be reserved in advance. Please contact KLM Telephone Reservations or your local KLM ticket office for this service.
May 7th, 2012, 11:54 PM
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I have travelled a few times with an infant on a plane and never bothered with a car seat, which I found to be heavy and impractical to take with us. Indeed I have friends who did do the car seat thing on one trip (they travel regularly between Prague and Sydney) and their son objected strenuously to it, so they never tried it with the second son.
The times I travelled when my daughter was an infant, I always got given a lap belt which loops around your own belt and around their waist but is still flexible enough for the child to turn and breastfeed if you're doing that (it (feeding) seems to be recommended for takeoffs and landings). We also reserved bassinettes which slot into the wall at the bulkhead. Very desirable seats - plenty of space for you and the baby, lots of legroom. But you have to request this in advance and they never guarantee you'll get those seats. There is also a kind of configuration of belts like a net that slips over the top of the bassinette to protect the child in case of severe turbulence, so they aren't completely unrestrained. We found the bassinette very good to be able to keep to the rhythm of sleeps and minimise upset routines at the other end.
I've got 2 trip reports on travelling with a child, one on Qantas / Singapore Airlines, when my daughter was 16 months, and another on Korean Air when she was 2 and a half. Just click on my screen name to read our experiences.
Lavandula
The times I travelled when my daughter was an infant, I always got given a lap belt which loops around your own belt and around their waist but is still flexible enough for the child to turn and breastfeed if you're doing that (it (feeding) seems to be recommended for takeoffs and landings). We also reserved bassinettes which slot into the wall at the bulkhead. Very desirable seats - plenty of space for you and the baby, lots of legroom. But you have to request this in advance and they never guarantee you'll get those seats. There is also a kind of configuration of belts like a net that slips over the top of the bassinette to protect the child in case of severe turbulence, so they aren't completely unrestrained. We found the bassinette very good to be able to keep to the rhythm of sleeps and minimise upset routines at the other end.
I've got 2 trip reports on travelling with a child, one on Qantas / Singapore Airlines, when my daughter was 16 months, and another on Korean Air when she was 2 and a half. Just click on my screen name to read our experiences.
Lavandula
May 8th, 2012, 07:11 AM
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We brought a car seat along once for our daughter on an international trip. It did not go well. I think the angle the seat can sit in a plane seat is different than in our car, so she was more upright than she was used to. She loved her seat in the car and slept in it easily. But, on the plane she could not get comfortable and ended up sleeping on me. And at that point it would have been a lot nice to NOT have the big car seat taking up space.
This is probably not an issue for an 11 month old, but the other thing is that these seats get kids much closer to the seat in front of them, making it a lot easier to kick the seat in front of them.
My experience with seatbelts was varied. I think it was in Australia that we got the extra seatbelt to loop through ours. But, on every other airline, we were just instructed to hold onto her. Things could have changed, she is 6 now.
There is a company that sells special harness seatbelts for kids - CARES I think? We got one, but they didn't work very well on small planes. But that is something you might want to check out for the future. I think 11 months might be too small for it.
Good luck!
Betsy
This is probably not an issue for an 11 month old, but the other thing is that these seats get kids much closer to the seat in front of them, making it a lot easier to kick the seat in front of them.
My experience with seatbelts was varied. I think it was in Australia that we got the extra seatbelt to loop through ours. But, on every other airline, we were just instructed to hold onto her. Things could have changed, she is 6 now.
There is a company that sells special harness seatbelts for kids - CARES I think? We got one, but they didn't work very well on small planes. But that is something you might want to check out for the future. I think 11 months might be too small for it.
Good luck!
Betsy
May 8th, 2012, 02:37 PM
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On US airlines, we ask that you hold your under 2 year old on your lap-however,European airlines seem to always offer the extra lapbelt for the child.
Your 11 month old is way too old for a bassinet on most airlines.Bassinets are NOT a substitute for a child during turbulence and one must remove their child when the seatbelt sign is on.
As an international flight attendant for a major US carrier,why wouldn't you take the car seat for your child for the flight and for possible car/taxi travel while overseas?
Most of my little passengers like their car seats because it is something they are familiar with and therefore provides a calming effect in the crazy world of air travel...just saying!
Your 11 month old is way too old for a bassinet on most airlines.Bassinets are NOT a substitute for a child during turbulence and one must remove their child when the seatbelt sign is on.
As an international flight attendant for a major US carrier,why wouldn't you take the car seat for your child for the flight and for possible car/taxi travel while overseas?
Most of my little passengers like their car seats because it is something they are familiar with and therefore provides a calming effect in the crazy world of air travel...just saying!
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May 8th, 2012, 05:20 PM
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I think you raised a similar question in an earlier thread.
I've flown KLM probably around 10 times with an under 2 year old and on all occasions I was given an additional seat belt that connects to your own seat belt when landing, taking off and turbulence
Its good that people like Lavendula & eastave have provided the practicalities of using a car seat on a long journey, that was my question on the previous thread which never got answered
The question of turbulence and the subsequent dangers seem to be hugely overstated here. I checked some stats and the FAA website states the following for all passengers and crews over a 28 year period and some 25,000 flights per day
<<From 1980 through 2008, U.S. air carriers had 234 turbulence accidents*, resulting in 298 serious injuries and three fatalities.
Of the 298 serious injuries, 184 involved flight attendants and 114 involved passengers.
At least two of the three fatalities involved passengers who were not wearing their seat belts while the seat belt sign was illuminated.>>
The dangers of traveling unrestrained on buses, trams, trains or being hit by bikes in Amsterdam would be a bigger concern to me
I've flown KLM probably around 10 times with an under 2 year old and on all occasions I was given an additional seat belt that connects to your own seat belt when landing, taking off and turbulence
Its good that people like Lavendula & eastave have provided the practicalities of using a car seat on a long journey, that was my question on the previous thread which never got answered
The question of turbulence and the subsequent dangers seem to be hugely overstated here. I checked some stats and the FAA website states the following for all passengers and crews over a 28 year period and some 25,000 flights per day
<<From 1980 through 2008, U.S. air carriers had 234 turbulence accidents*, resulting in 298 serious injuries and three fatalities.
Of the 298 serious injuries, 184 involved flight attendants and 114 involved passengers.
At least two of the three fatalities involved passengers who were not wearing their seat belts while the seat belt sign was illuminated.>>
The dangers of traveling unrestrained on buses, trams, trains or being hit by bikes in Amsterdam would be a bigger concern to me
May 8th, 2012, 11:46 PM
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You have to check with the individual airlines as to the height and weight accepted for providing bassinettes - my daughter at 16 months was just at the limit. I don't remember her weight but her height was around 70cm, which was OK for Qantas -oops, did I say Singapore Airlines in my other post, we actually travelled with Lufthansa, not SQ - at any rate, Lufthansa had no problem with us using a bassinette. And it's true, you do have to remove your child if there's turbulence, which is unfortunate, but if there's none, your kid can get a good rest. Qantas has bassinettes which fold down from the wall, Lufthansa has baskets that slot into holes in the wall. Both were great.
Lavandula
Lavandula
May 9th, 2012, 05:08 AM
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A couple of things about the "bassinettes"
1. There are limited seats these fit into and often more requests then space.
2. With the advent of the Economy Comfort seating there are even FEWER seats since often that first bulkhead row is now EC seating not "open seating"
3. They are NEVER guranteed and you can be "ranked" out even if you were told you had one. For example, medical needs will get that row before you do. (i.e., someone in a cast whose leg doesn't bend
)
1. There are limited seats these fit into and often more requests then space.
2. With the advent of the Economy Comfort seating there are even FEWER seats since often that first bulkhead row is now EC seating not "open seating"
3. They are NEVER guranteed and you can be "ranked" out even if you were told you had one. For example, medical needs will get that row before you do. (i.e., someone in a cast whose leg doesn't bend
)
May 11th, 2012, 07:48 AM
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We never got the bassinette.
First, as CarolA mentions, it can be hard to get the bulkhead seats.
Second, on our first overseas trip with our daughter, she was 9 months old. We were told by Air Canada that once the kid can sit up they aren't allowed in a bassinette. Of course, we weren't told this until we got to the airport expecting a bassinette, but that is another story.
I would have loved it if our daughter would have been as happy in her carseat on the plane as she was in the car. But, for some reason it didn't work out for us. And, unlike a car where it is just us, I wasn't about to subject a plane full of people to her wailing. Plus, the seats are a pain in the butt to carry through airports.
First, as CarolA mentions, it can be hard to get the bulkhead seats.
Second, on our first overseas trip with our daughter, she was 9 months old. We were told by Air Canada that once the kid can sit up they aren't allowed in a bassinette. Of course, we weren't told this until we got to the airport expecting a bassinette, but that is another story.
I would have loved it if our daughter would have been as happy in her carseat on the plane as she was in the car. But, for some reason it didn't work out for us. And, unlike a car where it is just us, I wasn't about to subject a plane full of people to her wailing. Plus, the seats are a pain in the butt to carry through airports.
Mar 11th, 2013, 02:01 PM
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I seem to be the only person in existence to find this, but I actually hate bulkhead seats. The armrests don't lift, so even if you have the whole middle section to yourself and your little one(s), you can't combine the seats for lying down better (or for more space if you're big like me). The trays are tiny and easily knocked by your knees because they come out of the arm rests.
Although theoretically there's lots of leg room, I was not allowed to let my baby sit and play there for 'safety reasons'. They actually thought that ideally I should hold my 7 month old baby in the burping position over my shoulder for 9 HOURS! Also in bulkhead seats there is nowhere to keep your things because there is no seat in front to put them under, so the leg room idea is a bit overrated anyway as you're sharing it with anything you don't want to get up to fetch from overhead. Often the compartment directly overhead will be filled with extra supplies or AV equipment or something, so your stuff ends up farther back anyway.
When I had a bassinet it was probably worth all the disadvantages, but when I didn't have one (all occupied or baby too capable) it was definitely not worth it.
On the car seat issue, I had a lot of hassle trying to use one on KLM, but managed in the end. I have never seen or heard of any EU approval for use of a car seat on planes. Although mine are all R44.04 approved, I can't find the quote in the first reply in any of their documentation, so I can't use it to back me up.
Although theoretically there's lots of leg room, I was not allowed to let my baby sit and play there for 'safety reasons'. They actually thought that ideally I should hold my 7 month old baby in the burping position over my shoulder for 9 HOURS! Also in bulkhead seats there is nowhere to keep your things because there is no seat in front to put them under, so the leg room idea is a bit overrated anyway as you're sharing it with anything you don't want to get up to fetch from overhead. Often the compartment directly overhead will be filled with extra supplies or AV equipment or something, so your stuff ends up farther back anyway.
When I had a bassinet it was probably worth all the disadvantages, but when I didn't have one (all occupied or baby too capable) it was definitely not worth it.
On the car seat issue, I had a lot of hassle trying to use one on KLM, but managed in the end. I have never seen or heard of any EU approval for use of a car seat on planes. Although mine are all R44.04 approved, I can't find the quote in the first reply in any of their documentation, so I can't use it to back me up.
