ellencraig

Hi there,

In the past month I flew transatlantic twice, first on American and then on Virgin Atlantic. It was very interesting. While Virgin Atlantic bills itself as an "upper class suite", it is actually American that is much more like a suite, with much more personal space. You really feel very comfortable and roomy on American, whereas on Virgin it is actually a bit cramped, and I am a small person. I don't know if a tall person would be comfortable in these seats.

Also, on Virgin you feel like you are in extremely close proximity to your neighbors, which is a little weird - cattle call is what you're hoping to avoid by flying first class.

One annoying thing is that the Virgin Atlantic flight attendants walk very very fast, and their footsteps are very loud and can wake you up.

I liked that the chair/bed on American can be at any stage in between. Virgin's seat requires you to get up out of your seat, hail a flight attendant, and have them flip the bed into flat position. There are no inbetweens on Virgin.

Virgin did have a nice touch - a bottom sheet and a duvet, while American only provided a duvet. I liked the pillow on Virgin better too.

Overall the food was better on American, but that said, they overcooked my beef on both outgoing and returning flights. Virgin's lamb was perfectly cooked.

Movies on Virgin were not great, American's were better. But American's in flight entertainment system kept crashing again and again on the return flight.

I really loved having three windows to my self on American. On Virgin you have one, but one is behind your seat. It is a little weird to not be able to face forward in the Virgin seat. I preferred the American seat, although it was more difficult to adjust and got stuck more easily.

The lounges for both American and Virgin were very nice.

One more disappointing thing on Virgin - they offer in flight spa treatments, and come around to get your preferred treatment order at the beginning of the flight. However, not everyone gets a treatment, the lucky ones are selected at random and everyone else is just out of luck. It seems they ought to offer short treatments to everyone. This was very disappointing and somewhat false advertising.

Well, all for now. If I think of something else I'll post it.

Ellen Craig
[email protected]
[email protected]

rkkwan

Virgin's Upper Class is a business-class product. You cannot compare it to AA's Flagship Suites, which is a FC product.

ellencraig

Hi Rkkwan,
I didnt' know that Virgin's highest class to Gatwick is technically business; it is the highest class offered on the 340's.

I did find it very interesting that Virgin's marketing tends to portray itself as first class, stressing the "suite" aspect. AA could market this much more successfully, and it would be an accurate portrayal.

I guess this is what surprised me - the difference between how Virgin UC portrayed itself vs. what it is, and American's more subtle marketing vs. what it is.

Ellen C.

rkkwan

Virgin has three classes of services on all its long-haul routes: economy, premium economy and business (which they call Upper Class). They do not offer an international first class.

The whole Virgin Empire is very masterful in marketing - not only for Virgin Atlantic, but its trains, coke, mobile phones, etc. I mean, Sir Richard flies hot-air balloon, Sir Richard makes reality TV shows... Why? To market the Virgin brand.

Anyways, it seems like you fell for it and thought you were going first class. You were not.

International business class on all carriers have to strike a compromise. Since BA started the flat bed Club World a few years ago (not just lie-flat at an angle, but horizontal ones), every airline renovating their business class cabins are thinking about new ways to get them without taking up too much room.

For BA (and UA soon), that means half of the passengers will face backwards. For VS, NZ, AC, CX, that means those office-cubicle herringbones. For SQ, it's a wide seat that flips over to a bed angled to a side. For Etihad, it's narrow, staggered beds. Each design has its problem, and right now CX's receiving some very poor response for its own herringbone design on three planes with them, very similar to VS'.

blightyboy

Be interesting to see the price differential

ellencraig

Blightyboy, I used miles for both trips. American was either 100k or 120k, I don't remember now, that was roundtrip.
Virgin was 100k using Continental OnePass miles.
So American mileage has much better value. Although I want to stress that Virgin had very nice touches - easy to operate seat, bottom sheet, good pillow, perfectly cooked food - that ranked above American's service in those regards.

Rkkwan,
Thanks for the detailed info. Very helpful. I find it interesting to compare first and business because you might find a business product that is better than a first product. (and in some regards Virgin's was.)

I would imagine there are first products out there that are not as nice as Virgin's business - have you or anyone else found this to be true?

Ellen C.

flanneruk

Interesting discussion.

AA on Expedia in a month's time is showing at £2900 for a First return LHR-JFK, coming back a week later. Virgin Business is quoted at £4700.


In three months' time, AA First is £2900, AA Business £1400 and Virgin Business £2200.

Much of it's down to image. Flying Virgin is cool in the financial services community, which dominates premium class flying between London and New York. American is just another boring legacy carrier.

ellencraig

Btw I did take a Virgin train from London to York, it was decked out in Virgin colors, design, etc. I can see what you mean about the ubiquitous, pervasive branding.

Also, a tip for anyone flying American first class to Gatwick, and connecting: you can use the British Airways lounges. But be aware there are two: Terraces which is for ClubWorld, and then the true First lounge which is on the top floor. When we got our boarding passes in Dallas, they didn't make us aware of this, nor did the staff at the Terraces desk catch it. Only on my return flight did the desk staff send me to the true first lounge, which is quieter, more exclusive, better beverages, etc. Be aware though, they do not announce the boarding calls in the First lounge, to preserve the atmosphere of quiet. You need to keep an eye on the time and monitor the boards.

Flanneruk, I completely agree that American has the boring image. Too bad, because the space is SO much roomier, and includes a desk/chair set up if you swivel your chair perpendicular, facing the window, which is great for business travelers. This is what I mean about AA having serious potential here in the marketing regard that they are just not taking advantage of.

Ellen C.

W9London

One more gripe about VS in-flight "spa" service... Even though they say they offer manicure, they refused to re do my varnish--something to do with nail polish remover being highly inflammable (or something like that). Also, if you're lucky winner of the treatment, that can mean the flight attendant will wake you in the middle of your (precious) sleep.

Ellen, you really didn't miss much...

BTW, do they still give you that awful sleeper suit? So awkward to be spotted wearing that esp if you're travelling with colleagues...

wally34949

Because U.S. airlines are required to make a verbal announcement each time the status of the Fasten Seat Belt Sign changes, I would recommend Virgin.

ellencraig

They offered my pajamas, I declined and I didn't see anyone else in them so I can't comment. I did use the socks. (Again - Virgin colors!)

The spa attendant asked me both flights if I wished to be woken should she have an opening for me, and both times I said yes, please wake me. But no treatment. I know it's a lottery, but it seems a little weird. I think they should offer everyone a 5 minute treatment.

I can see their point about the polish remover. I don't like having flammable liquids in the same small space as coffee makers, ovens, etc.!

Would have liked a simple tidying-up manicure, though, and to relax and pass the time.

Has anyone noticed how "briskly" the Virgin Atlantic flight attendants walk? This did wake me up several times.

Ellen C.