Who is Laguna 92688 and why is he/she seem to be posting alarming safety warnings about Cape Town and Joburg?
Mar 7th, 2008, 02:52 AM
#21
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There have not been any land seizures in Zimbabwe?????
I am shocked to read that statement!! Not chased off by actual soldiers (perhaps war veterans??) but surely chased off their lands! Any many killed in the process. Or is all this a fabrication??
I am shocked to read that statement!! Not chased off by actual soldiers (perhaps war veterans??) but surely chased off their lands! Any many killed in the process. Or is all this a fabrication??
Mar 7th, 2008, 05:22 AM
#23
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Mar 7th, 2008, 06:13 AM
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To Poppins & Doogle
Nice that you start with yes there is crime blah bah…BUT.
Come on. It is so obvious that there are huge problems and you cannot compare it to normal crime around the world. You are obviously one the 5 % of people that have not been affected seriously by crime (no a stolen radio is not even considered crime in my books).
Graaf Reinet is a nice little town, but do you not remember what happened there a few months back with the killing spree? Even a well known place like Andries Stockenstroom the owner was stabbed about 5 times in the chest not so long ago and this is a small peaceful town as you say and I fully agree, so imagine what Johannesburg is like!
All I say is that people have all the info available to them on the internet. Everyone has been warned. When a tourist gets raped and infected with hiv or murdered at least they will only be able to blame people like you who make money off them coming to the country. I certainly will never tell someone to come as my conscience just would not allow it. S.A. is without a doubt the most beautiful country on earth and has everything. Zim was also beautiful and still is. Do you want to support it though for it’s beauty and few people who are really nice? Yes most of us live very well there as well but that is the same all over Africa. It definitely is not because there are jobs available. It is because people are resilient (almost too much so) and sort themselves out only. You know how many more people these days work for themselves or family, and even all the professionals working outside the country!
Someone mentioned that they are a believer that things will work out and be o.k. finally. My heart tells me the same thing, I have invested every last cent I own in South Africa and every single time I put in a little more my brain tells me NO! It is MY country though!
Doogle said:
“I do not see you reporting on crime anywhere else in the world, I could move to The States and my children would be shot in school as they have the highest rate of school killings, I could also be caught in a hurricane, tornado or earthquake, which we do not really have here either.”
I think as a South African you know yourself that this does not even make sense. What are the chances of your child being shot in an American school? You honestly feel your child is safer in S.A.? This is a ridiculous statement and you know it – you may not say so here though.
‘’I can go to England and live in a hole as I would not be able to afford a house like I have now. I could go to Australia as they have a similar climate and structure and still have the same traffic jam and small house”
On Jacaranda radio station they did a survey. 99% of the people living in Australia said they would never even consider going back to S.A. They all said in Aus they live a very similar life style to that of S.A. (climate, people etc.) except they feel safe.
I am really happy Laguna has been posting. It is refreshing that people are speaking out, even on this travel forum, at least then visitors can make informed decisions which is what it is all about at the end of the day.
To all future visitors to S.A. – Cape Town is not nearly as bad as Durban or Johannesburg and if you are going on safari it is even fine to drive yourself from Johannesburg to the east of the country. Just be aware and be careful, you will probably be o.k. The government has gone out of its way to protect tourists, just wish it was the same for us locals who are their bread and butter (and brains!)
Nice that you start with yes there is crime blah bah…BUT.
Come on. It is so obvious that there are huge problems and you cannot compare it to normal crime around the world. You are obviously one the 5 % of people that have not been affected seriously by crime (no a stolen radio is not even considered crime in my books).
Graaf Reinet is a nice little town, but do you not remember what happened there a few months back with the killing spree? Even a well known place like Andries Stockenstroom the owner was stabbed about 5 times in the chest not so long ago and this is a small peaceful town as you say and I fully agree, so imagine what Johannesburg is like!
All I say is that people have all the info available to them on the internet. Everyone has been warned. When a tourist gets raped and infected with hiv or murdered at least they will only be able to blame people like you who make money off them coming to the country. I certainly will never tell someone to come as my conscience just would not allow it. S.A. is without a doubt the most beautiful country on earth and has everything. Zim was also beautiful and still is. Do you want to support it though for it’s beauty and few people who are really nice? Yes most of us live very well there as well but that is the same all over Africa. It definitely is not because there are jobs available. It is because people are resilient (almost too much so) and sort themselves out only. You know how many more people these days work for themselves or family, and even all the professionals working outside the country!
Someone mentioned that they are a believer that things will work out and be o.k. finally. My heart tells me the same thing, I have invested every last cent I own in South Africa and every single time I put in a little more my brain tells me NO! It is MY country though!
Doogle said:
“I do not see you reporting on crime anywhere else in the world, I could move to The States and my children would be shot in school as they have the highest rate of school killings, I could also be caught in a hurricane, tornado or earthquake, which we do not really have here either.”
I think as a South African you know yourself that this does not even make sense. What are the chances of your child being shot in an American school? You honestly feel your child is safer in S.A.? This is a ridiculous statement and you know it – you may not say so here though.
‘’I can go to England and live in a hole as I would not be able to afford a house like I have now. I could go to Australia as they have a similar climate and structure and still have the same traffic jam and small house”
On Jacaranda radio station they did a survey. 99% of the people living in Australia said they would never even consider going back to S.A. They all said in Aus they live a very similar life style to that of S.A. (climate, people etc.) except they feel safe.
I am really happy Laguna has been posting. It is refreshing that people are speaking out, even on this travel forum, at least then visitors can make informed decisions which is what it is all about at the end of the day.
To all future visitors to S.A. – Cape Town is not nearly as bad as Durban or Johannesburg and if you are going on safari it is even fine to drive yourself from Johannesburg to the east of the country. Just be aware and be careful, you will probably be o.k. The government has gone out of its way to protect tourists, just wish it was the same for us locals who are their bread and butter (and brains!)
Mar 7th, 2008, 09:54 AM
#26
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Wow! On Forbes new release of the top billionaires in the world we have the new and first black South African listed. What an amazing acheivement. Read all about it in the local newspapers today but in all the articles it was stated that BEE was the main contributor. For those who do not know what BEE is it is Black Economic Empowerment, in other words its a law that our government passed stating that only blacks can hold top positions in the corporate business world irrespective of qualifications or ability.
Just another nail in South Africa's coffin.
Just another nail in South Africa's coffin.
Mar 7th, 2008, 11:53 AM
#27
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I feel that threads such as this one are a total waste of time especially when I read some of the utter drivel that has been broadcast by some. Thus I generally dont participate in threads like this anymore however a recent statement in this thread brings me back into the fold with a single mail just to put matters straight.
Safarichat you said that BEE is "a law that our government passed stating that only blacks can hold top positions in the corporate business world irrespective of qualifications or ability". You mean just like the minority white people who had no qualifications who used laws and the barrel of a gun to put white people into similar top positions thus making white SA millionaires. Of course a huge difference between BEE and how things happened in those days was that with BEE there is a sharing of the loot however in the old days the whites simply took all. How come you forgot about that? It wont surprise me if the next fact you probably will be telling us is that the white millionaires did a better job than todays black millionaires.
Just my twopence worth.
Very proudly part of the wonderful
nation of South Africa
Safarichat you said that BEE is "a law that our government passed stating that only blacks can hold top positions in the corporate business world irrespective of qualifications or ability". You mean just like the minority white people who had no qualifications who used laws and the barrel of a gun to put white people into similar top positions thus making white SA millionaires. Of course a huge difference between BEE and how things happened in those days was that with BEE there is a sharing of the loot however in the old days the whites simply took all. How come you forgot about that? It wont surprise me if the next fact you probably will be telling us is that the white millionaires did a better job than todays black millionaires.
Just my twopence worth.
Very proudly part of the wonderful
nation of South Africa
Mar 7th, 2008, 11:59 AM
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Just would like to add one more thing for thought.
In a true democracy of 46 million people how come the majority of them have to pass laws guaranteeing them jobs. Surely that is very anti-merit. I have to be honest but the balck population are the only race on earth who can only get anywhere in a democratic country by passing laws. They unfortunatelly cannot do it by merit.
Want a doctorate degree, it will cost you $10. Thats how it is done in Africa. So vote for them
In a true democracy of 46 million people how come the majority of them have to pass laws guaranteeing them jobs. Surely that is very anti-merit. I have to be honest but the balck population are the only race on earth who can only get anywhere in a democratic country by passing laws. They unfortunatelly cannot do it by merit.
Want a doctorate degree, it will cost you $10. Thats how it is done in Africa. So vote for them
Mar 7th, 2008, 12:10 PM
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Selwyn
Why is my brother living in America? I will tell you. Because he is the highest qualified doctor in the world and South Africa would not give him a position but the USA gave him a professorship and he is on his way.
Why is my brother living in America? I will tell you. Because he is the highest qualified doctor in the world and South Africa would not give him a position but the USA gave him a professorship and he is on his way.
Mar 7th, 2008, 01:02 PM
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Safarichat,
You wrote:
"have to be honest but the balck population are the only race on earth who can only get anywhere in a democratic country by passing laws. They unfortunatelly cannot do it by merit."
My answer to this is quite simple. My opinion is that the above as well as your other statements are absolute trash and blatantly racist. Furthermore I want nothing to do with anybody who displays such tendencies.
Selwyn Davidowitz
You wrote:
"have to be honest but the balck population are the only race on earth who can only get anywhere in a democratic country by passing laws. They unfortunatelly cannot do it by merit."
My answer to this is quite simple. My opinion is that the above as well as your other statements are absolute trash and blatantly racist. Furthermore I want nothing to do with anybody who displays such tendencies.
Selwyn Davidowitz
Mar 7th, 2008, 02:19 PM
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Safarichat,
The only reason why I am answering you is because maybe I should have made my feelings clear about AA and BEE from the word go.
In my opinion Affirmative Action (AA) or Black economic empowerment (BEE) is a manner of trying to redress all the wrongs that were done to people of colour in SA over 3 centuries before 1990. The situation was exacerbated more than normally during the period 1800 - 1990. During these time people of colour, by law, were given shocking schooling, not allowed to go to universities, were not allowed to open busineses as a matter of fact all that they could do was work for the white man at a pitiful wage while they were being treated like aninmals. In a nutshell they were exploited by white people to the hilt. Some black folk rose to the top like Mandela who was one of the very few who were allowed to study at terrible universities like Fort Hare etc. While all of this was happening the white man at the expense of the black man moved forward claiming to be so wonderful yet all he was doing was riding on the back of the black South African. Now that we are trying to attain a level of equality in this great country we need programmes like AA and BEE to fasttrack the re-dressing situation. Whatever you do dont tell me that AA does not work because the Afikaner in this country was the world chanpion of AA and BEE as he championed the cause in 1948 and it worked for him. Do yourself a favour and go read up South Africa's history and read about The Broederbond where you will see exactly what I mean. If you expect to see results from AA and BEE in 13 years of it being in existence you have got be crazy after all we are trying to undo 250 years of harm done. With that said if you see these factors as being such that it is the black South African trying to use the law to better himself because this is the only way that he can better himself you obviously do not understand that it remains a tool for him/her to improve themsleves and guess what by your mail the first Balck South African millionaires are now showing face. What bothers me is when you use language such as "this is the only way that Blacks can improve themselves" as I find this to be bigotted, unrealistic and most definitely racist.
As I have already said I want no more involvement in this debate as I find these type of discussions futile and wasting of my precious time. May I remind you that this is a <b>travel forum</b> and my belief is that if you want to discuss politics go to a political forum. There was a time when I was guilty of writing on this forum making it one of political discussion however in the past couple of months I have steered clear of this and stayed on travel issues hence this will be my last mail in response.
Safarichat you asked for my views on AA and BEE and you have got them. No more to be said from my side.
Selwyn Davidowitz
The only reason why I am answering you is because maybe I should have made my feelings clear about AA and BEE from the word go.
In my opinion Affirmative Action (AA) or Black economic empowerment (BEE) is a manner of trying to redress all the wrongs that were done to people of colour in SA over 3 centuries before 1990. The situation was exacerbated more than normally during the period 1800 - 1990. During these time people of colour, by law, were given shocking schooling, not allowed to go to universities, were not allowed to open busineses as a matter of fact all that they could do was work for the white man at a pitiful wage while they were being treated like aninmals. In a nutshell they were exploited by white people to the hilt. Some black folk rose to the top like Mandela who was one of the very few who were allowed to study at terrible universities like Fort Hare etc. While all of this was happening the white man at the expense of the black man moved forward claiming to be so wonderful yet all he was doing was riding on the back of the black South African. Now that we are trying to attain a level of equality in this great country we need programmes like AA and BEE to fasttrack the re-dressing situation. Whatever you do dont tell me that AA does not work because the Afikaner in this country was the world chanpion of AA and BEE as he championed the cause in 1948 and it worked for him. Do yourself a favour and go read up South Africa's history and read about The Broederbond where you will see exactly what I mean. If you expect to see results from AA and BEE in 13 years of it being in existence you have got be crazy after all we are trying to undo 250 years of harm done. With that said if you see these factors as being such that it is the black South African trying to use the law to better himself because this is the only way that he can better himself you obviously do not understand that it remains a tool for him/her to improve themsleves and guess what by your mail the first Balck South African millionaires are now showing face. What bothers me is when you use language such as "this is the only way that Blacks can improve themselves" as I find this to be bigotted, unrealistic and most definitely racist.
As I have already said I want no more involvement in this debate as I find these type of discussions futile and wasting of my precious time. May I remind you that this is a <b>travel forum</b> and my belief is that if you want to discuss politics go to a political forum. There was a time when I was guilty of writing on this forum making it one of political discussion however in the past couple of months I have steered clear of this and stayed on travel issues hence this will be my last mail in response.
Safarichat you asked for my views on AA and BEE and you have got them. No more to be said from my side.
Selwyn Davidowitz
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