i am putting together a ist time safari for me, DH, DD [19] and DS [16] and would be very grateful for any thoughts/comments on the following:

Day 1 - Nairobi to Samburu serena lodge - 3 nights

Day 4 - overland to Serena mountain lodge - 2 nights

Day 6 - overland to saravona lion hill lodge - 2 nights - for lake Nakuru game and bird viewing

Day 8 - overland to to Maasai Mara staying Mara Serena lodge - 3 nights

Day 11 - flight back to Nairobi

we are aiming at doing this for the end half of July 2007, hoping to catch the great migration.

The itinerary is being put together for us by eastern and southern safaris, well thought of here, I believe.

Are there any questions I should particularly ask? are there any alternatives i should be looking for?

Thanks to you all as ever

Regards

Ann

Mountain Lodge might only rate one night. Also, a lot of debate on this forum of Mt. Lodge versus the Ark. Might want to add a night somewhere else along the way. or add a day in the Mara.

E&S is a great choice for your tour operator. most competitive prices.

Are you flying or driving from Nairobi to the Samburu? A bit of a drive in a day but doable I hear. We flew.

We really enjoyed the Samburu and the Mara last August. My trip report:

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34868269

Best wishes,

Kevin

Ann,

I like how you are spending 3 nights (not 2) in Samburu and 2 nights (not 1) in Nakuru. I agree with Bill that Mountain Lodge could probably be a one nighter, but you'll find new things to look at on Day 2 that you didn't see on Day 1.

If you are open to flying, in addition to the Samburu flight, you could consider flying for the Nakuru-Mara part of the trip. But driving works too and I've done it to Samburu and Nakuru-Mara.

Since you specifically mentioned you wish to catch the migration; you are there at a good time for it; and your pattern is longer, rather than shorter stays; I'd suggest 4 nights in the Mara.
You could either add a day to your itinerary or take the Mountain Lodge day and put it in the Mara.

Alternatives--You may want to include a tented camp, perhaps in the Mara, since you have all lodges.

Every one of my suggestions increases the cost of your trip. If you make no changes to this itinerary, you'll have a great trip.

thanks starkerk and Lynn -

you've confirmed my thoughts that in the case of safaris, less [ie fewer stops] is more! Lots of itineraries seem to move you on virtually every day, something I know my kids would hate. The original trip had us spending one night less in each venue, and squeezing two more in as well.

i thought about spending longer at the Mara Serena, but then read a bad report of the food, which put me off a bit. I agree about trying to squeeze in a tented camp - i'll have to see what the costings are before I suggest it.
Lynn - do you know of a good, not too expensive tented camp we could fit in with this itinerary?

What would you do with one day in Nairobi and where would you stay - we are likely to arrive very early on our first morning, and I thought that it would be better to spend the day acclimatising before we set off.

Thanks as ever

Regards, Ann

We used E&S for part of our trip and we were happy with their service. They do use the covered mini vans for transport and I saw in one of your posts you were concerned about that. Some people like them some don’t. We were in a lot of different vehicles on our trip and I think my favorite was the Toyota landcruiser at Olonana.

I would consider flying to and from the Mara, we did and from what I hear it’s a rough drive. I’m really glad we flew, as we were not worn out from driving there to do long game drives. If you flew both ways then you would be in the camps vehicle when you get there and it would most likely be an open landrover or landcruiser but make sure you inquire if you take that route. Also in the mini van it's your own private vehicle but when in a camp's vehicle you can be with other people.

We very much liked the Ark and I think 2 days might be fun, when we were leaving the animals were still around the salt lick and I thought it would be peaceful to spend the day sitting out on the deck seeing who comes and goes. If you are still reading my post Kimburu posted about his recent stay at the Mountain Lodge on my post. Of course we were just there and you are planning July so totally different seasons.

Try to budget in a tented camp, they are wonderful.

Plenty to do in Nairobi for a day, Giraffe Center and Sheldrick Elephant Oraphange are 2 things. I can’t recommend a place to stay was we stayed with family.

I don't know the prices of the various tented camps. I've stayed at Little Governor's and thought it was great. The other less expensive place I stayed is no longer operating.

It went to e-gnu at this link because often they have prices listed, but the couple of camps I checked were "rates upon request."

http://www.e-gnu.com/searchAccRegion.asp

annhig

in Nairobi:
<b>Cheetah &quot;hug&quot; </b>
http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgMessa...xt=cheetah+hug
<b>Hugging the cheetahs at KWS</b>
http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgMessa...robi+day+tour+

if u search &quot;Nairobi day tour&quot; (search-box above) you'll find threads like:
<b>one day in Nairobi </b>
http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgMessa...xt=cheetah+hug
<b>Nairobi day trips -- prices okay?</b>
http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgMessa...robi+day+tour+

aby

Ann
if you give us more info, defining your interests (birding ???) expectations, inclinations etc', we can resketch things accordingly...

i agree with the others: one night at Mt. Lodge is usually enough &amp; the classic solution is adding a night at Mara - It is worthy undoubtedly (rarely have i used this term in my entire life - but when it comes to Mara ... )

If you decide to stay with your original plan - take a walk with a ranger in the forest !

<font color="green"> Other options (taking 1 night off Mt. lodge): </font>
<b>1-2 </b>one night in either Aberdares NP or Mt. Kenya NP (a 4X4 ascent to 3,000 meters 10,000feet Met Station a walk in the forest, Bamboo &amp; Afro-alpine belt - the latter for hikers )
<b>3 </b> Adding 1 night Baringo (+ a visit to Bororia on the way to Nakuru - since there are fewer flamongoes nowadays at Nakuru, Bogoria should be a great flamingo spectacle...
The order would be: ML-Samburu-Baringo-(via Bogoria?)Nakuru - Mara - NBI
<b>4 </b> Adding 1 night Naivasha.
(from climbing a volcano to boating among hippos, birding, walking among wildlife, horse riding, crater-lake etc')
see this thread &amp; the link in my post
http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgMessa...hText=Naivasha
<font color="gray"> a stay at Crater Lake camp can be quite an experience. meters from the crater-lake shore possibly with flamingoes, with Colobus monkeys around. paradise... </font>
<b>5 </b>on original it or the 'extra night in Mara' - Adding a few hours at Naivasha (boat + island walk) on the way from Mara
<b>6 </b> Sweetwaters (search!)
<b>7</b> One night in one of Laikipia's camps.
see this map - ML is No. 43; u can choose some close-by property
http://www.laikipia.org/map-of-laikipia.htm

you can search this forum for all of the above.

If long drives are tiring for you, consider all but No 3
If you'd like a better perspective of this country take No 3

my personal choice?
I'd add a fresh-water lake with a boat trip (some Fodorites r either bored or laughing)
either mountain + Naivasha on the way, or the Baringo option (the only off-the-beaten-track option)

i hope i haven't made it hard for you
aby

PS
Serena food is quite decent - don't let one opinion influence your decision.(&amp; first 2 days were OK...)
Serena has a great location (coming to see wildlife, i'd stay there for over a week with only rice on the menu!!)
Above all it is close to a river crossing!!! during migration u do have a chance to see what few Africa-addicts have seen &amp; all would love to

about the Ark vs. ML
i've been numerous times to both &amp; i have my own opinion - but on a one night sample it is not significant.
Once i was sorry i couldn't stay an extra night:
At Mt. Lodge a Buffalo was stuck in the mud ! i stayed awake the whole night' saw a hyena coming, then came a few... a few months later i returned &amp; asked about it. &quot;oh yeah, the next night came a clan of ~40 &amp; took the buffalo out of the swamp... in pieces...&quot; the answer was

If you're driving to Samburu, it'll take about 5.5 hours. The road isn't too bad except for the stretch past Isiolo (but that part is only the last hour or so). If you can only include one flight, then I think your choice of flying back to Nairobi is a good one. Mara to Nairobi is an overall rougher drive than Nairobi to Samburu, and you're likely to be more tired at the end of the trip.

Some of the less expensive camps in the Mara won't compare as well in terms of location to the Serena. That's partly why the Serena is so popular and gets booked up early.

You could try pricing Governors (Governors main camp will be less expensive than Little Governors) or Kichwa Tembo. Both of these camps will be more than the Serena, but I'm not sure how much more.

Also since you mentioned your vehicle concern in another thread, I think joeyi had a good idea. You could still drive the Nakuru-Mara leg and have your E&amp;S guide drop you off at your Mara lodge/camp (since you're already flying back) and use their vehicles for your game drives. If you do this, check what type(s) of vehicles are used at the lodges/camps you're considering if you have a specific preference as the configurations vary.

I hope you get to see the migration.

on No. 5 &quot;it&quot; = itinerary

Just read Aby's comment on Serena food being decent. That was certainly my recollection. Even better than decent. But I've never had a bad meal on safari.

Ann
just some corrections:
missed your flight back from Mara
in that case no Naivaha en route...

if one-nighters r a nightmare:
for options No. 1-2
switch to Ark for 2 nights &amp; have a one day tour of Aberdare

<b>Joyce</b> have you seen my beloved SUNI under the walkway at bird-feeding time ?

aby

Joyce - i meant at the Ark

Aby,

i think we missed the bird feeding time. we took the game drive up to the Ark so didn't get there til about 6 PM.
we did see the gennet at 9 pm, is that SUNI??

joyce

The suni is a very small antelope. I've only ever seen one at the Mt Kenya orphanage.

BTW I like aby's Ark idea since you could also spend the day touring Aberdare NP and visiting the various waterfalls. Look at some of the photos in kimburu's &quot;Going around Mt Kenya&quot; report to get an idea of what the park's like.

<b>Just read Aby's comment on Serena food being decent. That was certainly my recollection. Even better than decent. </b>

This is how I remember the Serena food too ... and the tangerine mousse was simply superb! This is for the Serenas in Tanzania (12 days at Manyara and Serengeti Serenas) plus a couple of decent lunches at the Ngorongoro Serena, so perhaps it's different in Kenya ...

Bill

Joyce
Suni is a rarely seen small forest antelope (kind of &quot;forest dikdik&quot.
used to see them regularly at the ark (under the walkway)
i wondered if they're still there

Bill
it's true the Serena has a certain food standard for the whole chain.
Any Serena would be better than Sopa, in most cases ... even if the chef at Mara Serena is new i wouldn't expect it to be something to complain about, let alone change a decision where one should stay

aby

Wow - thanks so much to all of you for all your efforts and info.
I'm not sure that I'm capable of taking it all in - i think i need a good map and a g &amp; t!

Pleased to read your comments on the Mara Serena - we we would be spending 3 nights there, bad food would have been a bit of a downer, but of course these things have to be kept in proportion.

As to the vehicle, i have e-mailed e &amp; S to ask about our using a land-rover/landcruiser instead of the mini-van but I agree that it has the advantage of being our own vehicle for game-viewing, rather than using those provided by the lodges.

Patty - thanks for the tip about tented camps - i will also ask them about staying at one tented camp, but i really like the idea of ending at the Mara Serena, from all I've read about it. - where else could we best fit that in? We are interested in birds as well as animals, and I would love to see the flamingos at Baroria [thanks, Aby - the OPs on this forum are so generous with their time and information]

Thanks again to y'all - i hope you'll be as patient with my next lot of queries!

Best wishes to you all,

Ann

Ann,

if you decide to book with E&amp;S let them know you are interested in birds. Our driver with them was Ben, i don't know if he is there best birder or not but he had an amazing knowledge of birds and showed and named us so many.

joyce