Tripadvisor is a lame website!!!

Hari -- that depends on what you're looking for.

Nyama,

I read a couple of threads over the weekend after the references to the tripadvisor site over here. Pretty lame, boring and in brief ..... tiresome!

Southern or East Africa?

I read a few Londolozi ones ...

I think Leely is right.

I would not be in favour of banning all agents/ operators/ commercially interested parties. Many of them provide valuable information that would be hard for the rest of us to access and do so without expectation or even hope of commercial payback. They participate because they share the passion for African travel that most regulars here share.

It's ridiculous to tar all of them with the same brush just because a few individuals are unable to behave responsibly, professionally, maturely.

I do like the idea of all professionals being indicated as such by a small character or letter by their username. I would expect this to cover agents, planners, consultants, operators, camp owners, guides/ trip leaders and anyone else who is anything more than a regular full-fare paying holiday maker.

But, as others have said, I'm happy with the forum as it is, with or without the above change. Anyone who takes everything they read on an internet forum at face value is naive, at best.

As for the ridiculous Rocco/ Julian saga I confess to no surprise whatsoever at the various shenanigans that have transpired. Infact, I was asked what I thought of the idea by one of the duo before the partnership was created and expressed serious doubts about the skills/ willingness of the other partner to really take the business and financial side seriously, by that I meant accounting procedures, invoicing, paperwork, auditing and so on. I was not surprised that the things I expressed worry about did turn out to be quite a problem nor that the dissolution of the partnership was, as a result, quite messy. I did find myself at one point increasingly irritated by the blatant self-promotion that was flooding the board, though that did, in fairness subside after complaints from a number of us regulars.

I did approach Timeless Africa when in the initial stages of planning my 2008 trip, as I wanted to give them a chance, but found that they simply did not have sufficient knowledge, let alone experience, to meet my needs.

I also contacted an operator who posts here but felt that there wasn't a genuine attempt to give me the trip I wanted and had asked for. I'd gone to this operator because of their experience with mobile safaris but they didn't seem keen to fit this into my itinerary.

I also contacted a safari-planner who posts on this board regularly, but does so because of a passion for Africa and genuine desire to help. Not to drum up business.

Eventually, I finalised the itinerary I wanted, leaving out the mobile safari.

Despite having been open from the start that I was working with two potential suppliers, when I came up with my final itinerary and asked the operator for a quote, they used the fact that the safari planner company (who responded more quickly) was already holding options in the same places as an excuse to bow out. Somewhat surprising as it's perfectly normal for two companies to be asked for quotes on an itinerary!

Anyway, I have now booked through said Fodorite safari planner and am very pleased with the service indeed.

I really think we should be careful NOT to throw out the baby with the bathwater here.

I also think it would be constructive if professionals continue to have posting privileges and also are identified in some manner.

The posting behaviors of individuals can often give clear clues to their behavior outside of this forum. Those travel professionals who tend loud, boorish, and not terribly good listeners in Fodors' forums are, in my view, likely to exhibit the same behaviors in the work lives.

I find that information to be extremely useful when choosing an agent or evaluating someone's recommendations.

I say keep the agents, many respect the rules and the ethos of the board and provide much valuable information. Had many of us and the Fodors editors been less willing to allow travellers to become agents trolling for custom on the board we would have witnessed less rancour.

A friendly question, Matt. What do you mean by 'less willing'? Some did speak out, many months ago; that <i> caused </i> rancour. And I remember picking one of our talented duo up for ridiculing other identifiable people he saw on safari (not by name, but by description, places and dates). In my mind, it was not only an unfair thing to do, but it was also foolish for a wannabe TA to make fun of potential clients in a public forum. I got precious little support for my complaint; most people seemed to think it was a heck of a lot of fun.

John

John, napamatt spoke about 'many of us'.

I would like to weigh in with my vote here - please <b>DON'T</b> ban the agents, the operators, the planners, the guys with Land Cruisers &amp; staff, or anyone else who is in the business.

Over the three years I have been participating, I have found <b>all </b> of them be a very valuable resource to this forum.

If someone has an ulterior motive to posting, then so be it - they are still giving valuable information when asked, and as we are very intelligent people, I am sure we can take that advice with a grain of salt and figure out if we would like to follow it not. What rizuto said is true - the personalities, likes and dislikes of all of the people that post regularily shows through. This gives us good insight into whether they are someone we would like to book with, or someone we would like to read their opinions on various camps, lodges, parks, etc.

It doesn't matter to me who gets a free trip, a discount, or whatever. But it does matter to me that without them we will be missing a very valuable resource, I find it amazing that in their busy lives that they will come on to this forum and give us advice when asked.

Just last week I searched through the trip report index to see if anyone had written about the Serena tented camp in the Serengeti - I came up with plenty of people who had, and checked them <b>all</b> out. But whose did I go to first? I went to Rocco's, not because he was an agent &amp; may have stayed there for cheaper, but because I knew that he would pull no punches and say it like it was. From here I judged for myself. And whose report did I go to first to see what kind of resorts were in Zanzibar when I was looking the other day for beach resorts? I went to Eben's Zanzibar report - again, not because he is an in-country outfitter, or because he may have got a good price at some, but because he took the time to write so much details about all of the ones he visited. And who did I go to for advice when I needed it on resorts open in May, or trip logistics? I went to Sandi, who as always, answered my questions with patience, knowledge and friendliness.

And for each of them , and ALL of the others I thank them and want them to know that this forum wouldn't be as good (or as much fun) without them.

Besides the fact that if you banned the agents, that wouldn't be very democratic of us, would it? The idea of the tag line underneath their name is an excellent one, that way everyone knows what kind of business they are in, but not a specific name which could be seen as advertising.

nyama,

You're right. I should have suggested that matt say 'if more of us had been less willing...' There were quite a few, but not enough (witness the hullabaloo when the duo were 'unfairly' suspended; good evidence that the 'few' were trying to push the proverbial uphill). There still are a few too many apologists. Still, Fodors seems to be starting to take more serious notice.

John