Ashley24

My parents are looking to plan a trip from Flint, Michigan to Seattle. Is Amtrak the best train? Should they go through Canada or the US? How long should the trip take to get there? Sleeping arrangements??? Price? Thanks for any help!

indytravel

www.amtrak.com will answer your price/time questions for the US.

www.viarail.com will do the same for Canadian trains.

Canadian trains will not go directly to Seattle like Amtrak. They'll go to Vancouver then a ferry, rental car, Amtrak or something else to get to Seattle.

I've never used Canada's rail.

I'm the "veteran" of 2 Amtrak trips. One was one-way from Chicago to Reno, NV. The other round trip from Chicago to Kansas City.

Though a fan of rail travel inherited from my Dad who loves it, Amtrak is really tough to do. I would NEVER do a trip straight through Midwest to the Pacific. It's almost 2 full days. That's 2 full days with the bathrooms getting more used, the snack bar food getting old, the risk of not getting into the dining car causing irritation.

When I went to Reno we stopped in Omaha and Denver to give ourselves a break.

I looked at cabins for my trips. It would have quadrupled the cost or more. Though if you have a cabin your meals are included so you can always get in the dining car. The bathrooms at that end of the train might be less used too though I don't know.

It can be done. You just need to be careful how you plan it. Maybe break it up with cabins to hold the costs down. Chicago to Minneapolis on Amtrak can be done during the day in regular seats. Then Minneapolis to Fargo(?) can be done with a cabin for sleeping. Next Fargo to Montana somewhere during the day in regular seats. Then Montana somewhere to Seattle in a cabin.

rkkwan

AMTRAK Train 365 Blue Water leaves Flint around 6:45 in the morning, connected to Empire Builder (#7), and one should arrive Seattle around 10:30am the third day. Total time about 52 hours.

VIA's Canadian takes 3 days to go from Toronto to Vancouver. Since it leaves 9am, they'll need to get to Toronto somehow from Flint the day before and overnight in Toronto. Theoretically, they can take the same 6:41am AMRAK down to Battle Creek, and then transfer to another AMTRAK, arriving in Detroit 2:24p. Find a way to get over to Windsor, and take the 5:30p VIA, arriving Toronto 9:20pm.

And then from Vancouver, there is one AMTRAK train that leaves 6pm and arrives in Seattle 10pm. (Or there are earlier buses).

So, if they want to take the train all the way through Canada, the total time will be about 4.5 days or about 100 hours. Twice as long as the AMTRAK route.

WICT_106

This trip can be done, it just takes a bit of patience. The landlord railroads (in this case, Canadian pacific RR & B.N.S.F. ) that own this route try to get Amtrak over the rails with only a minimum of frieght interference. The tracks are privately owned, and Amtrak is only the tenant. What this means is that sometimes your trip can be affected by matters that are well beyond Amtrak's control. For example, the frieght RRs do all of their own traffic control, as well as handling the dispatching of Amtrak trains over the route in question. Some railroad companies make every effort to collect every financial punctuality incentive that Amtrak offers, while certain other landlord RRs don't want Amtrak or any passenger operator anywhere near their rails. The landlords in question here are quite tolerant of Amtrak, unlike the landlord of the Sunset Limited route.

Generally speaking, this route has the highest amount of ridership of all the long-distance trains. It also has one of the best reputations for punctuality in the Amtrak long-distance system.
What I've done in the past is get off of the train at some of the longer stops, such as St. Paul, and walk around a bit on the platform and get a breath of fresh air. This also helps avoid the claustrophobic feelings and break the trip up a bit. I'd go ahead and get the sleeper for the route from Chicago to Seattle, however, that's just me, and I want to point out that the "roomette" (formerly known as "economy bedroom") is small, and really only suitable for one person. You put the bed in the down position and there will be no floor space. I'd also recommend that the travelers bring some reading material along as well, and a deck of cards.
I'm a veteran of several Amtrak "adventures," so I think I've pretty much experienced it all. I've also learned not to be a high-maintenance traveler, so it really depends upon your attitude. If you go on this trip with the attitude that nothig is going to ruffle your feathers, then Amtrak is for you. If you expect absolute perfection, perhaps you should go visit the American Orient Express, or Trains Unlimited
Tours. For either of these two, be prepared to pay top dollar (ie, prices that would make everything else look like a bargain).

The crew aboard the Empire Builder has been one of the most proficient and professional, in my experience. You should look forward to seeing the Big Sky Country, along with Glacier Nat'l Park. Best wishes.

WICT_106

I would like to point out that one trip isn't enough to make a sweeping generalization regarding rail travel. I've been on enough trips to realize that your experience can vary depending your own expectations, or what the crew is like (the crews switch off every 12 hours or so), or even what route you're on (recall my earlier post regarding the landlord railroads). YMMV. One train might be great, while the return might be different.

rkkwan

WICT_106 makes some excellent points.

The Empire Builder and the Southwest Chief (both mostly on BNSF) have faster schedules, and I haven't heard of significant delays on these two trains lately.

The Sunset Limited is the worst. Union Pacific have had severe problem moving trains on this route. Even the schedule is very slow already, most AMTRAK trains are still very late; often they have to turn trains around before arriving at the destination and bus/fly people there. Or other days, they simply cancel the train to "catch up" on the schedules.

The California Zephyr - on UP's "Overland" route doesn't have service problem, but the train is still slower than on BNSF.

For comparison, assuming the trains are on schedule, westbound:

BNSF:
Empire Builder - 2,206mi, 46:10, average 48mph
Southwest Chief - 2,258mi, 43:05, average 52mph

UP:
California Zephyr - 2,438mi, 52:49, average 46mph
Sunset Limited - 2,749mi, 66:55, average 41mph

WICT_106

Another thing that many folks fail to take into account is the sheer voume of freight on the North American rails. Some routes (such as the Sunset route from AZ to TX) are single track for large portions of the route. Also, many mainlines are very full if not overflowing with frieght. Thus, the landlord RRs can make Amtrak (the tenant, mind you) take the side track while their freight gets along the route. For some people this can take some getting used to. BNSF, over the Empire Builder's route, has double track for long stretches. They can accomodate many trains. The Sunset route, as of this date, has many trains as well, but is single track for long periods. UPRR has said that if Amtrak wants to get over that route in a timely fashion, Amtrak should reimburse them for the cost of the additional track installation. Amtrak has never had the funds in order to do that, so all the trains along the Sunset's route suffer.

traveler24

The Empire Builder is a wonderful trip. At least from Chicago to Seattle. I did stay in Fargo to see friends and then on to Seattle. I booked a coach seat and did o.k. but I was younger then!!!
The "roomette" I booked from Sacramento to Denver was NOT an actual "room" It was like two recliner chairs face to face (which were very comfortable) This made into a single bed at night...however the "other" bed was a pull down bunk bed --great for a child or small, very agile adult ....
Of course this increased the cost but did include meals.. Seniors get a 15 % discount...
It should be noted --Amtrak
has been cut TOTALLY out of the federal budget by President Bush!!!!
Without gov. help Amtrak ,already in financial trouble, will go bankrupt..
The Empire Builder will be the first to shut down....
Sad that a country as great as the USA cannot support train travel !!!

happytrailstoyou

Last year, with a friend who fears flying, I traveled round-trip between Seattle to Chicago on Amtrak. We had a small sleeping room, but we didn't get much sleep because the beds are not comfortable and the train rocks, rolls, stops and starts all night. The trip took two nights and three days each way and cost about $1,000 each. The only good thing about the trip is that my friend overcame the fear of flying.

indytravel

happytrails you had me laughing out loud!

happytrailstoyou

indytravel, I'm so happy at your reaction. I wrote something elsewhere that seemed to annoy some very creepy people who wanted to tell me their reaction.

WICT_106

happytrailstoyou: I've travelled across country by rail, and never had much trouble sleeping in the sleeping cars. In fact, I have more trouble sleeping on a plane or in an auto. As for the stopping and starts, the train stops at several places in the middle of the night. As fior the rocking and rolling, see my earleir posts, and also remember that car travel and air travel isn't always smooth either.

happytrailstoyou

WICT_106, My experience was different from yours. My trains rocked and rolled all over the place, not just at stops now and then.

Also, a bumpy air plane trip to Chicago would last four or five hours rather than three days.

Since I'm writing again, I should add that on the way out we had a waiter so surly that I reported him to management. As a result, I appeared at a hearing and later learned he was appropriately disciplined.

I did not report the porter who spent the trip from Seattle to Chicago hiding.

WICT_106

happytrails, I'm sorry to read of your experience, however, for the purposes of this thread, one must remember that one experience doens't represent the entire Amtrak system. I've had a wide spectrum of experiences on an Amtrak train - and they were all during one trip!

Again, I'm sorry to learn of your experience.

shouldidothis

hi i am palning on a trip by amtrack to chi to reno i have to go coach any idea what meals will cost

indytravel

Oh my. That's a long time on the train. Checking a random date the train leaves Chicago at 2:20pm and arrives at Reno 9:39am two days later. That's about 45 hours on the train.

First make sure you eat a nice, big lunch before you leave.

The snack car has hot and cold sandwiches, micro-waved pizzas, maybe a salad. All of these are in the $4 to $6 each range. Small bags of chips or pretzels around $1.50 I think beers were $4 and alcohol minis were $5 when I rode in September from Chicago to Kansas City.

Three of us ate in the dining car for dinner. Our total bill was around $80 including tip. The mains were $16 to $22 and included a salad. Our bill was a little more as I had wine. I didn't think it was too outrageous considering you're a captive audience.

Unfortunately in coach you can't count on getting into the dining car. People in first class with cabins have automatic reservations for the dining car. After that the seats left are given out first come/first serve in coach. When they run out, that's it. You're in the snack bar.

Since you said you're going coach take a cooler. Actually even if going first class take a cooler. Buy a cheap medium-to-small one and put a 6 pack of soda, some bottled water and a couple of sandwiches and some carrots in it. The ice should last at least 24 hours if you put enough in. Take some snacks too. Take a bottle of red wine that doesn't need chilled, a plastic cup and a cork screw if you like. This will save you from having to buy all your meals and drinks on the train.

I've not seen any limit to luggage. You seem to be able to take on all that you can handle. Unlike airplanes with the area at your feet clear at take off and landing, people on the train put coolers and small suitcases at their feet and use them as a footrest. Bring your own blanket and pillow too.

I saw a gentleman who had a great idea for long distance travel. At the back of the train was a kids' play area. He unrolled his sleeping bag there, stretched out in it and slept lying down. It looked much more comfortable than trying to sleep upright in a train seat.

happytrailstoyou

I don't like traveling by Amtrack, but I have no complaints about the food in the dining car. It is a much better value than the snack bar. Make reservations as soon as they are offered before each mal.