stay in florence or siena?
Nov 19th, 2008, 04:34 PM
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stay in florence or siena?
We will be in Italy in May 2009 and we are still trying to figure out our itinerary. Originally we were planning to skip Florence but we have since changed our minds and now we have a new dilemma.
We have been doing a lot of research and it seems like a lot of sites recommend staying in Siena and doing a day-trip to Florence as opposed to staying in Florence with a day-trip to Siena.
Any advice?
We have been doing a lot of research and it seems like a lot of sites recommend staying in Siena and doing a day-trip to Florence as opposed to staying in Florence with a day-trip to Siena.
Any advice?
Nov 19th, 2008, 04:44 PM
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Hi debrad149,
What's the rest of your itinerary? How many nights are you planning to spend in either Florence or Siena?
If you're travelling by train between cities, stay in Florence. If you're driving through Tuscany and want to keep your car, it might make sense to stay in Siena.
But I think people need to know the general gist of your entire trip before they can give any meaningful advice.
What's the rest of your itinerary? How many nights are you planning to spend in either Florence or Siena?
If you're travelling by train between cities, stay in Florence. If you're driving through Tuscany and want to keep your car, it might make sense to stay in Siena.
But I think people need to know the general gist of your entire trip before they can give any meaningful advice.
Nov 19th, 2008, 05:09 PM
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We are planning to travel by train between the cities, with stops in Rome, Florence/Siena, and Venice. The number of nights has not officially been determined but if I had to make a guess right now it would probably be two or three nights in Florence/Siena.
More than a couple sites actually used the word "mistake" when referring to staying in Florence and day-tripping to Siena. Is it really a "mistake?"
More than a couple sites actually used the word "mistake" when referring to staying in Florence and day-tripping to Siena. Is it really a "mistake?"
Nov 19th, 2008, 05:19 PM
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If you're only giving 3 days to Florence and Siena then stay in Florence as there is so much more to see. You can easily cover Siena sights in a day but try to arrive early as there will be a waiting line for the cathedral if you go too late. Take the bus between Florence and Siena as it brings you closer to the old city. The train station is a bit out of town. Siena is now very crowded (it used to be a sleepy town) but the campo is filled with tacky souvenir shops and bad restaurants.
I don't think it's a mistake to stay in Florence. I would love to spend a couple of weeks there.
I don't think it's a mistake to stay in Florence. I would love to spend a couple of weeks there.
Nov 19th, 2008, 06:06 PM
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I totally agree with adrienne.
It makes sense to stay in Florence if you're taking the train from Venice and then heading to Rome. You'll lose a lot of time getting to Siena, and then backtracking to Florence for a day.
Florence seems to be one of those cities that people either love or hate. I'm of the camp that loves it, although I can certainly understand the frustrations associated with Florence as well.
It is a small city with narrow streets and sidewalks, and tall stone buildings- not built for motor vehicles at all. And the crowds can get overwhelming at times. However- if you only daytrip to Florence, you will only experience the very worst of the crowds. Florence gets a lot of daytrippers.
I was there in April 2007 and found that the city was very different in the evenings and early mornings. For example, we had the Piazza della Signoria to ourselves at dusk, but at midday the piazza was was an ocean of tourists packed shoulder to shoulder.
I also found that, for the most part, tourists stay very much on the beaten path in Florence. There were parades of tourists walking the same routes to get to the sites and museums, but the little side streets would be empty. And the Oltrarno on the other side of the river was practically devoid of tourists.
It makes sense to stay in Florence if you're taking the train from Venice and then heading to Rome. You'll lose a lot of time getting to Siena, and then backtracking to Florence for a day.
Florence seems to be one of those cities that people either love or hate. I'm of the camp that loves it, although I can certainly understand the frustrations associated with Florence as well.
It is a small city with narrow streets and sidewalks, and tall stone buildings- not built for motor vehicles at all. And the crowds can get overwhelming at times. However- if you only daytrip to Florence, you will only experience the very worst of the crowds. Florence gets a lot of daytrippers.
I was there in April 2007 and found that the city was very different in the evenings and early mornings. For example, we had the Piazza della Signoria to ourselves at dusk, but at midday the piazza was was an ocean of tourists packed shoulder to shoulder.
I also found that, for the most part, tourists stay very much on the beaten path in Florence. There were parades of tourists walking the same routes to get to the sites and museums, but the little side streets would be empty. And the Oltrarno on the other side of the river was practically devoid of tourists.
Nov 19th, 2008, 06:14 PM
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We stayed 2 nights in both last summer. I was underwhelmed with both to tell you the truth but there is a lot more to see in Florence.
You can see Sienna in a half to full day. What Sienna does give you is some relief from the craziness of the cities. I did enjoy the smaller size and slower pace.
If you take the bus to Sienna, which I recommend, BE SURE the bus lets you off at Gramsci Station. It is much closer into town than the 1st bus stop. Two of us asked the driver if we were at Gramsci and he said yes--we were not and had to pay for a cab to take us up the steep hill. Gramsci is right across the street from a park (there will be a sign for the park over the entrance). You can walk from this bus station to the center of town and any of the hotels.
You can see Sienna in a half to full day. What Sienna does give you is some relief from the craziness of the cities. I did enjoy the smaller size and slower pace.
If you take the bus to Sienna, which I recommend, BE SURE the bus lets you off at Gramsci Station. It is much closer into town than the 1st bus stop. Two of us asked the driver if we were at Gramsci and he said yes--we were not and had to pay for a cab to take us up the steep hill. Gramsci is right across the street from a park (there will be a sign for the park over the entrance). You can walk from this bus station to the center of town and any of the hotels.
Nov 19th, 2008, 06:30 PM
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debrad149,
If you were tempted to skip Florence as your first impulse, I hope you don't mind my saying that it's possible that you are not going to Italy because you have a lifelong interest in Italian art or Renaissance history. Fair guess?
The cities could not be more different. Siena is a walled city that sits on a hill. Once you are inside the walls, most motor traffic is not allowed and you will see very little modern construction. There are no trees. You will feel enclosed by a centuries old stone city with a tumultous, violent past. Those walls were built and never taken for a reason. The dark, unbending past of Siena is reflected in its abundant art (and even its food and wine, to some extent!)
Firenze was THE city of the explosion of color and light that was the Renaissance and humanism. It sits in a valley, it has an important river running through it. It was a place of trade and flux, and it had its violence and dark figures too, but much of the art of the town still reflects a faith in the power of science, art and humanity. Because of that, Firenze has sprawled, its walls of come down, it's filled with motorcycle traffic and it has always hosted an international crowd.
There is NO WAY you can see all the major sights of Siena in half a day. There is NOT "more to see" in Firenze if you're fundamentally not interested.
If you think it would be a kick to feel like you aren't living in the 21st century, sleep in Siena. If you will feel embarassed if you come back home and have to admit you missed seeing 90 percent of the religious artworks in Firenze, stay in Firenze.
If you were tempted to skip Florence as your first impulse, I hope you don't mind my saying that it's possible that you are not going to Italy because you have a lifelong interest in Italian art or Renaissance history. Fair guess?
The cities could not be more different. Siena is a walled city that sits on a hill. Once you are inside the walls, most motor traffic is not allowed and you will see very little modern construction. There are no trees. You will feel enclosed by a centuries old stone city with a tumultous, violent past. Those walls were built and never taken for a reason. The dark, unbending past of Siena is reflected in its abundant art (and even its food and wine, to some extent!)
Firenze was THE city of the explosion of color and light that was the Renaissance and humanism. It sits in a valley, it has an important river running through it. It was a place of trade and flux, and it had its violence and dark figures too, but much of the art of the town still reflects a faith in the power of science, art and humanity. Because of that, Firenze has sprawled, its walls of come down, it's filled with motorcycle traffic and it has always hosted an international crowd.
There is NO WAY you can see all the major sights of Siena in half a day. There is NOT "more to see" in Firenze if you're fundamentally not interested.
If you think it would be a kick to feel like you aren't living in the 21st century, sleep in Siena. If you will feel embarassed if you come back home and have to admit you missed seeing 90 percent of the religious artworks in Firenze, stay in Firenze.
Nov 19th, 2008, 06:37 PM
#8
Debrad149, the only circumstance under which I'd recommend an Italy newbie stay in Siena rather than Florence is if you generally don't enjoy big cities or art and you will have a car with which to explore small Tuscan towns.
Then again, if it's only two nights (one full day), you'll be limited to whichever place you choose. No driving, no day trip.
Apres_Londee and anyone else who loves Florence, here's a new book I think you'll find interesting:
"Dark Water: Flood and Redemption in the City of Masterpieces" by Robert Clark. I'm only halfway through but can't put it down.
Then again, if it's only two nights (one full day), you'll be limited to whichever place you choose. No driving, no day trip.
Apres_Londee and anyone else who loves Florence, here's a new book I think you'll find interesting:
"Dark Water: Flood and Redemption in the City of Masterpieces" by Robert Clark. I'm only halfway through but can't put it down.
Nov 19th, 2008, 06:53 PM
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What on earth is an Italian "newbie"?
You don't have to start in kindergarten when you go to Italy and get promoted to the places you'll find more exciting. There is nothing difficult about either city. In fact, it's actually easier to be in Siena.
And why should somebody have to go to small Tuscan towns if they want the experience of staying in a medieval walled city?
Debrad149,
Is anybody in your group interested in horse racing? Siena does a bang up horse race in the middle of a stone piazza that consumes the town and many tourists get fascinated by it, even when the horses aren't running.
You don't have to start in kindergarten when you go to Italy and get promoted to the places you'll find more exciting. There is nothing difficult about either city. In fact, it's actually easier to be in Siena.
And why should somebody have to go to small Tuscan towns if they want the experience of staying in a medieval walled city?
Debrad149,
Is anybody in your group interested in horse racing? Siena does a bang up horse race in the middle of a stone piazza that consumes the town and many tourists get fascinated by it, even when the horses aren't running.
Nov 19th, 2008, 07:12 PM
#10
I didn't say Italian newbie. I said Italy newbie, as in someone who hasn't been to Italy before.
"You don't have to start in kindergarten when you go to Italy and get promoted to the places you'll find more exciting. There is nothing difficult about either city." I didn't say there was.
"And why should somebody have to go to small Tuscan towns if they want the experience of staying in a medieval walled city?" I didn't say that either.
Debrad149, the horse race Zeppole mentions (called Palio di Siena) is run only on July 2nd and August 16th, but there are Palio-related souvenirs available year round.
"You don't have to start in kindergarten when you go to Italy and get promoted to the places you'll find more exciting. There is nothing difficult about either city." I didn't say there was.
"And why should somebody have to go to small Tuscan towns if they want the experience of staying in a medieval walled city?" I didn't say that either.
Debrad149, the horse race Zeppole mentions (called Palio di Siena) is run only on July 2nd and August 16th, but there are Palio-related souvenirs available year round.
Nov 19th, 2008, 07:34 PM
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I have to agree with Apres_Londee and Adrienne. Florence in the evening at that time of the year is divine!! As is the other side of the Arno, where there are magical walks with stupendous views back towards Florence.
The first time we went to Florence it was a daytrippers and the heat and the crowds nearly put us off returning. This year we stayed in a little apartment about a 5 minute drive from the Duomo. We would do what we wanted to do in the day, head home and have an early dinner and freshen up. Then at about 7pm we would return to the centre and wander around the uncluttered streets in the cool of the evening - fabulous!! I would return in a heartbeat.
The first time we went to Florence it was a daytrippers and the heat and the crowds nearly put us off returning. This year we stayed in a little apartment about a 5 minute drive from the Duomo. We would do what we wanted to do in the day, head home and have an early dinner and freshen up. Then at about 7pm we would return to the centre and wander around the uncluttered streets in the cool of the evening - fabulous!! I would return in a heartbeat.
Nov 19th, 2008, 07:35 PM
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Sorry, forgot to add that this time we also did squeeze in a day trip to Sienna and that was enough for us. We've been there twice now and each time we loved it, but didn't feel the need to stay longer. Wish I'd known about the bus though as the train trip is a bit fiddly.
Nov 20th, 2008, 05:01 AM
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Jean, don't bypass my point. What difference does it make to the question posed about how many times some has been to Italy?
There really is this ideology that Italy has to be experienced a certain way that just never applies to other countries. First time travelers put up posts here all the time asking for advice about choosing between Nice or Provence, Madrid or Barcelona, Berlin or Munich, and they are not told that as "newbies" they ought to do this or that. What's the deal with Italy?
This especially the attitude foisted on American travelers, who don't seem to realize that the French, the British and Germans and Belgians come to Italy all the time and head straight for Puglia, or the Adriatic coast, or the Lakes. Or Chianti. Or Liguria. But Americans are told "Mind your ABC's! First Rome, Firenze and Venice, and then we'll talk about what your're interested in!"
I know. You didn't actually say that.
One of the worst of the many bad things Rick Steves has done has been to give people the impression that since Florence is crowded, hey, go to Siena! It's a bit like saying, if London is crowded, go to Edinburgh!
Siena and Firenze were the center and outgrowth of two utterly separate cultures. They are as different as New Orleans and Salt Lake City.
Somebody who isn't leaving until May 2009 has time to do a little more reading and gazing at picturebooks to figure out why they are going to Italy and what they hope to get out of it as a vacation or travel experience -- for themselves.
There really is this ideology that Italy has to be experienced a certain way that just never applies to other countries. First time travelers put up posts here all the time asking for advice about choosing between Nice or Provence, Madrid or Barcelona, Berlin or Munich, and they are not told that as "newbies" they ought to do this or that. What's the deal with Italy?
This especially the attitude foisted on American travelers, who don't seem to realize that the French, the British and Germans and Belgians come to Italy all the time and head straight for Puglia, or the Adriatic coast, or the Lakes. Or Chianti. Or Liguria. But Americans are told "Mind your ABC's! First Rome, Firenze and Venice, and then we'll talk about what your're interested in!"
I know. You didn't actually say that.
One of the worst of the many bad things Rick Steves has done has been to give people the impression that since Florence is crowded, hey, go to Siena! It's a bit like saying, if London is crowded, go to Edinburgh!
Siena and Firenze were the center and outgrowth of two utterly separate cultures. They are as different as New Orleans and Salt Lake City.
Somebody who isn't leaving until May 2009 has time to do a little more reading and gazing at picturebooks to figure out why they are going to Italy and what they hope to get out of it as a vacation or travel experience -- for themselves.
Nov 20th, 2008, 08:56 AM
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A couple of years ago I spent 3 nights. Both are very nice, and very different. Siena, being smaller and more medieval, is much more laid back. Florence is a gritty, busy place, but equally lovely in its own way. They are nothing alike, though. Siena's definitely prettier, in my book, but Florence has more to see, obviously.
You can't see everything in Siena in less than a day. Whoever said that must have had an extremely limited agenda.
You can't see everything in Siena in less than a day. Whoever said that must have had an extremely limited agenda.
Nov 20th, 2008, 10:27 AM
#15
Zeppole, I don't care if you disagree with me, but to elevate this to a debate ("don't bypass my point"
is silly. I have an opinion. You have an opinion. Neither of us is required to defend our point. The OP can take it all with a grain of salt and do whatever he/she wants to do.
is silly. I have an opinion. You have an opinion. Neither of us is required to defend our point. The OP can take it all with a grain of salt and do whatever he/she wants to do.
Nov 20th, 2008, 12:35 PM
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Wow...I didn't realize that my question would have caused such a strong response but I do appreciate all of the advice. There is a lot of information on the web and it can get a bit overwhelming!
Nov 20th, 2008, 01:29 PM
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Having stayed in both places, I would choose Florence, but if you're not at all interested in art, Siena is nice as well. What nobody has pointed out is that if you only have 2 nights, by the time you take the train from Rome, you'll only have a day and a half in the place you choose, so you really won't have time to go to the other one.
Nov 20th, 2008, 02:25 PM
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I vote for Florence with travel to Siena. Listen to the advice about taxis, busses, trains. Get a card from taxi driver so you can call if a stand isn't handy.
Don't want to get embroiled in any debate, but things are often famous for good reason and if it is your first trip, Florence should be on your itnerary IMHO.
But read about each place and see what "calls out" to you-go with your heart-Italy's going to steal it anyway!
Don't want to get embroiled in any debate, but things are often famous for good reason and if it is your first trip, Florence should be on your itnerary IMHO.
But read about each place and see what "calls out" to you-go with your heart-Italy's going to steal it anyway!
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