Thai traveler

The air pollution in Bangkok and Chiang Mai are incredible. Nothing you will read on this board or in the news media will prepare you for it. I am talking about eye burning, throat swelling, bad tasting air that allows you to only see a mile or two. I was prepared for bad air but it was beyond words.<BR><BR>I have lived in LA and New York City but have never seen anything like the air in Bangkok. Chiang Mai is bad but more like the worst day of the year in LA.<BR><BR>Has anyone else experienced the bad air in Thailand?

Breather

NOT AT ALL AND THIS INCLUDES BANGKOK & CHIANG MAI!

Tangata

I’m sitting here in my home in Chiangmai looking out the window. The sky is blue, the hills are plain to see and I can distinguish each individual tree. The cheddi at Wat Suthep is glistening in the sun.<BR><BR>Sure if you go downtown there will be a bit of traffic pollution about, but not “eye burning, throat swelling, bad tasting.” Tourists could do their bit to help by refusing to rent those nasty little two strokes.<BR><BR>Certainly Bangkok is worse, I lived there for ten years, but again not “eye burning, throat swelling, bad tasting.” <BR><BR>I suspect that this is a Troll that keeps coming back.<BR>

Kathie

Isn't this word for word what this same troll said about China? What possible reason would someone post this kind of misinformation on a travel board?<BR><BR>I, too, have traveled extensively in Thailand. Bangkok certainly does have air pollution, but it doesn't hold a candle to LA.

Apiwat

I am sitting in my office in Bangkok and today is a very clear day, hardly any pollution. <BR><BR>I sometime see tourists riding in Tuk - Tuk(open air vechile) taxi and they usually get a nose full of exhaust fume! I guess they read too much about the infamous Tuk - Tuk and want to experience it. Most cars nowadays operate on unleaded fuel here but the older buses(government own) are still polluting the street.<BR><BR>These are just big city problem which could be avoided if you use common sense. How about the US signing the Kyoto treaty to reduce GLOBAL pollution?<BR><BR>

Eric

Just returned from two weeks in Bangkok and I have to agree with the first poster, the air is terrible! Look from any high rise building and you see nothing but brown haze, fly into Bangkok and the air is a dark brown up to 5000 feet.<BR><BR>Those that say the air is OK are in the tourist business for Thailand!

deej

sounds like a troll to me. kevin under a different guise, perhaps?<BR><BR>u sure u went to chiang mai? i was there two weeks ago, and it was crystal clear.<BR>

Apiwat

Eric you can say what ever you like but I'm here in Bangkok right now and the air is quite good. I can't recall a time when the air is as bad as you've describe - may be the haze is from the thing you were smoking?

sarah rey

Sounds like the same old troll being re-written.

lisa

I agree that the air pollution is bad in Bangkok (which I have also experienced in other cities such as Athens), but I loved the city anyway. The point where I disagree with the first poster was the statement "Nothing you will read on this board or in the news media will prepare you for it." On the contrary, I think anyone who does the most minimal research & preparation should be aware that pollution is a problem in Bangkok. Having read in my guidebook that it can be a problem and heard about it from others who've been there, I took saline eye drops (I am a contact lens wearer) and that helped. The day after I arrived I did experience a sore throat which I attribute to the exhaust fumes. The pollution only really bothered me when I was walking on a sidewalk along a major street where there was a lot of traffic. I would not want to take tuk-tuks because of the exhaust. I don't know why anyone would deny that pollution in Bangkok is bad -- I noticed many locals (especially motorbikers, street sweepers & tuk-tuk drivers) wearing surgical-style masks over their mouths to protect them from breathing the exhaust. I would not let the pollution deter me from visiting Bangkok -- while undesirable, it is not intolerable, and it is something most people should be willing to put up with in exchange for the privilege of seeing the Grand Palace and experiencing this wonderful city. I can't wait to return. <BR>Why anyone would compare Bangkok to LA or New York I can't imagine. Bangkok is in a third world country. Pollution standards in most developed nations are higher than in less-developed ones, obviously.

LizF

AGREE with the first writer. The air is very bad in Bangkok and when I was there last I could not see the sky only an orange haze all over the place which smelt very bad. Yes it has one of the worst smog problems in the world and if anyone says otherwise they are either lying or are trying to make things sound better than they are. Not a good idea as people who go there will see for themselves and be very angry with the lies that they have been told. China is as bad and so is Manilla, Jakarta and KL.

Apiwat

LizF, please name the country that you think the air is acceptable. I must be blind living in Bangkok and not seeing what you saw!

kang

LizF :<BR><BR>When you said "China is as bad", did you realize that you were talking about a country with the size of the United States? How many Chinese places have you visited to make you feel comfortable for such an indiscriminated conclusion?<BR><BR>The air pollution problem is serious in some big Chinese cities. But even under the worst cases, I have never experienced anywher in China the kind of pollution you described, "I could not see the sky only an orange haze all over the place which smelt very bad". <BR><BR>Over exaggeration can only defeat the credibility of your own message.

Peter Neville-Hadley

I have no sympathy with the tone of the several recent negative postings all attacking Thailand in particular or Asia in general in very much the same language, and which are starting to look like some kind of poorly orchestrated campaign. But to a large degree I agree with Liza F, above. "I enjoyed China, but the pollution was awful," is a commonplace remark amongst those who have just returned, and Bangkok gets the same response.<BR><BR>It does no service to anyone to pretend that Thailand and China, and particularly the larger cities, are not very heavily polluted indeed. It does do good service to describe the reality and suggest ways to prepare for it, as well as to explain why a few days' exposure won't be harmful, and why the glories of these places make the visit worthwhile or even unforgettable for most visitors.<BR><BR>The World Watch Institute of Chicago drew up a list of the world's top ten most air-polluted cities, and nine of these were in China--Bangkok didn't even make the list--the other was in India. These also did not include Beijing, but this appears in the top ten of a World Bank list showing pollution in more general terms.<BR><BR>It isn't even just the cities which are the problem. Arriving in Beijing by train from Hong Kong the afternoon of the second day is spent in a kind of twilight caused by a general drifting greyness at ground level through which the sun shines with difficulty. The smoke stacks responsible, often from large cement or brick works, or from small village-level enterprises, can be seen through the haze. It comes and goes, but sometimes a midsummer day can seem like a mid-autumn one.<BR><BR>Even the Chinese government acknowledges to a certain degree the pollution problems it faces, constantly announcing new measures to deal with them (not that these are necessarily carried out).<BR><BR>None of this should stop visitors from going to China, and there remoter, less industrialised and less heavily populated corners which, although they may have polluted water and problems from deforestation, are still green and beautiful. <BR><BR>But although the original poster falsely suggested that there was no mention of these pollution difficulties on this board or elsewhere, he/she is quite right to mistrust the positive recommendations of those who for pride of race, nation, or home town, for political reasons, or for the purpose of selling tourism services, seek to deny a reality which is both well-documented, and which visitors can see with their own (slightly sore) eyes.<BR><BR>Having visited Thailand once, I'm considering a return visit this year. I've spent altogether about three years of my life in various parts of China. I would say that both countries well repay a visit, and the pollution, although regrettable, can be shrugged off by most visitors, and especially those who know what to expect.<BR><BR>Peter N-H<BR>http://members.axion.net/~pnh/China.html

kang

<BR><BR>Mr.Peter N-H:<BR><BR>When I responded to LizF, I was quoting what he/she implied that the entire China was terribly polluted, which I didn't agree and I knew it wasn't true. <BR><BR>I didn't "pretend that Thailand and China, and particularly the larger cities, are not very heavily polluted". To the contrary, I do agree that there are lots of problems. What I also know for a fact that the degree of the pollution in Beijing is far less severe than LizF had depicted. <BR><BR>You wrote a book about traveling in China and promoting it here. I guess you must really know what you are talking about. Tell me, in your good conscience, yes or no, that Beijing is indeed "I could not see the sky only an orange haze all over the place which smelt very bad". <BR><BR>Yes? No?

CJW

The air is bad in Bangkok....<BR><BR>Take the good with the bad......but don't be sooooooooo dramatic about it!<BR><BR>And to answer the question you asked:<BR>No, the air was like the rocky mountains when I was riding in that tuk-tuk when it was 90 degrees out and stuck in traffic<BR><BR><BR>

angie

The air in Thailand is bad, both in Bangkok and Chiang Mai, but if you know about ahead you can go and still have a wonderful trip. We just returned a few weeks ago, and I miss it already. I do recall many policemen and venders wearing masks because the air was bad. Hopefully most people will do lots of research before they leave o a trip so they won't be surprised by things like this. I was prepared and it didn't phase me(well one day in Bangkok was particularly bad) but that's one day out of three weeks. Don't let this stop you from taking the trip of a life time.

Lizf

Kang: <BR>This is what I wrote - copied and pasted<BR>(The air is very bad in Bangkok and when I was there last I could not see the sky only an orange haze all over the place which smelt very bad.) You are trying to split straws in intimating that I meant that ALL OVER CHINA THERE IS POLUTION and you are being rediculous. Maybe you think the air in Bangkok is acceptable but others from places without air polution( and I am one of those) find it unbearable. Same with the other cities in SE Asia. You don't see the filth in your street either - we do. You don't notice the stench of the waterways - we do. Things used to be bad in Singapore but they managed to clean up their city, so it is possible but unlikely unless you yourselves acknowledge that you have a problem.

kang

<BR><BR>LizF :<BR><BR>Here is your complete post:<BR><BR>"AGREE with the first writer. The air is very bad in Bangkok and when I was there last I could not see the sky only an orange haze all over the place which smelt very bad. Yes it has one of the worst smog problems in the world and if anyone says otherwise they are either lying or are trying to make things sound better than they are. Not a good idea as people who go there will see for themselves and be very angry with the lies that they have been told. China is as bad and so is Manilla, Jakarta and KL."<BR><BR>After talking about the "worst smog problems in the world" in Bangkok, you listed a few cities in SE and singled out one country, China, and labeled them all "as bad". Since the smog thing was the only theme in your whole message, I just had to conclude that you were refering China as a whole entity. Then came to my reply.<BR><BR>I am a software engineer and English is my second language. I am used to understanding things based on logic flow. If I misunderstood your post, I apologize. But next time when you write something, please try to use your own language a little bit more clearly so a poor foreign soul like me could better comprehend the true spirit of it.<BR><BR>Now back to your original post. I was in Bangkok once and stayed for three days. I liked the city and all three days I saw beautiful skies. How long had you stayed? Three minutes? Three hours? I am sorry I just have to refer to your original post again: Can you tell me, in your own good conscience, that "an orange haze all over the place which smelt very bad" was really the only thing you experienced in Bangkok? As for Mr. Peter N-H, tell me, yes or no.<BR><BR>Did I see filth in my street? you bet I did, and so did in every other countries in the world, except might be Australia since there is no air pollution in your home place. However, what troubles me the most is really the dirt in many's mind, the kind of arrogance, the kind of sense of sureriority, that is 100 times worse than all the filth in the world combined. Period.<BR><BR><BR>

wayne

To the "complainers": If you don't like a place, don't go there! Nobody's interested in your whining.